valve talking about paid mods again

[rkelly]

here is the link

 

http://www.pcgamer.com/valve-modders-absolutely-need-to-be-paid/

 

 

so whats your guys view on this probable blunder?

[Crimsomrider]

Valve did the same mistake Bethesda did when they launched mods for consoles, and that was that it was not fully planned out. Instead of analyzing and improving on the concept of the idea, they instead went to the public with nothing but the concept of it and a shitstorm emerged.

 

When paid modding came out, I didn't comment on it because I was not a modder. Even though I was a mere user, I hated the idea because it killed what modding is all about.

 

Now that I am a modder, I am still 110% against paid mods. I think donations are fully acceptable and a nice way of someone saying thank you. And that's about it. The day they put a price tag onto mods, they were no longer mods. They were products and users expect products to work 100% and to be supported.

 

 

I will never charge for my mods even if paid mods somehow do become a reality and I won't judge anyone who does want to be paid for their modding work. My thoughts on the matter is that if you're modding and expecting to get paid well enough to make a profession out of it which pays the bills, you're doing it wrong. But then again, people make mods for different reasons. Some do it because they like doing it, some do it for donations, some do it to get popular. Reasons are different for everyone.

 

But I don't think this has anything to do with Bethesda games anymore. Steam Workshop is dead for Bethesda games and it's all about the Nexus and Bethesda.net now. This article is pretty much about Valve's games and games which do have Steam Workshop.

 

I use 167 mods for Fallout 4 at the moment. Even if every single one of them was only 1$, that's 167$ to play with all these mods. 167$ + 40$ for the base game + 20$ for the Season Pass. That's 227$ just to play the game which I have installed on my PC today. Not to mention all the mods that I have used, but am no longer using because they're outdated and not supported. If I also counted mods which I am no longer using, that's easily another 36$. So around 263$ total.

 

Money is the source of a lot of wrongs in this world and I don't want it to poison modding as well. Gaming in general is already being destroyed by DLCs and Season Passes, the last thing we need is paid mods.

[CiderMuffin]

I'm all for modders getting paid but I'd rather it be a patreon/twitch sub system where paying is optional. People will whine "BUT IT DOESN'T WORK" while using the Nexus's donation feature as proof besides the fact that for years the Nexus for whatever reason made donating hard to find.

 

Putting mods behind paywalls just makes it harder on people to play the mods, especially for games like TES or Paradox games like Europa Univeralis 4 and Stellaris. Eventually it would just be buying hundreds of dollars of content for one game like Crimsonrider said. Especially since people aren't going to sell them for one dollar, it's going to be way more and all it'll do is close up the community because the experience modders don't want the competition.

[WastelandAssassin]

I would like to ask a question about this prospect

playing many of Bethesda's games these recent years , the first thing you'll probably get here is the unofficial patch for the specific game

It's becoming mandatory , as these games still have some very deep bugs , even after all these years

 

if payed mods will be a thing , who will pay the modders that fix the games?

obviously it's all about the consumers paying for the mods , but isn't it a bit weird that we will need to pay extra to get a properly working game , while allowing companies to release a broken game , with the assumption that the modding community will just do it's work and fix the game?

 

also , after looking at the new article , does it actually show any business model?

because if modders will get 50% or less for their work , it's honestly quite sad , and yet I would hardly believe that valve won't take a cut of the profits

and how can you honestly put a price mark on mods , where you have some people releasing about 10 minutes worth of work , while others release mods that make paid official DLCs pale in comparison

 

the whole concept just feels wrong if it's done in the official way like a store

although of course I support the donation options , or sites like patreon or such

[Reneer]

For as long as I've been a mod author, I've always wanted and supported the idea of paid mods. I firmly believe that mod authors should have a choice regarding whether they want to give away their work or ask for money upfront.

 

And donations don't work. Sorry, but that's just been both my personal experience and the experience of many other mod authors. I've been modding for over 10 years and donations have been a "thing" since 2012. In total, according to the Nexus stats, 246,079 people have downloaded my mods over the years. And I've had, I think, 4 donations that I can recall. And those four donations all added up to less than $20.

Edited February 13, 2017 by Reneer

[Yodhrin]

For as long as I've been a mod author, I've always wanted and supported the idea of paid mods. I firmly believe that mod authors should have a choice regarding whether they want to give away their work or ask for money upfront.

 

And donations don't work. Sorry, but that's just been both my personal experience and the experience of many other mod authors. I've been modding for over 10 years and donations have been a "thing" since 2012. In total, according to the Nexus stats, 246,079 people have downloaded my mods over the years. And I've had, I think, 4 donations that I can recall. And those four donations all added up to less than $20.

 

There won't be a choice in the end though. What, you think if Valve or Bethesda bring in a paid mods system where they inevitably take their tasty little cut, they're going to make it easy for no-pay modders to keep "competing" with the paid mods? They've already tied the CK into their exclusive platform, what makes you think they won't make that the only way to publish CK mods? Not right away, obviously, boiling the frog slowly always works better than trying to chuck him into the already boiling pot, but bit by bit they'll try and kill off "unofficial" modding. And of course, it's only really a choice for mod authors making content Bethesda approve of - you won't be getting paid for anything that might affect the rating of the game, or for mods inspired by other IPs(and I do mean inspired by, not asset rips - legal departments are paranoid).

 

So, it's probably going to be bad for modders who don't want to charge. It will be bad for modders who make content that isn't T-rated. As pointed out above by Crimsonrider it'll be hot garbage for mod users who use more than a couple of mods. But hey, a few modders who don't like the freeware ethos and Bethesda gotta get paid, so everyone else gets to take a running jump eh.

[Reneer]

There won't be a choice in the end though. What, you think if Valve or Bethesda bring in a paid mods system where they inevitably take their tasty little cut, they're going to make it easy for no-pay modders to keep "competing" with the paid mods? They've already tied the CK into their exclusive platform, what makes you think they won't make that the only way to publish CK mods? Not right away, obviously, boiling the frog slowly always works better than trying to chuck him into the already boiling pot, but bit by bit they'll try and kill off "unofficial" modding. And of course, it's only really a choice for mod authors making content Bethesda approve of - you won't be getting paid for anything that might affect the rating of the game, or for mods inspired by other IPs(and I do mean inspired by, not asset rips - legal departments are paranoid).

 

So, it's probably going to be bad for modders who don't want to charge. It will be bad for modders who make content that isn't T-rated. As pointed out above by Crimsonrider it'll be hot garbage for mod users who use more than a couple of mods. But hey, a few modders who don't like the freeware ethos and Bethesda gotta get paid, so everyone else gets to take a running jump eh.

There's no evidence whatsoever that Bethesda would try to stomp out free mods - and even if they did try that, it wouldn't work. It would be hacked / cracked in a hot second.

 

Steam / Valve allows paid mods and free mods (see Portal 2, TF2, DotA 2, all the free apps / games on Steam, etc). Linden Labs (Second Life) allows paid content and free content. Microsoft allows paid and free mods (see Flight Simulator X). So there are clearly companies who don't mind free mods "competing" with paid mods (and have had that going for years). Bethesda is no different - free mods are, if anything, generating revenue for them just as paid mods would. Forcing mod authors to sell their work would be completely counterproductive - any mod author that was truly against selling their work would simply go somewhere else for their creative outlet. It would be a lose-lose situation for Bethesda since they would lose free talent that costs them nothing and only serves to create a wider user base for their games.

 

And yes, no one will be getting paid by Bethesda for making X-rated mods. That was and will continue to be part of the deal. But M-rated material will be just fine - the Skyrim and Fallout series are both rated Mature.

 

Finally, not all mod authors are going to want to sell their work. Remember all those "Forever Free" banners that popped up when paid mods happened? Those mod authors aren't going to buy into the system, so people will likely always have a free source of mods.

Edited February 13, 2017 by Reneer

[Genamine]

Sometimes I like to think paid modding wouldnt reduce the amount of good free mods, but just add high quality paid mods

Maybe Im just optimistic, but either way, Im not sure how realistic the idea of paid modding is

 

Theoretically it makes sense, if you put hard work and a lot of time into a mod that people really want to use, why shouldnt you get paid for it?, even if just 10 cents per download, it adds up a lot

 

Practically however, I dont see how it can be done without all due chaos ensueing, for starters paid modding would greatly encourage the less honourable individuals to steal mods

Money makes things complicated, it wouldnt be as simple as "just uploading a mod" anymore

 

Perhaps as CiderMuffin suggested, a Patreon/Twitch sub-like approach might be the best way of going about it

[Reneer]

The problem is Bethesda will never go for a Patreon / Twitch style approach because that means they won't be able to split the profit between themselves and the mod author. Thus they have no reason to allow it because that method provides them no benefit at all. Edited February 14, 2017 by Reneer

[Crimsomrider]

Meh...