niston Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 I think the previs/precombine optimization systems are far more of an extremely yucky, itchy, nasty compromise than a solution; Probably just there to get things going on sub-sub-par hardware (and to appease the "ZOMFG!!!! 50FPS IS UNPLAYABLE!!!!!!!1!!!!!!" crowd). I've ran without any of them on my old Radeon HD6500 and I still do so with a 1080Ti. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMB92 Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 I think the previs/precombine optimization systems are far more of an extremely yucky, itchy, nasty compromise than a solution; Probably just there to get things going on sub-sub-par hardware (and to appease the "ZOMFG!!!! 50FPS IS UNPLAYABLE!!!!!!!1!!!!!!" crowd). I've ran without any of them on my old Radeon HD6500 and I still do so with a 1080Ti.After having looked into Umbra tech a bit further, I've shifted my tune a bit. The precombined system as well. Both are great ideas, you could call them lazy man's systems, but then if you were a Dev you'd want to automate as much as possible too. Fallouts implementation is quite good, compared to some games I've seen using Umbra now where I see things pop in and out on certain camera angles, I see it far less in F4. It's just not exactly a modding friendly solution, thats why it sucks in most people's eyes. What sucks twice as bad is that Beth hasn't really optimized a lot of the busier scenes (i.e Boston) if not outright over trashed them, and hidden this behind said system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zilav Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 Every optimization system is awesome as long as there are corresponding tools provided. Had Bethesda released a standalone utility to easily regen precomb/previs for the entire load order (not CK because it can't load all mods) by users, that system would have been praised by everyone. But they never ever do something extra that is of no use for them and their particular workflow, and will never do. This means whatever optimization system will be in the next game, as long as it'll require some processing in CK it will be s#*! for users and modding in general in any case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transient3292 Posted July 24, 2019 Share Posted July 24, 2019 I have studied this thread thoroughly while having issues regenerating precombine/previs for my goodneighbor mod. Custom assets were presenting problems which I solved, but I do have a few questions now. If I break precombined meshes by moving set pieces around and add new structures (structure pieces also found in workshop menu and brick buildings that make up the layout of goodneighbor), will it generate new PC meshes for these structures that my mod adds? From what I understand if I break 1 PC mesh , then all of them within that cell (3x3?) Will be broken. If I've disabled a static piece that is part of a mesh, will a new PC mesh be rebuilt without that disabled static? I'm also looking for some guidance on using the xedit script that prunes the rebuilt data. I've never used any xedit scripts so I apologize for my ignorance. I've followed the directions and am able to select the "clean precombines" button and save the .bat to a location. After that I'm not sure on if its worked or if I need to execute the .bat file. As far as what I have done successfully in xedit, it gives messages such as "still loading references" etc. Once I press the "clean PCB" nothing seems to change, even when doing a small cell with very little architecture. The one thing I am still trying to fully comprehend is how to differentiate my mods precombined data from vanilla. I really appreciate any explanations or advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMB92 Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 Generally any object that has a recipe for building or marked as "initially disabled" won't be included/incorporated in your PC meshes. And yes moving a piece that was baked in PC will break it for that cell, the system will turn off for that area when that cell is loaded in game. Haven't taken the the time to play with the script yet, so can't help you there. What problems are you having exactly? Vis not generating properly? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIitS Posted July 25, 2019 Share Posted July 25, 2019 The 3x3 cell block is only for previs, not precombineds. But otherwise yes, breaking one precombined in a cell breaks all of them. Disabled bits shouldn't be baked into precombineds. For the script: until you run the .bat file, nothing will be done. The .bat file tells windows which .nif files to delete. Any .nif that is made up of the same REFRs, with none added or removed, and whose components were not edited (i.e. moved/replace/etc...) will be flagged for deletion in the bat file. If you right click -> edit you can see how things are laid out. There will be no visible difference in xEdit. The point of the "Clean Precombineds" function in the script is to get rid of "ITM" precombined .nif files so that your uploaded mod is smaller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transient3292 Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 Generally any object that has a recipe for building or marked as "initially disabled" won't be included/incorporated in your PC meshes. And yes moving a piece that was baked in PC will break it for that cell, the system will turn off for that area when that cell is loaded in game. Haven't taken the the time to play with the script yet, so can't help you there. What problems are you having exactly? Vis not generating properly?I appreciate the explanation. My first issue was ck crashing when I regen precombined meshes, which I narrowed down to a layer of modded objects, or so I thought. When it did get through the process another layer was causing vis to not properly generate creating large LOD type lines through my cells in-game. After troubleshooting through those issues I'm able to successfully regen the data, but I also learned that with reverting to backups and testing that the process would still crash my ck about 4 out of 10 times( I've been doing a lot of testing and troubleshooting). Obviously this leads me to believe it's my hardware, which leads me to ask you guys about assigning the page file to the ck as I've seen mentioned in this thread. I have 16gb of ddr4, an 8th gen i5,a 1050ti and an evo 970 m2 ssd which I'd I'll imagine should be fine for ck work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transient3292 Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 The 3x3 cell block is only for previs, not precombineds. But otherwise yes, breaking one precombined in a cell breaks all of them.  Disabled bits shouldn't be baked into precombineds. For the script: until you run the .bat file, nothing will be done. The .bat file tells windows which .nif files to delete. Any .nif that is made up of the same REFRs, with none added or removed, and whose components were not edited (i.e. moved/replace/etc...) will be flagged for deletion in the bat file. If you right click -> edit you can see how things are laid out. There will be no visible difference in xEdit. The point of the "Clean Precombineds" function in the script is to get rid of "ITM" precombined .nif files so that your uploaded mod is smaller. Thanks, this is very much appreciated. So I'm assuming I need to have my mod packed into the ba2 for the nifs to get deleted? I use mod organizer 2 so I've only tested with them as a separate mod so far. I'm still new to this aspect of modding so tools like xedit and this script are still blowing my mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIitS Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 Thanks, this is very much appreciated. So I'm assuming I need to have my mod packed into the ba2 for the nifs to get deleted? I use mod organizer 2 so I've only tested with them as a separate mod so far. I'm still new to this aspect of modding so tools like xedit and this script are still blowing my mind. No, they explicitly need to not be packed when you run the script, it only works on the loose files. If you are using the CK through MO2 and ending up with the meshes in a MO2 folder and not directly in the data folder, you would have to run the .bat file through MO2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SMB92 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Wanderer, glad you were able to get through those initial troubles. Crashing at generating PC has been a rare experience for me (usually something mod specific, e.g didn't like a mesh), Vis on the other hand is usually always memory (RAM/page file). This process will eat memory alive. I have been told this is due to the way that it loads every texture for every processed object into memory (this may also relate to why Bethesda says they had memory concerns in making this runtime generated perhaps). Usually I grant the CK 64GB of page file and its fine, but I have been told one can remove textures from the data folder as well, and then run the generation without concern for memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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