The Elder Scrolls: Moon and Star

[amtrack]

If you have a hard time understanding this, I suggest you ask an attorney with Entertainment Copyright Law experience about it.

 

I apologize, when I said "It is a confusing matter", I never meant that I do not understand: But the thing itself is a mess.

There is no single-model that you could get sued for. Modelling the tower in the Imperial City? What, a normal tower?

Modelling Akatosh? What, a dragon? Modelling .. etc.. etc.

 

 

Cheers,

Matth

 

Disclaimer: All the explanation isn't directed at you per se, as you understand already. But for those who don't "get it" here it is...

 

I dont think that was the issue though. A modder can probably get away with borrowing textures or models from Oblivion or Morrowind, heck probably even sounds. Unless there was a legal restriction on Bethesda's side, I can't imagine they'd create a stink about it. The problem is recreating the game itself, which is very obvious copyright infringement. You could, theoretically, create an original rendition of Vvardenfell with no problems. Modelling isn't really the issue, you could probably create the entire universe. Once you start copy/pasting storyline, quests, characters, and the like, that is when Bethesda will call in their lawyers. While the individual models themselves are not copyrighted, the story *is* an original work and cannot be placed within *any* mod for *any* reason. This includes characters, dialogue, maybe sounds, and any/all events that take place within the game. And yes, stories, like books, are copyrighted. Its the same as how lyrics from songs are copyrighted, or notes from music compositions are copyrighted. That is where the legal problem is imo.

 

Though realistically, Bethesda can raise issues of copyright infringement for models *or* ideas. Thats just how the law works, people with money and power will have the law on their side. You really don't think they could raise copyright issues over a model? Unless modders are packing expensive lawyers, you better believe that Bethesda will win that battle every time. The same goes for ideas, though to be frank Bethesda has never gone that route to my knowledge. Either way, recreating Morrowind as a game is illegal on counts of piracy and copyright infringement. It is the intellectual property of Bethesda, and as such, cannot be resdistributed by anyone for any reason. All in all this project isn't happening. Two suggestions:

 

1) Create an original Morrowind set in the current timeline. Recreate new factions with new quest and new storylines. Also create any forms of wildlife to be consistent with the changes Morrowind has gone through the past 400 years or so. This can include new monsters altogether, or different forms of existing monsters in past Morrowind or current Skyrim. While equally as ambitious, it is at least within the realm of law and, imo, *much* more interesting than a remake.

 

2) Recreate a portion of Morrowind in an alternate timeline (ie past Morrowind). Again use original quests (or borrow from past mods) to relive certain aspects of the storyline (though without porting the story content, just reference the event). This is more shaky depending on what you do, and do tread lightly on this one, but it still allows the experience of original content within the realm of Morrowind as it once existed.

 

Anything else is flat-out illegal. Sorry to rain on the parade. I'd rather not see a leader waste a team's time, and whoever is spearheading this project should have been very aware of copyright infringement.

 

 

 

TL;DR- Recreating the original game is illegal. Obviously. See suggestions above or abandon the project altogether.

[dianacat777]

Ignoring copyright infringement altogether... having Morrowind as it was in TES III in Skyrim would be a time paradox. 200 years has passed. The same quests wouldn't be available, because they'd have already been done by a certain wandering hero two centuries prior (Hey, you could have the Nerevarine show up somewhere; after all, he/she did vanish, but the Nerevarine is still immortal...) Perhaps I'm missing the point of this mod, but it seems to me like the quests couldn't feasibly be an issue.

 

You could still carry over certain NPCs (Elves can live a long time, and since about half of Vvardenfell consists of Dark Elves... obviously, some are going to have died, especially with the Oblivion Crisis and the eruption of Red Mountain having occurred between the two timelines, but others will still be around. The vampires in the vampire clans can still exist. And that one last dwarf, he's feasibly still there.), but for the most part, you'd be adding new characters. You could have the same factions, along with some new ones, but they'd have different quests. Wildlife... just make sure there's Cliff Racers. It isn't Morrowind without a stack of pterodactyls above your head.

[takakupo]

Amtrack and everyone else claiming a conversion of Morrowind is illegal are undoubtedly wrong for many reasons.

 

1) The EULA specifically states in one clause that it is against the reverse engineering of its software properties, which is the main concern of many production companies like Bethesda who will see an alternate group use their engine to gain fame/acclaim and then profit from it. This is the only clause in the contract in which I can see that one would have concern but since you're using the engines that Bethesda owns, there is no problem. Not to mention, recreating Morrowind wouldn't even be reverse engineering. You would be using Skyrim's platform and Morrowind's story.

 

2) But that's the keyword, which is "Profit". Anytime money is involved, that is when the lawyers are called in. Even in the frivelous case that Bethesda may see a gamer copy an entire storyline, if they took it to court, they would lose. Simply put, there's no judge in the world that would ever take a case seriously in which Bethesda was not "harmed" in a conflict and it is especially hard to prove that an individual on the internet "gained" anything from such a conflict.

 

3) Parody is protected under copyright law and will be forever and as silly/insulting as it may sound, modding is considered parody. There is no case to be made against any individual mod except for a moral one.

 

4) Copyright does not pertain to the lifting of entire texts from one installment of a protected property to another so long as the owner owns both properties. This is especially the case for The Elder Scrolls BECAUSE OF the creation kit in all three major installments of the game which explicitly allows its users to create and USE all properties in each game for the sole purpose of entertaining and expanding of interests in The Elder Scrolls series. Regardless of what you take from one TES game and put in another, you are protected under the actions of Bethesda and their own implications.

 

Lets please stop this silly argument and get on with the genius that is recreating Morrowind. I would suggest however that you get together with the several others who are undertaking this task and you will do better. Also, if you could train users *raises hand* I'm sure they would be more than happy to help you.

[Ghogiel]

4) Copyright does not pertain to the lifting of entire texts from one installment of a protected property to another so long as the owner owns both properties. This is especially the case for The Elder Scrolls BECAUSE OF the creation kit in all three major installments of the game which explicitly allows its users to create and USE all properties in each game for the sole purpose of entertaining and expanding of interests in The Elder Scrolls series. Regardless of what you take from one TES game and put in another, you are protected under the actions of Bethesda and their own implications.

 

Taking content from one game and putting it in another is expressly forbidden by the copyright owner. They have not granted you that license in the agreement with you, so you never had the right to do port content between games.

 

Secondly you would be making and distributing illegal copies of the game assets. Which is a clear violation of of copyright law. < they actually turn a total blind eye to you redistributing their files, as technically a lot of mods are infringing on copyright law just by copying modifying and distributing the game files, no where do they give you permission to actually do so. But as long as you stay within their ToS then they allow modders to get on with their work. When you break that agreement then the law certainly isn't on your side..

[Thandal]

This project may be a great idea, but it cannot be hosted here and this topic is locked until the OP can provide the results of comunication with Bethesda indicating that give their permission for this.

 

As many others have already mentioned, BethSoft has repeatedly said that their resources may not be used in any mod for any game other than the one in which it is found. Dark0ne and other veteran modders have been told this by them many times.

 

(The unconfirmed rumour is that they licensed some materials from third parties, but ONLY for the one game, and they are not willing to sort out which items can cross-titles and which can't.)

 

So unless they have changed their position since the release of Skyrim, that's the way it is. :(