Skyrim isn't dumbed down. Purists are.

[PavelkCZ]

@pavelkcz

If you had a good point to make you'd make it. Lol I've played rpg games as much as you have and understood magic as much as you have.

 

Now tell me why you think skyrim's magic is streamlined. Oh right...you won't...because you don't have a reason. you'll use the "I can't waste my time on you" card.

 

OK, if you are saying that you played RPG games, I will try to explain you why the magic is crippled in Skyrim.

 

Magic in RPG games was always a lot of thinking, a lot of calculations, a lot of combinations etc. In the pure RP sense, I would said that "you must study, to be a good mage". In classic RPG games like Dungeon Master 2, Baldurs Gate 1 and 2 etc., the combats was mostly turn-based and the player must think a lot what spell will be used, when, from which position etc.

 

In TES, where the combats was and are "real time", this "thinking" factor of magic was compensated with relatively high number of spell effects and the possibility to combine them. Classical example was spell making.

In Oblivion, I spent long hours in the game, just sitting in my home in Frostcrag Spire (the wizard tower from the DLC pack) and with the help of my trusted calculator and spreadsheet (outside the game), I was calculating and combining various spells to get the right spell for every kind of enemy (daedra, necromant, undead, ogre, troll etc.). I was calculating effects vs. magika cost vs. time etc.

Also, I was inventing special spells like the spells with "avalanche" (not sure about the proper english term) effects like a chain "Weakness to magic, Weakness to fire, Fire attack" and similar. Or special spells against necromants like the combination "Silence, Burden, Fire damage 10 points for 30 seconds".

 

Simply, the magic was a complex mechanism and it was necessary to think about it, study it, experiment, test the ideas etc.

 

All this is lost in Skyrim and it is no more fun to play a mage. It is just a simple and more or less chaotic shooting. The only funny thing are the Shouts, but they are just funny, they lack the potential for combinations.

 

But nevermind, I am sure that as soon as the CK will be available, we will have much better magical system for Skyrim on PC.

Edited November 27, 2011 by PavelkCZ

[epicwisdom]

Skyrim might not have quite the complexity, but there's still some w.r.t. perks and spell schools. It's rather hard to keep all 5 (6 counting enchanting?) of them at a very high skill level unless you specifically prioritize that when fighting. Still, I can see what you're saying -- regardless of the path you choose, you mostly stick with 2-5 spells per fight (despite having 20+) and spam them. Even for an entire dungeon, spell usage varies little.

[DarkGenius]

@pavelkcz

If you had a good point to make you'd make it. Lol I've played rpg games as much as you have and understood magic as much as you have.

 

Now tell me why you think skyrim's magic is streamlined. Oh right...you won't...because you don't have a reason. you'll use the "I can't waste my time on you" card.

 

OK, if you are saying that you played RPG games, I will try to explain you why the magic is crippled in Skyrim.

 

Magic in RPG games was always a lot of thinking, a lot of calculations, a lot of combinations etc. In the pure RP sense, I would said that "you must study, to be a good mage". In classic RPG games like Dungeon Master 2, Baldurs Gate 1 and 2 etc., the combats was mostly turn-based and the player must think a lot what spell will be used, when, from which position etc.

 

In TES, where the combats was and are "real time", this "thinking" factor of magic was compensated with relatively high number of spell effects and the possibility to combine them. Classical example was spell making.

In Oblivion, I spent long hours in the game, just sitting in my home in Frostcrag Spire (the wizard tower from the DLC pack) and with the help of my trusted calculator and spreadsheet (outside the game), I was calculating and combining various spells to get the right spell for every kind of enemy (daedra, necromant, undead, ogre, troll etc.). I was calculating effects vs. magika cost vs. time etc.

Also, I was inventing special spells like the spells with "avalanche" (not sure about the proper english term) effects like a chain "Weakness to magic, Weakness to fire, Fire attack" and similar. Or special spells against necromants like the combination "Silence, Burden, Fire damage 10 points for 30 seconds".

 

Simply, the magic was a complex mechanism and it was necessary to think about it, study it, experiment, test the ideas etc.

 

All this is lost in Skyrim and it is no more fun to play a mage. It is just a simple and more or less chaotic shooting. The only funny thing are the Shouts, but they are just funny, they lack the potential for combinations.

 

But nevermind, I am sure that as soon as the CK will be available, we will have much better magical system for Skyrim on PC.

 

 

We are Kindred, I did the same thing all the time.

 

I'm a little Evil, Experimented an rather curious spell set.

 

Dark Bolt: Damage Health Target, Health Absorption Target, Soul Trap Target. (Most Common)

 

Mass Darkness (Target): Paralysis 10 secs, Fear 60 secs, Invisibility 60 secs (fun)

 

Misanthropy Syndrome: (Target) Chamaleon 60% 60 secs, Frenzy 60 secs (One of my first experiments with effects, tested on summoned Imps in Bravil (Using mods of course)

 

Some others are a secret, but easy to figure out.

 

Sincerely,

 

DG.

[Goliath978]

Well...if spell MAKING isn't in Skyrim then I shall agree...if it is then I don't see how you can't sit and devise magic in Skyrim...the magic works fast, but theres still some thinking of combos to be done. For example: dual spells seems like a very "yeah whatever cool feature" thing, but it opens up new possibilities to change things much. You can have a custom staff with a custom spell and think of possibilities all day long what with the many spells in Skyrim. Frost spells slow enemies down, fire stays, there are many very in depth things in magic of Skyrim to consider.

 

Assuming spell making is in the game...oblivion's wasn't too crazy either. Even if it isn't: still so many spell combos and styles of use to be had. If spell making isn't in the game I'd imagine someone will make a good mod for it, where you can change size and appearance.

[PavelkCZ]

Mass Darkness (Target): Paralysis 10 secs, Fear 60 secs, Invisibility 60 secs (fun)

 

 

Wow, I didn't find this. Loading Oblivion, I must test it. Looks absolutely funny. Maybe it can be salted with something like "Shock damage 5 pts. per second for 60 secs." :-))))

[JimboUK]

Mass Darkness (Target): Paralysis 10 secs, Fear 60 secs, Invisibility 60 secs (fun)

 

 

Wow, I didn't find this. Loading Oblivion, I must test it. Looks absolutely funny. Maybe it can be salted with something like "Shock damage 5 pts. per second for 60 secs." :-))))

 

For amusement Morrowind had one of the best, damage health on self, constant effect enchanted ring/amulet, sell to a shopkeeper who would immediately equip it and die. :thumbsup:

[PavelkCZ]

Well...if spell MAKING isn't in Skyrim then I shall agree...if it is then I don't see how you can't sit and devise magic in Skyrim...

 

Ehm. Excuse-me if I do not fully understand what you are writing. I must admit that the english is not my native language (I am from Czech republic).

 

But are you trying to say, that you do not know if there is or is not the spell making in Skyrim ? If so, I really do not understand how you can seriously discuss the aspects of magic system in Skyrim and trying to argument if the magic system is crippled (dumbed down, streamlined etc.) or not.

It is the same as if I will try to discuss various aspects of light and heavy armor which I never used in any TES game and which I will never use in the future. Time consuming, probably boring and absolutely pointless.

[buddah]

If the bickering and constant attacks does not end soon, this will get a lock.

 

One more report and it is history.

[PavelkCZ]

OK, forget it Goliath978, moderator is right.

 

I apologize. You are happy with your version of Skyrim, I will wait for mods. :-)

[Goliath978]

@pavelkcz

You heard the mod. Stop trolling and let's get on topic. Bu y'all ought to see the battlefield forums. You'd have to break some sort of real life law to get report there. Here I must be careful when saying the word stupid.

 

Anyways: I havent made a mage character of any sort yet. Nor gone to t he college of winterhold. As it is it isn't in the game...this disappoints me. It's not dumbed down it's simply...gone. That does blow. But Bethesda must've had some sort of reason. Think about it: why would bethesda get rid of spell makin just because? There's gotta be a reason.