DDP MY MODS ARE DOWN, COMMENCE ATTACK ON BETHESDAS MAIN PLATFORM

[Reneer]

I just said...

 

sigh...

 

ignore consoles for just one second ok?

What if the same exact thing happened but on PC?

 

a**hole steals something. Puts it on Beth.Net.

Asks for donations. Gets money.

 

casual PC gamers donate, play, dont care.

 

What is your solution to this problem?

This has happened before. It is much, much easier to determine if your mod was stolen on the PC than it is on console. That is part of the problem - we can't open up a console mod and examine it like we can on the PC. When something like this (mod stealing) has happened in the past the mod authors / the modding community are generally very quick to squash it because it is easily verifiable by the authorities (be it Steam Workshop or Nexus) that something is amiss.

[HomicidalGrouse]

 

 

Edit: For clarification, I am not in any way shape or form endorsing the porting of content by people that are not the mod authors or directly affiliated with the mod authors. In other words, I am not endorsing mod piracy at all. I oppose mod piracy.

 

 

This is my view on the "poisoning" of mods and other nonsense that has been proposed to sabotage mods in the name of anti-piracy. It is also my general thoughts on how this whole disaster could possibly be "fixed". I will acknowledge ahead of time that it is not perfect.

 

Gabe Newell once said: “One thing that we have learned is that piracy is not a pricing issue. It’s a service issue. The easiest way to stop piracy is not by putting anti-piracy technology to work. It’s by giving those people a service that’s better than what they’re receiving from the pirates.”

 

For Gabe Newell and Steam/Valve it was a matter of ensuring games would reach markets quicker than they used to, thus, limiting the need to pirate the games you want to play. In addition to that, it was also a matter of pricing and sales. You can get games for less money than retail stores, and you get updates to your games that are harder to obtain on stolen copies.

 

For mod authors, the solution should be the similar. Pirates cannot support the mods. They lack the understanding to provide any customer service beyond uploading the pirated content. If a mod is something that can be ported then it should be ported.

 

If it is something that obviously wouldn't work on consoles or is forbidden by Bethesda, then it will be taken down anyway. This has already been proven to be true. Bethesda does not want mods that break their rules and will remove mods when they are reported, and has done so already.

 

If this approach is adopted, the people using the pirated versions will come to use the real versions over the pirated ones. Why? Because it is the superior version. It has the mod authors blessing, and official support for any bugs the mod may have (and they will have bugs). This has been proven by Valve to work, and it should work for mod authors too.

 

Another quote from Gabe Newell that is very applicable:

 

“The point was, the people who are telling you that Russians pirate everything are the people who wait six months to localize their product into Russia… So that, as far as we’re concerned, is asked and answered. It doesn’t take much in terms of providing a better service to make pirates a non-issue.”

 

Anyway, that is essentially my thoughts on this. I think it is a good solution. At least it is a lot better than trying to give the Nexus a bad name by attempting sabotage, joking or otherwise. Feel free to disagree.

 

I just wanted to quote this and bring it forward as it states my general views on this situation perfectly.

 

The truth of the matter is console mods aren't going anywhere. We, as mod authors, (I know I only currently have one basic mod available, shut up :tongue: ) need to accept that fact.

 

I always held the Nexus community to a higher standard. Especially after the whole paid-mods fiasco, but now I'm just facing this site with a swelling sense of disappointment. There's a huge difference taking a stand and defending your principles, and just being malicious.

 

The amount of vitriol I see on this site, reddit, and youtube surrounding "console gamers" and dumping the entirety of blame on them, whether it's for the actions of thieves, or the mere fact that Bethesda had the nerve to give them mods, is mind boggling to me. There's a lot of bad blood going around and for what? Because we choose to play video games on different hardware?

 

If you want to remove mods. Fine. Do what you have to do. If you want to stop making mods for consoles. Fine. Do what you have to do. But this discussion of maliciously trying to corrupt saves and the like of other gamers (the majority of which likely don't know when they're downloading something that's stolen anyway) really rubs me the wrong way.

 

Every single person in this community was new to modding once. I urge everyone to remember that.

 

But... hate and vitriol make the world go round. PC and console gamers alike are banding together to throw as much hate as we can at the thieves and Bethesda, because they're the ones at fault. The DRM just gets the ignorant masses to give a crap about who they're getting their mods from.

 

 

Yes. Hate the thieves. They deserve the hate.

 

The entire console community, on the other hand, does not. That's the point I'm trying to make.

 

And when it comes down to it, I still believe in what the poster that I quoted said. If a mod CAN be released on consoles, then it probably should be. Of course, a mod author is well within their rights to decide what platform they're releasing a mod on, but not releasing a mod that can be released on consoles on those platforms is indeed inviting thievery.

 

I shouldn't have to say this (I actually really hate that I have to say this part, tbh, but the internet has gotten so... ugh...), but I am not excusing or defending the actions of thieves. At all. I know some people like to twist realist philosophy and critical thinking into "why are you victim-blaming!?", but that's generally not the case.

 

When it comes down to it, you shouldn't leave your car unlocked in a bad neighborhood. You're asking to have your stereo stolen. It sucks when it happens, but there's no logical reason not to lock your car in a bad neighborhood.

 

The only mod I've made requires an esp and I used the basic functionality of the CK to make it. I uploaded it to Bethnet because A: I don't have a problem with supporting consoles, and B: in the off chance someone did want to steal it (however unlikely), it makes it so much easier for me to say "Look Bethesda, I posted it first!". My next mod will probably get released on Bethnet before I even upload it here... just for that additional layer of pseudo-security.

 

I don't like the situation more than anyone else, and I definitely want to see improvements made to Bethnet. I am not, however, going to try to turn my mods into Trojan Horses, or talk trash about an entire gaming community. I stand 100% with Elianora on this issue.

[WiIIPWN4KFC]

 

 

Yes. Hate the thieves. They deserve the hate.

 

The entire console community, on the other hand, does not. That's the point I'm trying to make.

 

And when it comes down to it, I still believe in what the poster that I quoted said. If a mod CAN be released on consoles, then it probably should be. Of course, a mod author is well within their rights to decide what platform they're releasing a mod on, but not releasing a mod that can be released on consoles on those platforms is indeed inviting thievery.

 

I shouldn't have to say this (I actually really hate that I have to say this part, tbh, but the internet has gotten so... ugh...), but I am not excusing or defending the actions of thieves. At all. I know some people like to twist realist philosophy and critical thinking into "why are you victim-blaming!?", but that's generally not the case.

 

When it comes down to it, you shouldn't leave your car unlocked in a bad neighborhood. You're asking to have your stereo stolen. It sucks when it happens, but there's no logical reason not to lock your car in a bad neighborhood.

 

The only mod I've made requires an esp and I used the basic functionality of the CK to make it. I uploaded it to Bethnet because A: I don't have a problem with supporting consoles, and B: in the off chance someone did want to steal it (however unlikely), it makes it so much easier for me to say "Look Bethesda, I posted it first!". My next mod will probably get released on Bethnet before I even upload it here... just for that additional layer of pseudo-security.

 

I don't like the situation more than anyone else, and I definitely want to see improvements made to Bethnet. I am not, however, going to try to turn my mods into Trojan Horses, or talk trash about an entire gaming community. I stand 100% with Elianora on this issue.

 

I think the issue for most mods isn't whether or not they can be run on the xbox, but how many issues running them on the xbox creates. In this case, simply "stealing" the mod and reuploading it on Bethesda.net can cause more harm than displaying a message then crashing the game if it's being run on a console before a port is ready. Remember, you can always uninstall mods.

Edited June 9, 2016 by WiIIPWN4KFC

[Derrick93]

why don't make all the code dependent of a debug fuction? for example like this

If Debug.GetPlatformName() == "PC"
; do bla bla bla bla bla etc...

 

 

 

this way the mod on console should not work becouse the debug function is disabled.

[ashtonx]

I just said...

 

sigh...

 

ignore consoles for just one second ok?

What if the same exact thing happened but on PC?

 

a**hole steals something. Puts it on Beth.Net.

Asks for donations. Gets money.

 

casual PC gamers donate, play, dont care.

 

What is your solution to this problem?

 

Happened with paid mods, the whole crap caused incredible amount of shitstorm.

 

Speaking of which, i'm surprised bethesda didn't start paid modding service with launch of f4. Clearly they missed the point back then, it wasn't about paid mods but about them slamming in their penis into an ecosystem and causing a mess, i mean sure throwing paid mods could've started some outrage from people but if the platform was good and it started with game release it would die quick and wouldn't have support of people pissed off since their mods are disappearing.

 

Guess some execs decided they can't make money on mods for pc and that's why they brought it to consoles, without thinking about consequences of crappy platform once again.

 

[Eidius]

 

I just said...

 

sigh...

 

ignore consoles for just one second ok?

What if the same exact thing happened but on PC?

 

a**hole steals something. Puts it on Beth.Net.

Asks for donations. Gets money.

 

casual PC gamers donate, play, dont care.

 

What is your solution to this problem?

PC gamers use Bethesda.net to get their mods? Holy crap I didn't even think of that. Umm... Oh yeah, put boobs in it! Are you sure you're not making up a problem that doesn't exist? Like that voter ID fraud thing?

Um...... What?

The system that beth created works for all 3 platforms so I am not sure why you are dismissing what I said.

[ashtonx]

Um...... What?

The system that beth created works for all 3 platforms so I am not sure why you are dismissing what I said.

 

Well ms has a store with games, doesn't mean people use it. Not after gfwl.

[youbetterwork]

I didn't read this thread, so it may have been said already, but having lived during (and been horribly affected by) the AIDS crisis of the 1980's, I find your choice of words to be disappointing and rude.

 

I consider you a gifted wizard of modding, and you've given me hours of entertainment.

 

However, I do ask you to please refrain from using a deeply personal pain for your rants.

 

~youbetterwork

[MasterMagnus]

I'm still waiting for my pie... Did little Elmo get banned?

 

And regarding that 25 minute plum pie DRM.

 

From my years in software development: "I did it in 25 minutes, it was easy" == Junior Intern Programmer's FAMOUS LAST WORDS

 

"I did it in 25 minutes, it was easy"

 

One more time keeping in mind this is the DRM you're going to use for Nexus "I did it in 25 minutes, it was easy"

 

Can't wait to see how that pie turns out LMAO.

[Zaklex55]

I posted this in the other thread about the fix to the solution...since it's really the easiest one out there, though not the cheapest, but when you compare cost vs income, it's like a drop in the bucket: "The best solution, and the one Bethesda should have started with was vetting, as much money as they make off of their games because of extra sales due to modding they can afford a 3 person team(that's all you need in reality) to vet, approve and upload mods for consoles on their site. Would consolers have to wait a longer amount of time to get mods, yes, but then they should also be sure that it wouldn't be stolen property and most likely has been optimized to work on the console version. That is the only smart and equitable solution that Bethesda has and the one they should have started with from the beginning."