So, Do you play FO4 as a male or female?

[Fkemman11]

Nora comes from 2077. Even taking the Fallout universe to be fixed in the 1950's-1960's, in the USA the women gained the right to vote in 1919, though some states did give them right to vote as early as 1911. Since we're talking MA, probably 1919 is the date.

 

I.e., not only Nora would have the right to vote, it would already be 150 YEARS since women had that right.

 

Also on the topic of women in the army, about 13,000 women admitted into active duty in the Navy and Marines and a much smaller number admitted into the Coast Guard during World War ONE. That's almost half a century before history basically slows down in the Fallout universe.

 

But women knowing how to use a gun is much earlier than even that. A whole company of women sharpshooters offered their services in the American-Spanish war, though they were turned down. But at any rate, yeah, they had their own guns and ammo and knew how to use them.

 

Pretending that women's rights are THAT new isn't just ignorant, it's... what? Having managed to live under a rock? I don't know where people get the misogynist idea that women were all helpless and unable to even point and click a gun outside feminist fiction.

 

@Moraelin How the hell do you know all this stuff? I mean I have read some history and stuff- But, damn. You must have read an entire libraries worth! Not judging. I mean that's pretty cool. OK. Yes I am dead wrong about the dates and stuff. But the fact remains that women (and blacks) did have to struggle for their rights in American society (and in many other countries) The examples that you gave for women wanting and knowing how to fight were an extreme exception to the general rule that women did not fight in ANY society until the last 30-40 years or so. I'm not saying this is anything NEW. I am saying that their struggle for equilibrium is interesting and makes for good story material. :cool:

[bmt12]

I don't think objecting to the wife being the SS is misonygistic at all. There's no doubt about her backstory: she's a lawyer. SHe's completely unqualified for Fallout 4. That's not to say you couldn't have a really good, rags to riches lawyer in the wasteland story, but that's not what Fallout 4 is. Fallout 4 has no room for negotiation, critical thing, sharp wits or leadership. It is a game where everything boils down to living or dying by the gun in your hand. If I ever care enough to play the game with an actual character, I'm going to play the husband, because it suits him by temperament and training. And I say that because the US Army has always been an officer heavy fighting force where if you have no other skills you go into the infantry. You're meat. Otherwise, they make you a POG (person other than grunt). And the Husband is a grunt. The intro video shows this very clearly. He's not even a tanker, an artillery man or mechanized infantry or he'd be in power armor. He's a foot soldier, he's a meat shield for something or someone actually important.

 

This is your standard action hero: white, male, dark hair who knows how to fight, trained to survive and is more or less impervious to PTSD. That's the only kind of character that can hit the ground running in the wasteland. I played a pre-war Ghoul as my courier in Fallout New Vegas, but she had spent a lot of money on implants and combat training for when SHTF. This couple were not survivalists in any way shape of form. Look at their house, their lack of a Fallout shelter, no guns in the home, not even a victory plot to grow some fooddespite rampant food rationing. Plus the female's lines for the Silver Shroud just sound stupid

 

 

Well that's not really fair to say that she would be unqualified for it, no one else in the wasteland has any military training and in Fallout 3 you were a kid who's entire weapon training centered around a BB gun that you used for pest extermination.

 

Besides there were cut lines for the female SS stating that she was also in the military, with a mod on here that actually restores them. Some people have suggested that she was meant to be a JAG but that would still have given her basic weapon training.

 

And who says that she isn't shaken up about being dumped into the wasteland with her kid missing? Several of the limited lines that Bethesdea provided us with force her to be an emotional train wreck at times.

Edited February 16, 2017 by bmt12

[Fkemman11]

Well that's not really fair to say that she would be unqualified for it, no one else in the wasteland has any military training and in Fallout 3 you were a kid who's entire weapon training centered around a BB gun that you used for pest extermination.

 

Besides there were cut lines for the female SS stating that she was also in the military, with a mod on here that actually restores them. Some people have suggested that she was meant to be a JAG but that would still have given her basic weapon training.

 

And who says that she isn't shaken up about being dumped into the wasteland with her kid missing? Several of the limited lines that Bethesdea provided us with force her to be an emotional train wreck at times.

 

I'm not saying she is not QUALIFIED for it or that women CANT fight! I'm saying that women from the era she is from were not expected of prepared to fight. Even today, men make up the majority of every counties armed forces. What I am trying to say is that it is a common misconception that women cannot fight. As Moraelin has pointed out repeatedly- women most certainly CAN (and do). It is the struggle against this ideology that makes for very interesting story material. Sorry if I said something different before. Because that's not what I meant. :smile:

[bmt12]

That post was in reply to charwo, on the previous page, I should have included a quote.

[charwo]

Well that's not really fair to say that she would be unqualified for it, no one else in the wasteland has any military training and in Fallout 3 you were a kid who's entire weapon training centered around a BB gun that you used for pest extermination.

 

Besides there were cut lines for the female SS stating that she was also in the military, with a mod on here that actually restores them. Some people have suggested that she was meant to be a JAG but that would still have given her basic weapon training.

 

And who says that she isn't shaken up about being dumped into the wasteland with her kid missing? Several of the limited lines that Bethesdea provided us with force her to be an emotional train wreck at times.

An emotional trainwreck who can outfight a deathclaw. In power armor true, but still has to fight a deathclaw. I'm never taken the Vaults at face value: from the Fallout 1 instruction manual I've always taken it for granted that Vaults have VR or equivalent training measures to ensure the population can run a Vault and troubleshoot any attendant problem. Plus it's the only way to justify being able to tag Survival, Unarmed, and Energy Weapons. There's not enough people for there to be a living community of teachers for every skill you can tag. And Vault 13 had no energy weapons whatsoever. My Vault Dweller was combat trained because she tried to join the security forces and was turned away because of family connections and my Lone Wanderer spent her free time in VR playing simulation called Heroes of ROC (Republic of China, that is Taiwan).

 

If you aren't a sociopath, killing someone for the first time makes you feel a lot more than recoil. The SS is a hardened killer to fight through a platoon of raiders before getting the power armor. You need more than basic training to do that on your lonesome. Thus the husband is the objectively correct choice, and I've never played a male protagonist in a Fallout game before.

[Fkemman11]

I don't think objecting to the wife being the SS is misonygistic at all. There's no doubt about her backstory: she's a lawyer. SHe's completely unqualified for Fallout 4. That's not to say you couldn't have a really good, rags to riches lawyer in the wasteland story, but that's not what Fallout 4 is. Fallout 4 has no room for negotiation, critical thing, sharp wits or leadership. It is a game where everything boils down to living or dying by the gun in your hand. If I ever care enough to play the game with an actual character, I'm going to play the husband, because it suits him by temperament and training. And I say that because the US Army has always been an officer heavy fighting force where if you have no other skills you go into the infantry. You're meat. Otherwise, they make you a POG (person other than grunt). And the Husband is a grunt. The intro video shows this very clearly. He's not even a tanker, an artillery man or mechanized infantry or he'd be in power armor. He's a foot soldier, he's a meat shield for something or someone actually important.

 

This is your standard action hero: white, male, dark hair who knows how to fight, trained to survive and is more or less impervious to PTSD. That's the only kind of character that can hit the ground running in the wasteland. I played a pre-war Ghoul as my courier in Fallout New Vegas, but she had spent a lot of money on implants and combat training for when SHTF. This couple were not survivalists in any way shape of form. Look at their house, their lack of a Fallout shelter, no guns in the home, not even a victory plot to grow some fooddespite rampant food rationing. Plus the female's lines for the Silver Shroud just sound stupid

 

Yeah. Charwo. That's sorta what I meant. Neither one of them would have been prepared to jump out the door of that vault and just go RAMBO on the Commonwealth. I have military training. Does that mean I would know what to do in that situation. No. I couldn't field strip a weapon right now it my life depended on it. My point was that men are more expectant to be called to arms or have to fight for their very existence. Someone seemed to think that was a slight against women. All this political correctness is really starting to boor the hell outta me. People seem to be content with slapping a label on you for saying anything that might be considered controversial. :confused:

 

It would have been great if the game had a much steeper learning curve to reflect how difficult it is to learn these skills and be effective using them in combat situations. Like not being able to use some weapons at all until said training had been done. And I can tell u that training will help. But it does not completely prepare a person for a battle situation- which is essentially what FO4 is about. For instance, training and common sense might tell you to find cover as soon as a shot is fired. Sometimes that will save you. Sometimes that will pin you down and make u an easy target for the sniper you didn't spot or the many enemies that will just lob a grenade at you. Better to move from cover to cover as much as possible. The only way to know that is to learn it through experience. Being Ace Mechanic is my favorite by far. If you've never taken anything apart in your life. Guess what, someone with a lot more knowledge will have to do it for ya. :thumbsup:

[charwo]

 

I don't think objecting to the wife being the SS is misonygistic at all. There's no doubt about her backstory: she's a lawyer. SHe's completely unqualified for Fallout 4. That's not to say you couldn't have a really good, rags to riches lawyer in the wasteland story, but that's not what Fallout 4 is. Fallout 4 has no room for negotiation, critical thing, sharp wits or leadership. It is a game where everything boils down to living or dying by the gun in your hand. If I ever care enough to play the game with an actual character, I'm going to play the husband, because it suits him by temperament and training. And I say that because the US Army has always been an officer heavy fighting force where if you have no other skills you go into the infantry. You're meat. Otherwise, they make you a POG (person other than grunt). And the Husband is a grunt. The intro video shows this very clearly. He's not even a tanker, an artillery man or mechanized infantry or he'd be in power armor. He's a foot soldier, he's a meat shield for something or someone actually important.

 

This is your standard action hero: white, male, dark hair who knows how to fight, trained to survive and is more or less impervious to PTSD. That's the only kind of character that can hit the ground running in the wasteland. I played a pre-war Ghoul as my courier in Fallout New Vegas, but she had spent a lot of money on implants and combat training for when SHTF. This couple were not survivalists in any way shape of form. Look at their house, their lack of a Fallout shelter, no guns in the home, not even a victory plot to grow some fooddespite rampant food rationing. Plus the female's lines for the Silver Shroud just sound stupid

 

Yeah. Charwo. That's sorta what I meant. Neither one of them would have been prepared to jump out the door of that vault and just go RAMBO on the Commonwealth. I have military training. Does that mean I would know what to do in that situation. No. I couldn't field strip a weapon right now it my life depended on it. My point was that men are more expectant to be called to arms or have to fight for their very existence. Someone seemed to think that was a slight against women. All this political correctness is really starting to bore the hell outta me. People seem to be content with slapping a label on you for saying anything that might be considered controversial. :confused:

 

It boils down to training and temperament. If the wife was the military vet and the husband a lawyer, then the wife would be the objectively correct choice. You, having been through the military are way better prepared to survive the wasteland, which is wilderness than someone who hasn't. Not to say you could go all Rambo, but you're in a better position. A lawyer without extensive combat and survival training going rambo in the post-apocalypse? THere's only one way to play that, a sociopath

[bmt12]

Well the "joke" dialogue choice does usually make your character come off as some kind of sociopath.

[Fkemman11]

Well the "joke" dialogue choice does usually make your character come off as some kind of sociopath.

 

This is true. They did seem to let you lean that way without being straight-up evil.

[Fkemman11]

"It boils down to training and temperament. If the wife was the military vet and the husband a lawyer, then the wife would be the objectively correct choice. You, having been through the military are way better prepared to survive the wasteland, which is wilderness than someone who hasn't. Not to say you could go all Rambo, but you're in a better position. A lawyer without extensive combat and survival training going rambo in the post-apocalypse? THere's only one way to play that, a sociopath."

 

I don't know. Someone realizing the situation would pick up a gun (or three) and try to make the best of it without being a sociopath. Assuming that you have training, it would still take time to get a "feel" for it. I mean I have never shot anyone. But I have thought about it. To start shooting a lot of people.... might cause something in your head to snap. Shooting that first person would be big though. How a man or woman would handle that is pure speculation.

 

I like to think that my female char still remembers some tough decisions that she has made. Not forgetting that while some may have deserved death, others may not have. It was a spur of the moment kinda thing. She has a dark side. But tries to keep it in check. She is a loner due to events in her past and she is not sure who can be trusted- given the state of the commonwealth. This doesn't mean she hates people, just that she has no time for their petty BS. In her overall view of things, she would like to help construct a better world than before- one that does not end in nuclear fire at least. She misses her husband and is determined to discover the fate of Shaun- even though she is sure that he is dead. Revenge is first on the list of to-dos. This will take some time and doing though. So she must be patient. Above all she feels she must remain true to herself and try to understand her plight with the utmost clarity. In other words be deadly when she must, tender to those whom she cares about, and never forget these are all people and creatures trying to survive- just like her. :geek: