Synthetic truth?

[dark47]

Do Synths continue to respawn at University Point? That sure would be a nice area for a settlement.

[k361]

No idea been there only once, but hey here is something that gives me even more chills than some institute. Vault-Tec.

[Fatalmasterpiece]

 

There ARE people who have been replaced by synths in the commonwealth, their original human version murdered. There is an event in downtown Boston of a man randomly fighting... himself. You can find synth parts on one of them.

 

The Institute is actively murdering civilians and replacing them with synths. It's not obvious but rather hush hush in the game.

 

Hmm kinda doesn't make sense, claiming their goal is noble contradicts with what they actually do it seems. As to why would they murder people to replace them is beyond me, apart from rather twisted theory that Institute actually wants to populate the world with synths which is nonsense cause scientists wouldn't live long enough to enjoy whatever goal they set for themselves. I mean it won't take long for synths to take over given they are better than humans.

 

 

*Major spoilers ahead*

Their goal may be noble if you believe the ends justify the means. The Institute simple murders these people so that they can control more of the Commonwealth and further their agenda. The Mayor of Diamond City was murdered and replaced by a synth, in return Diamond City conveniently no longer investigates or interferes with the Institutes plans. Roger Warwick was replaced so that the Institute could use his farm to study plant growth on the surface and at the end of the experiment his family is to be "purged" of evidence.

 

So sure, the institute is noble if you are ok with murdering innocent people who get in your way, kidnapping unwilling test subjects, spreading FEV to create super mutants, withholding aid from surfacers, attacking any surfacer on sight (gen 1 synths), secretly manipulating people's lives to aid experiments and all sorts of other wonderful strategies that have proven so effective for other fascist regimes.

[CyrusAmell]

 

I actually always pick Institute at the end, not sure if out of habit by now, originally I rushed the game on first playthrough only now discovering things and searching through wasteland as I did ever since first Fallout:) In the beginning I picked Institute ending cause it sounded most logical to me, father has some solid claim and reasonings.

 

I interpreted it more as Father trying desperately to convince his parent that siding with the Institute was the right decision, regardless of all of the terrible things that could be traced to it. I mean, not to call the Institute Nazis, but if Hitler was trying to convince his father/mother that the Third Reich was what Germany needed he would not start by showing them the death camps, enslaved factory workers and terrible experiments being conducted on captives. He would show them the gleaming capital buildings, arrayed soldiers and happy children and say that everyone else they are fighting are in the wrong and should have nothing to fear (etc etc).

 

I mean, Father does quite a lot to try and convince you - including sending you to Libertalia to take down a synth that had been memory wiped by the Railroad and later become a dangerous raider leader (in truth: he had started out as a Minuteman and only became a raider out of desperation later). He even spoke of "innocent lives" being on the line (pfff).

 

The point I am trying to make is that Father would have a good reason to hide some of the more disreputable activities of the Institute from his parent when trying to convince him or her to join. It is his parent for goodness sake, can you blame him for trying? You know, beyond the whole let him or her wonder a raider infested Wasteland.

 

If you can accept the Institute for all its flaws as is, and the possibility for good it is capable of, then siding with them is not necessarily so evil as all that.

 

Helps if you can sack Justin Ayo in the sidequest "Plugging a Leak" - that is one step on the road to redemption I will happily take :smile:

Edited April 3, 2016 by CyrusAmell

[k361]

Yes well that is one part I didn't really understand. Shaun has been taken away when was but few months old, so there is no connection to his parents whatsoever given he doesn't even remember them, the only relation is DNA, so why would he even be bothered convincing someone like his biological mother, regret and "What If" honestly sounds like a whimsical moment decision rather than anything else. On top he chooses an incompetent and heavily biased person as his successor which equals the utter destruction of the institute no matter from what angle you look at it. Given how many lives were taken only to reach him, raiders etc etc I highly doubt he would expect his mother to actually listen to other scientists and rather taking the

"You object, you'll regret it" path. As hinted on first page F4 misses one more ending "When I look back what WE did in Commonwealth so far, perhaps it is time to let go finally." Though this ending is impossible to implement cause A - The PC would have to give up their search and B - In order to do so they would need to be aware of how much time has passed. Technically this is what Kellogg asks of you in Fort Hagen. But I know that's only me perhaps wishing for such alternative given that in many games when forced to choose from few options I tend to choose neither if I don't like them.

So, save for minutemen my option would be, dispatching RR, BoS and The Institute leaving the Minutemen and venturing onwards much like in original Fallout series. Besides given the PC knows the true perpetrator I'd focus on them...Vault-Tec.

Edited April 3, 2016 by k361

[CyrusAmell]

Unless Vault-Tec is waiting in the wings like the Enclave pre-Fallout 2, that last part is irrelevant.

 

I also do not understand what you find strange about a son wanting to convince his parent, who he is also hoping will succeed him as director, that his Institute is not all that bad. The fact of the matter is that it was simply bad story-telling for Bethesda to set it up in such a way that Shaun comes off as unreasonable no matter what.

 

He has said himself that he is old and that in his age he often looks back and considers "what might have been." And it is this "whimsical" notion that causes him to have his parent released from Cyro-Stasis to begin with.

 

Lastly, I fail to see how selecting the player as the new Director (in an precedent move by all accounts) constitutes destroying the Institute from "any angle" even if the player ensures the success of Phase 3 and wipes out the Institute's enemies. That is utterly nonsensical. Not only does Father believe in you, but a max approved X6-88 will also believe you have the potential to be the best leader the Institute has ever had. And of course, Mama Murphy has yet to be proven wrong with her Sight.

Edited April 3, 2016 by CyrusAmell

[k361]

Not talking about the player, this is kinda going to uncanny valley at the moment, but given the fact we pursue the institute for revenge the whole game...what would the character in question gain from siding with organization whom is directly responsible for the murder and abduction. Because you know, no matter how as a player may see it, the character is biased towards the Institute.

But let us drop this matter cause it is the player that makes the choices.

Yes let us set aside the point that Shaun was better off with Institute to begin with, much like his parents whom were omitted, that's fine.

Hmm about Vault-tec, I believe they are somewhere cause majority of vaults were set up as experimental interface areas rather than fallout shelters.

So I think there is someone whom must be evaluating them or there was someone at least. Fallout Tactics isn't canon, but is it really that weird to think that there is Vault Zero somewhere? Oh by the way I am not criticizing the Institute as I normally select that faction by default simply cause according to their technological level they have highest chance to survive, given the reactor won't go big-kaboom. I am rather trying to find some more in-depth meaning behind the whole set up. Though I am of course aware that if it wasn't for "What could have been done better" thing we would have played some different characters.

 

Also Mama Murphy reminds me of a character from Vampire Masquerade Bloodlines, whos name I forgot of course, but you meet her cca during first hour of gameplay and her ramblings will start to make sense once you delve deeper into the game, kinda like Mama Murphy she tells you crucial points of the game.

Edited April 5, 2016 by k361

[kingwilfre16]

Not talking about the player, this is kinda going to uncanny valley at the moment, but given the fact we pursue the institute for revenge the whole game...what would the character in question gain from siding with organization whom is directly responsible for the murder and abduction. Because you know, no matter how as a player may see it, the character is biased towards the Institute.

But let us drop this matter cause it is the player that makes the choices.

Yes let us set aside the point that Shaun was better off with Institute to begin with, much like his parents whom were omitted, that's fine.

Hmm about Vault-tec, I believe they are somewhere cause majority of vaults were set up as experimental interface areas rather than fallout shelters.

So I think there is someone whom must be evaluating them or there was someone at least. Fallout Tactics isn't canon, but is it really that weird to think that there is Vault Zero somewhere? Oh by the way I am not criticizing the Institute as I normally select that faction by default simply cause according to their technological level they have highest chance to survive, given the reactor won't go big-kaboom. I am rather trying to find some more in-depth meaning behind the whole set up. Though I am of course aware that if it wasn't for "What could have been done better" thing we would have played some different characters.

 

Also Mama Murphy reminds me of a character from Vampire Masquerade Bloodlines, whos name I forgot of course, but you meet her cca during first hour of gameplay and her ramblings will start to make sense once you delve deeper into the game, kinda like Mama Murphy she tells you crucial points of the game.

Rosa's her name, that game could really do with a remaster. http://vtmb.wikia.com/wiki/The_Santa_Monica_Thin_Bloods#Rosa

[robhartman9]

Y'all got on this boat for different reasons, but y'all come to the same place. So now I'm asking more of you than I have before. Maybe all. Sure as I know anything, I know this - they will try again. Maybe on another world, maybe on this very ground swept clean. A year from now, ten? They'll swing back to the belief that they can make people... better. And I do not hold to that. So no more runnin'. I aim to misbehave.

[k361]

Well Institute's policy is still pretty far from Vault-Tec whom we actually thank even for the great war.

Edited April 8, 2016 by k361