The Civil War - I'm Clueless

[justwannaddl]

From what I read, the only thing the White-Gold Concordat proved was how weak and out of touch the leadership of the empire was. The Empire basically tried to sell out half of Hammerfell only for it to secede and kick out the invaders. I wouldn't be surprised if the real reason the Thalmor forced the no Talos condition was so that they can further weaken the Empire with the inevitable infighting that followed. After all, why commit troops and resources to destroy the empire when a screwy treaty will cause it to disintegrate on its own? The empire would have been better off giving the elves the whole of Hammerfell than agreeing with the no Talos clause. Hammerfell would have still seceded but they would have avoided the whole Talos related mess in Skyrim. Edited November 16, 2011 by justwannaddl

[Snowsong]

This thread has been fascinating.

 

I'm playing a Nord, so I sided with the Stormcloaks. I just joined in the take-over of Whiterun. I have a house there. I haven't gone back to see if my house is still standing yet. LOL. :tongue: Our next target is to take over Falkreath.

[Dambuster]

I think joining either will be one of the last things I do, I would rather not have a massively changed Skyrim before I've really explored it.

[crippledorphan]

I am a nord and a follower of talos so it's stormcloaks for me except I didn't know I could follow the other stormcloaks in the beginning so I hope that didn't condem me to be on the imperial side

 

But as others have said I wish to partake in the war after I have at the very least destroyed alduin

[Lachdonin]

Crippled, you can still side with the Stormcloaks. You only lose the option once you actually join the Legion in Solitude.

 

Of note, however... The Alduin Prophesy says that it's the act of the Sons of Skyrim turning on eachother which awakens Alduin. This mean the Stormcloaks are the ones responsible for the return of the Dragons, since they are the ones who started the civil war.

[HiddenRanger]

Those Imperial bastards tried to kill me for no reason, without so much as a trial, why would I ever want to side with them?

 

Thats why you follow the stormcloaks while escaping the dragon, kill the witch of an officer that was going to have you killed, and then join the empire later on :dance:

[PrincessOfFlorin]

It's a huge mistake to outlaw a religion. People get downright testy about it. WRT it being the fault of the Stormcloaks that Alduin has returned, I'm not buying it. The high king who went along with outlawing the Nords' traditional religion make the first move of aggression against his own people.

 

But like I said upthread, neither side is innocent. For my character (this time around) siding with the Stormcloaks is a matter of honor. She's a Nord who learned to worship Talos from her parents. In fact, she was crossing the border to bring her father's ashes back home for burial. Now the ashes are gone, thrown out like trash by the filthy Imperials. Clearly, vengeance is called for.

[xaanos]

After finding out ulfric was a dormant thalmor agent I was kinda angry at him. But maybe at one point he realized this was not just another faction wanting control they wanted to enslave all of men and changed sides. That and it mentions in a book that a Nord army was winning against the dominion to some extent only the imperial legion was losing badly. It is possible that cyrodill could have been lost for a time but it is possible it could have been retaken by the armies of skyrim.

 

From a military standpoint I doubt a invasion of skyrim would work well for the elves. 1 any one that apposed the storm cloaks before would defiantly change sides. Look at real life military history think of skyrim as Russia it is cold and has a lot of mountain defensive positions . I also wonder what is really happening in cyrodill I doubt the empire would help a skyrim invasion if the nord army's started taking victories I could see the Empire joining them for the greater good. Or a new hero like Talos retaking the content for mankind and destroying the elven empire. I know Elsweyr sides with the dominion but The elves do not think highly of the Khajiit or the Argonians I could see rebellions starting there against the dominion.

[Lachdonin]

I actually read an interesting book in Skyrim just this morning, talking about the "Talos Mistake" and it got me thinking. Primarily, there is no evidence that Talos actually ascended to godhood. In fact, with the exception of Akatosh, none of the Aedra interact with mundus (Because they are, actually, not divine*).

 

As such, i tend to subscribe more and more with the idea that Talos was never a god. He may have been taken to the side of the gods, but theres no indication, beyond the blessings of his shrines and his blood in Oblivion, that he has any power at all. The Shrines can be easially explained in context of enchanting. The blood, as we know from Skyrim, is a blessing from Akatosh, and thus it's the Dragon God's blessing that has the divine characteristics and not Talos himself.

 

The Dominion seem to accept that Talos was a great hero, but beleive that his worship detracts from the worship of the true gods, the Aedra, and i'm tempted to agree with them.

 

 

* Acording to the creation myths of the TES game, the Aedra were orriginally indistinguishable from the Daedra, but under the prompting of Lorkhan gave up their divinity to create the world, perminantly trapping themselves within their own domans. As such, the Daedra Princes are technicly more powerful than any of the gods.

 

 

 

------------- Edit

 

Also, if Alvor is to be beleived, it was only Ulfric's demands that Talos be openly worshiped that caused the Empire to actually enforce the White Gold Concordant. Prior to him stirring things up and calling attention to it, everyone worshiped Talos anyway, without any problems with the Thalmor.

Edited November 17, 2011 by Lachdonin

[justwannaddl]

I do believe that Akatosh would refute your claim that Aedra are weaker than Daedra considering the beating he gave Mehrunes Dagon. It's more like they are simply more limited in how they can interact with the world.

 

As for the Aedra not being divine, they are divine. They had a direct hand in empowering the divine crusader in the Knights of the Nine add-on including Talos. Even if the shrines and blood are discounted, the power you recieve for the final confrontation in the add-on was given by Talos, a feat that is pretty much restricted to gods and they're agents in Oblivion.

 

I doubt the dominion sees Talos as a great hero. They are revisionist elf nazis who initially gained power by stealing credit for solving the Oblivion crisis in the summerset isles. Given the chance, they'd rewrite the enslavemwnt of humanity as the civilizing of a barbaric child race. The Thalmor are murderous scum who assasinated chancellor Ocato and engages in ethnic cleansing/purges of political dissidents.

 

At best the book you read was just an attempt to placate the citizens during a bad situation. At worst, it was a first step in revising history and a clear capitulation to an enemy the weak emporer didn't have the spine to resist. It was textbook appeasement. Titus II will not be remembered fondly.