Crashing to Desktop

[rpgjaguar]

Honestly, can some one explain to me why the coders at beth felt the need to make it so that skyrim just CTDs without a meaningfull message so you as the user can actually determin what the problem is?

When skyrim first came out you had that sound problem, but does skyrim tell you? no it just CTD's.

Oh look a mod has not loaded properly, but don't expect skyrim to tell you that.

AH, a conflicting refrence from two mods, but again don't expect skyrim to tell you that.

 

It would be immeasurably easier if skyrim actually told us WHY it crashed instead of just CTD and that's it.

 

Other games don't all give messages either but there problems are often far more specific as to why becuase they arn't as MODABLE and there problems are more often, driver issues or missing DLLS or corrupt files.

 

If I were to start a pettition to make it so beth has to put error reporting into there software so we as users can have an easier time working out why it crashed, would you sign it?

 

 

p.s. I know it's not an easy thing to code for (sooo many variations) but if they can make the engine that runs skyrim then this is by far a minor thing by comparison, it's not a large thing, but it's a very welcome thing (at least I think so).

[Stemin]

You do realize a crash to desktop is a failure, probably based on YOUR hardware or software, and has very little to do with Skyrim. Lots of people run the game without much crashing. And usually the ones that do have crashing have started playing with mods and such.

 

In other words, a crash means skyrim failed as a result of something going on in your computer. You don't program a crash.

 

Your whole post is very uninformed, IMO.

 

The only way I know of to do what you're suggesting is to give Steam more power so that it is always keeping track and debugging skyrim, which would take a TON more resources and probably wouldn't let about 50% of the current players play Skyrim on their existing computer setups.

[thompsonar]

I thought there was some sort of dump/log file that was generated when you have a crash? I've only had two (that weren't my fault) so I haven't really looked in to it and could be completely wrong or it could be from some 3rd party software. I just started using Wrye Bash but I thought that you can check for mod conflicts with it so you can deal with them before you crash, is this correct?

[Stemin]

I thought there was some sort of dump/log file that was generated when you have a crash? I've only had two (that weren't my fault) so I haven't really looked in to it and could be completely wrong or it could be from some 3rd party software. I just started using Wrye Bash but I thought that you can check for mod conflicts with it so you can deal with them before you crash, is this correct?

 

Well, that would be a question about wrye bash, not vanilla skyrim, so I can't really answer that one. You should probably ask in the mods forum.

 

Generating a log on a crash isn't really practical because crashes are by nature unpredictable, so how do you know when it's supposed to create a log?

 

What generally happens is it's creating a log ALL the time of any errors that comes up, or like I said, it's an extensive debugging program that runs in the background keeping track of everything the program is doing.

 

And keep in mind, until AI takes over, computers are only as smart as the people writing the software, and sometimes the ones making the hardware as well.

Edited May 29, 2012 by Stemin

[Georgiegril]

In other words, a crash means skyrim failed as a result of something going on in your computer. You don't program a crash.

....

The only way I know of to do what you're suggesting is to give Steam more power so that it is always keeping track and debugging skyrim, which would take a TON more resources and probably wouldn't let about 50% of the current players play Skyrim on their existing computer setups.

 

Agreed. And in addition, it might cause them to put the ixnay on outside modding...forcing us all to (shiver) depend on the Workshop!

 

It is almost funny to me how many people post that "someone" made Skyrim stop working, and demanding that "someone" has to fix it, without realizing the "someone" is them!

[Georgiegril]

PS I did not reply to the poll, as the "choices" are extremely biased toward what the OP wants. I don't have to be "smart enough to instantly know" anything to think that error reporting is not a useful idea.

[rpgjaguar]

Your miss understanding me, Most crashe's I've encountered have been the result of a problem with a mod, not my hardware/software. If that wern't true then Skyrim would crash when I turn every mod off, but it doesn't, Skyrim can crash for many differant reasons and yes conflicts from two mods trying to do somthing can cause a crash and that's what I'm talking about; and you're right, I did add biased questions, but only to get my point across, when skyrim crashes, You have to guess what It could be with a VERY time consuming process of putting one mod on,running skyrim and then seeing if it works or not, either that OR you do know what the problem is.

So far All of my crashes have been becuase of a mod, Which one(s) I don't know So I have to guess and try and work out which one it is, somthing that can take hours.

 

Honestly, If I didn't know better I'd say It's like you don't want an easier time of things and would rather find reasons to leave it as it is.

 

EDIT: And yes, you can use Wyrebash to prevent mod conflicts, but not in all cases., If this were the case then I should not be having problems (wyre bash reads all green) yet my game crashes, I have an idea but nothing exact, this would be easier if skyrim told me what made it crash, as it is, I now have to slog though mod by mod, untill the game works. Now you can't tell me that It would not be better to have skyrim tell you somthing about the crash then just nothing.

Edited May 30, 2012 by rpgjaguar

[Stemin]

Your miss understanding me, Most crashe's I've encountered have been the result of a problem with a mod, not my hardware/software.

 

You do understand that mods are software. Software that YOU put on your computer. YOU caused the crash. Not Bethesda.

 

And everything I said earlier still applies. You can use all the third party software you want to try and manage your mods but at the end of the day if a crash happens, it's still a crash. There's no magical way to just detect what's wrong and put it in a file for you, unless like I said Skyrim was run from within another program that's constantly checking it, taking two times the resources (or more) to get the job done.

 

I don't know what answer you expect. You have a LOT to learn about basic software principles before you start making requests like that.

 

This is exactly why people on this forum continually tell people only add one mod at a time. Run it for a while and make sure everything is stable before adding another mod.

 

There might not even be a conflict between two mods. It could just be your load order.

 

The way I see it you have 3 options.

 

1. Learn how this stuff works and deal with it.

 

2. Pay someone to handle it for you.

 

3. Go to school, learn how to write your own software, and re-invent the wheel and come up with some completely new memory and software management systems that run way more efficiently than anything we have now.

Edited May 30, 2012 by Stemin

[Georgiegril]

And yes, you can use Wyrebash to prevent mod conflicts, but not in all cases

That is because mods are independent pieces of software, created by different individuals. It is actually impossible to expect to be able to run them all together without occasional conflicts, unless you removed the source software and prohibited anyone other than Bethesda game developers to create content.

 

Honestly, If I didn't know better I'd say It's like you don't want an easier time of things and would rather find reasons to leave it as it is.

Absolutely. The price for an almost unlimited number of mods available is that occasionally someone will put a mod out there that includes errors or that does not seamlessly mesh with every other mod I might choose. I am perfectly willing to accept the latter for the former. If that is not a price you are willing to pay, then maybe mods are not for you. They are not for everybody, so play the game in the way that maximizes your enjoyment.

[xlcr]

@rpgjaguar, just wondering what mods you're running, maybe we can help identify which are known to cause issues.

if you're game lol, post the contents of your 'plugins.txt' file here (search for it on your systemdrive).