Why the game feels so cheap !!?

[SeriousDogg]

I'm love this game very much, it's for me on of the best games of all times, but why NPCs react to you like an f***ing slave? i am the listener of the DB and Guild Master of the Thieves Guild and Maven Black-Briar say that she can contact the DB and Thieves Guild against anyone that annoying her (me) because i just walk 20 meter from her and don't even look at her,

 

and why this ******* Dirge say "Even if you one of us you better not make troubles" and "I don't care even if you'r friend with the Guild Masters i still crush you'r skull if you try something" and im ******* the Guild Master !

 

Why Bethesda why???

 

sorry for the bad English.

 

What do you think?

[Thynar]

I think you should..

 

- Press ` in game.

 

- type "help Maven"

 

- type "setessential (Maven's code) 0"

 

- Unsheathe your weapon.

[xlcr]

@SeriousDogg, i guess a positive way to look at not being acknowledged and shown respect is to accept that the general Skyrim populace

isn't supposed to know or recognize who the leader/members of the Dark Brotherhood, Thieves Guild, or Blades are.

 

There is however various NPC dialog scripted that identifies you as College of Winterhold's Archmage, being named

Harbinger of the Companions, a bard member of Bards College, and of course, the dragonborn.

There is also dialog from disgruntled NPC's depending if you are aligned with the Stormclocks or Imperials.

You will get substantial pats on the back from the Greybeards, Generals, Jarls, and even some Daedric Gods, dragons and lost ghosts/npc's.

That's about all the factions i can think of, doesn't seem like there's a lot of dialog interaction, but i won't exactly call it 'cheap'.

 

Yes, I too ignore/despise Maven Black-Briar and always looking for inventive ways to screw her over lol.

Dirge is an Imperial scumbag thief, usually rude/threatening which i think is just his way of sizing you up..

I'm sure if Bethesda had more time they would have filled Skyrim with more dialog/storylines, oh well.

Edited May 13, 2012 by xlcr

[PsxMeUP]

I've complained about a lot of stuff but I wouldn't say Skyrim looks cheap. If anything, Bethesda spread themselves a bit too thin, implementing too many features they couldn't finish - one of them being NPC dialog and your accomplishments.

[RedRavyn]

Well, SeriousDogg, that one little issue (OK, very big issue) hardly makes Skyrim "cheap". In my opinion, it's far from cheap. I'm in a love-hate relationship with it, but I've gotten far more than my fifty bucks out of it.

 

To address your specific issue, though, this is a matter of poor game planning by Bethesda developers. As I've said, elsewhere, these guys are starters and not finishers. They almost never follow through and properly clean up after a quest. This is why Kvatch and the Bruma Mage guild in Oblivion burn forever (and why the Temple district never gets rebuilt). It's why Whiterun is left in shambles after the Civil War questline in Skyrim. It's why they spawned the new Gildergreen sapling INSIDE the trunk of the old, dead tree, rather than removing the old tree, first. It's why very few people who should know better ever have a clue about your accomplishments.

 

So get used to the guards treating you as if you were a common criminal (comments about pickpocketing and lock picking, for instance), even after you've been made Thane. Get used to the fact that Farengar never quite gets the fact that you're the Archmage, and that Lucan will still comment about having the Golden Claw back even after you've stolen it. Get used to the fact that the other members of the Thieves Guild will continue to treat you like the newcomer, even after you ostensibly run the organization. Get used to the fact that even after you become Listener of the Dark Brotherhood that you're still doing ALL the work out in the field, yourself (what the hell are the other assassins for, anyway?) I could go on and on, but it boils down to the fact that the developers failed to use features that are actually in the game to make NPCs properly respond to the player's character. It wasn't any better in Oblivion. Don't expect it to be any better in the next game, either.

[LuckyLucianoO]

Get used to the fact that the other members of the Thieves Guild will continue to treat you like the newcomer, even after you ostensibly run the organization.

 

 

This isnt quite true. Delvin Mallory always greets you with "boss". Also Vex sometimes comments: "well, well guild master pays me a visit" or something. And the other NPCs in the cistern comment "my sister in crime". Only Dirge and the barkeeper threat you like a newcomer who still comment: "so you are Brynjolf new protege..."

 

As for the guards when you are being caught for some crime you can use your status of thane and they let you go. And if they comment things about pickpocket or lockpicking this is the right thing. You are a criminal in Skyrim, a boss of a criminal organisation and walk the streets with your fancy guild master armor. What do you expect to comment? If i can compare the thieves guild to some modern organisation for me that would be mafia. After all the big mafia bosses are not respected from the regular people. So why (as a guild master) you should be?

 

 

It's normal for Maven Black Briar to show some disrespect beacause she is very influential person and the thieves guild own his survival (survival, not glory!) to her.

 

I agree with the author that npcs doesnt make the right comments but you have to get used to it

Edited May 13, 2012 by LuckyLucianoO

[Perraine]

The problem is quite simply that Bethesda did not finish scripting the game (11/11/11 strikes again) ... Obviously NPC recognition is working and fully active, note the clairvoyant guards, who seem to know when you kill a chicken 2 streets over, behind a house, at night, whilst you are hidden! Or they seem to 'know' that you have a high 'Sneak' skill and are constantly telling you to keep your hands to yourself, but they DID NOT finish scripting WHEN and HOW these recognitions and dialogues should happen. With a little more effort they would have been able to 'script' and 'trigger' dialogues to start/stop with certain in game events ... maybe after patch 123.0005687H they will finally get it right ...

[Georgiegril]

This isnt quite true. Delvin Mallory always greets you with "boss". Also Vex sometimes comments: "well, well guild master pays me a visit" or something. And the other NPCs in the cistern comment "my sister in crime". Only Dirge and the barkeeper threat you like a newcomer who still comment: "so you are Brynjolf new protege..."

 

And Tonila never stops introducing herself. "Welcome to the cozy little family, I'm the lookout..."

[RedRavyn]

@ LuckyLucianoO: For the most part you're right. I oversimplified, but my point is still valid about the game not properly updating NPCs reactions to the Player based upon his accomplishments. It's not 100% broken in this sense, but it's definitely not updating itself across the board, either.

 

Your only benefit as Thane in a hold, other than getting a housecarl in some of them, or the right to buy a house in others, is that you can have the guards ignore ONE of your crimes. One. Just a single, little, lousy, unitary one. After that, you're just part of the "common rabble", again. You're also assuming everyone plays into the developers wishes that you join every single guild. Not all of us do that. I've played a character that never once committed a single crime in the game -- all the way up around level 40, when I quit that playthrough because the game lost its challenge. I never joined the Thieves Guild, or the Dark Brotherhood. I never stole a single item. I never murdered anyone. The worst I did was to acquire assaults, but the game is severely broken in the way that it judges whether or not an attack is an assault -- at least in my opinion. So no guard, at least with that character, had any right at all to assume that I had criminal intentions.

 

So, why is it that a guard will admonish me for my lockpicking skill? How the hell does he even know I have a high lockpicking skill, when nobody in Skyrim, save the Divines, have ever seen me pick a lock? And I'm sure that guard doesn't have a hot-line straight to the gods and that they get on it and gossip to him about every single little crime that everyone in the world commits. The problem is that, at least since Oblivion, Bethesda has had this odd notion that guards have to have an inborn access to the Karmic Record, just so they can comment upon a character's skill levels. They probably thought they were being clever. They weren't.

 

Perraine, has it at least partially right, and I've commented upon this in this forum before. I guess the driving force behind Bethesda is its Marketing Department, because they dictated a hard-coded release date and the developers of the game simply didn't have time to finish it. I strongly suspect that the total lameness of the Bards College questline is the result of that policy of "needing" a dramatic release date. It's not like Bethesda to create a guild faction and then not have the Player become the leader of that guild. On the other hand, I seriously doubt that they would have finished scripting NPC dialog to make it more reasonable even had they been given the time to do so. They NEVER finish stuff like this, but simply leave it in a rudimentary state, knowing that most of their players aren't going to care -- or will, at least, continue buying their games in spite of it.

[fraquar]

Gotta say that if you want to keep the common rabble in line, it sure helps immensely if they see that they are "cracking down" on the elite of the town - in this case a Thane.

 

Yeah, everybody knows he's the towns hero, but that doesn't give him complete impunity from punishment.

 

In fact, if he's too far out of line I'd love to see them STRIP him of his Thaneship, and the house to boot. He wants to do whatever the hell he wants he better go underground.