200 years is too long

[oldspice2625]

Careful, Evil D, I suggested similar and got chewed out by some people raging and all butthurt :P.

[Spacemunkey79]

Japan survived after 2 atomic bombs and are doing pretty well. The fact is that the survivors of the initial blast are going to be average joe, electricians, carpenters, police, mechanics; it's these types of people that would start the rebuilding of society and pass down that knowledge. Also to the poster who said we haven't changed culturally in 200 years, what? The 20th century alone saw massive cultural changes worldwide.

[tomomi1922]

Seriously, it seems like cultural evolution simply came to an abrupt halt after the bombs hit. I'm okay with lots of 50s stuff a little bit after the bombs but 200 YEARS?? Come on. Look at how much our culture has changed in only 50. There should be new music created by the people in the wasteland, new fashions, new buildings, new art, etc. But no. People are still listening to the same old thing, wearing the same old clothes, wearing the same 200 year old haircuts, using the same old technology. I know this isn't everyone like raiders or the institute. But look at the Triggermen! Were they trying to look exactly like the mafia or was it just a coincidence? Where is the innovation? I think 200 years is enough for the wasteland to not even be a "wasteland" anymore. The game should've been set maybe 50 years after the bombs hit. What do you guys think?

 

This is a reply to the original message.

 

The OP seems to forget that the Great War did not happen in the 1950s, but 2077. What bothers me (a little) is that the 50s culture lasted more than 100 years, good until 2077. Pinup arts didn't phase out, music stayed the same. I know Bethesda wants to have game with retro-scifi feel. But why must the Great War be at 2077? I didn't play FO1 and FO2 to know why. Maybe they were stuck by the setting made with previous time line. I know it does take time to build up fusion core and nuclear technology so it would take a good while from the real 1950s to move away from gasoline. But 2077?

 

I do agree that the landscape is supposed to change, to be greener. But people like the Triggerman .... they are a small group, they tend to stick to tradition, and most of their clothes are probably from a pre-war factory warehouse. Social evolution and fashion change would require a large body of the population to do so, especially with communication (that completely came to a halt with mere radio as a mean of mass media). The only thing abundant in FO4 is electric power thanks to fusion core technology.

 

But things did change. Raiders, being the most barbaric and primitive group of people, they live like cavemen with rags, leathers, pipe weapons, and armors made out of refrigerator's door. Diamond city, look at it. It doesn't scream retro. It screams "Waterworld" (if you ever watched that movie), and otherwise the slums of third world countries. Anything pretty is called "pre-war dresses" which probably came out of scavenging.

 

Consider this timeline on Wiki:

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline

Edited January 21, 2016 by tomomi1922

[tomomi1922]

Japan survived after 2 atomic bombs and are doing pretty well. The fact is that the survivors of the initial blast are going to be average joe, electricians, carpenters, police, mechanics; it's these types of people that would start the rebuilding of society and pass down that knowledge. Also to the poster who said we haven't changed culturally in 200 years, what? The 20th century alone saw massive cultural changes worldwide.

 

I also argue that culture and fashion should have had a more drastic change since the 1950s (current FO4 fashion) to 2077 (where supposedly the Great War ended everything).

 

But you can't use Japan as example. Beside radiation fallout, there was not a whole lot of difference between the destroyed Japanese cities and other cities after WW2, like Berlin. The problem is, the Great War wiped out 90%+ of the population. Thus it is called the apocalypse, like a zombie apocalypse (there seems to be tons of movies about it) where people lost everything civilized and everyone goes back to caveman life with no electricity, almost no car (eventually existing gasoline will run out), wear whatever they find, and eventually run out of bullets too. So it is already hard enough to re-establish some kind of social orders (like having a government, with police, doctor, school, an economic system completely with manufacturing and consuming). In fact, most of factions in FO4 have been trying to do the same.

 

So in a way we should appreciate our current society. It's no where near perfect, but mankinds have come a long way to have a socially stable world where we have defined moralities, values, and orders.

[TheOriginalEvilD]

Japan survived after 2 atomic bombs and are doing pretty well. The fact is that the survivors of the initial blast are going to be average joe, electricians, carpenters, police, mechanics; it's these types of people that would start the rebuilding of society and pass down that knowledge. Also to the poster who said we haven't changed culturally in 200 years, what? The 20th century alone saw massive cultural changes worldwide.

 

Well, Japan also doesn't have super mutants and ghouls or deathclaws and radscorpions. At what point do we just accept that this game is make believe and stop expecting it to be so true to real life?

[Spacemunkey79]

 

Japan survived after 2 atomic bombs and are doing pretty well. The fact is that the survivors of the initial blast are going to be average joe, electricians, carpenters, police, mechanics; it's these types of people that would start the rebuilding of society and pass down that knowledge. Also to the poster who said we haven't changed culturally in 200 years, what? The 20th century alone saw massive cultural changes worldwide.

 

I also argue that culture and fashion should have had a more drastic change since the 1950s (current FO4 fashion) to 2077 (where supposedly the Great War ended everything).

 

But you can't use Japan as example. Beside radiation fallout, there was not a whole lot of difference between the destroyed Japanese cities and other cities after WW2, like Berlin. The problem is, the Great War wiped out 90%+ of the population. Thus it is called the apocalypse, like a zombie apocalypse (there seems to be tons of movies about it) where people lost everything civilized and everyone goes back to caveman life with no electricity, almost no car (eventually existing gasoline will run out), wear whatever they find, and eventually run out of bullets too. So it is already hard enough to re-establish some kind of social orders (like having a government, with police, doctor, school, an economic system completely with manufacturing and consuming). In fact, most of factions in FO4 have been trying to do the same.

 

So in a way we should appreciate our current society. It's no where near perfect, but mankinds have come a long way to have a socially stable world where we have defined moralities, values, and orders.

 

The entire western united states has some form of rule of law, NCR, Legion, Mr. House etc so in the realm of the Fallout universe it is strictly Bethesda that feels that the world can't move on from the war. Had FO4 taken place at the same time as FO1 or shortly after the war I would buy the mad max theme, but it doesn't, so the lack of any real society just doesn't make sense given the amount of time that has passed. We could even use Bethesdas own lore, the Pitt is a prime example of 1 man forming some kind of societal structure out of chaos.I'm not saying that the Legion or Pitt are great but it shows progress in action which isn't present in FO4. Hand waving the fact that FO4 doesn't move the world forward by saying "bombs killed everything" just won't work, progress needs to happen or BGS needs to stop moving the timeline forward.

 

Well, Japan also doesn't have super mutants and ghouls or deathclaws and radscorpions. At what point do we just accept that this game is make believe and stop expecting it to be so true to real life?

 

I've already accepted that it's a shooting gallery player theme park and that a consistent world means nothing to Bethesda.

[Jasemyne]

Well, as survivors we'd doubtlessly guard the outer fence and not just the last cattle. Maybe we'd send out an armed rider to scout the neighboring ranch if we don't reach them via mobile radio anymore, but then only once. If they are dead over there, we'd take over and assimilate their resources. I know my father pretty well. If they are alive and friendly as before we would start a cooperative and send a rider to the next ranch (though never to a suspect village), my indigenous mother would be adamant and she always has the last word. In case of hostility due to the cataclysmic event of the bomb and the common deadly fear that inevitably follows the fallout for ages, well, the rider would never again return and we'd know by nightfall what's really going on out there. Our world then would become a fortified dot on the map until the last of us bites the dust in a world in which dying is probably much easier than living. That much on commonly hoped-for progress that is never ever to be enforced.

War, war never changes.