Little confused about copying to Data folder

[Forehandzebra]

Hi, I'm new to Oblivion for PC and the mods for it. I read the installation instructions for the mods, and most of them tell me to unzip, and copy the files in the archive into the oblivion/data folder. On a couple different occasions, (don't remember off hand, but I'll look tomorrow, just don't feel like going and looking at all the files now), it prompts me if I want to overwrite this, or overwrite that. I don't, and I just stop what I'm doing because I don't want to mess my game up. Was wondering how it worked? I am also using the script extender and OBMM.

 

It's just that I download the mods, and none of them work. I did download Deadly Reflex I think it's called, and had it crash my game to desktop everytime I tried to load my game, but I did manage to get that fixed. But now all the mods I download, for example, I downloaded one called Gorangas Economy System, where you can get a job and all that at inns, and to test it, I went to an inn, and nothing comes up, and that also goes for the other mods I downloaded. I just don't notice any change whatsoever in the world.

 

I also downloaded the Elys speech one as well, and how am I supposed to know if that worked, by the way?

[DocRob]

Hi, I'm new to Oblivion for PC and the mods for it. I read the installation instructions for the mods, and most of them tell me to unzip, and copy the files in the archive into the oblivion/data folder. On a couple different occasions, (don't remember off hand, but I'll look tomorrow, just don't feel like going and looking at all the files now), it prompts me if I want to overwrite this, or overwrite that. I don't, and I just stop what I'm doing because I don't want to mess my game up. Was wondering how it worked? I am also using the script extender and OBMM.

 

It's just that I download the mods, and none of them work. I did download Deadly Reflex I think it's called, and had it crash my game to desktop everytime I tried to load my game, but I did manage to get that fixed. But now all the mods I download, for example, I downloaded one called Gorangas Economy System, where you can get a job and all that at inns, and to test it, I went to an inn, and nothing comes up, and that also goes for the other mods I downloaded. I just don't notice any change whatsoever in the world.

 

I also downloaded the Elys speech one as well, and how am I supposed to know if that worked, by the way?

 

First thing you should do is back up your Oblivion/Data directory (just copy it to another location); it can save you a ton of headaches if a mod overwrites files you didn't want it to. Learned this myself the hard way back when I first started using mods for Morrowind. Having that backup definitely beats having to do a complete re-install, as you can just pluck the individual files/directories right out as needed.

 

In most cases, it's generally going to be safe to click Yes when asked to overwrite, as all this will do is actually add files to the directory; in particular, Meshes, Textures, Sounds, etc. So it's not actually an overwrite but an addition (and believe me, these folders get pretty expansive as you add more mods) and is something you'll be doing a lot.

 

Individual files are a bit trickier as it can depend on file date (which you'll see when it asks if you want to overwrite) or just what the file is replacing; usually its not a good idea to replace an existing file with an older version (though a version of the same size/date isn't a problem), for one, or if you know the file will change something you'd rather not have changed. Most times though you're only going to see that when you update a mod or add one that changes something another mod changed; again, having that backup can save you headaches here (honestly, for me, it's often trial-and-error with mod installation and overwrites.)

 

OBMM is another matter; if I recall correctly it keeps copies of existing files and puts them back if you uninstall a mod installed with OBMM, so letting it overwrite should be safe, but I can't say I've tested that, so someone with more experience would have to answer on that (and I may be totally off the mark.)

 

Reason #1 your mods don't work is likely you didn't install all the files properly; namely not wanting to overwrite.

Reason #2--are you enabling the mods after installing them? OBMM will usually take care of this if you install the mods through it, or you can use the Data Files in the Oblivion launcher, but I recommend using Wrye Bash: http://oblivion.nexusmods.com/mods/22368

 

Wrye Bash is majorly handy, but at its most basic level--setting up mods for use--it's really easy; just click on the Mods tab after you start it, then click the checkboxes next to each mod you want to use. (There's a bit more you can do but for now, that should suffice to get things going.) You'll also want to get BOSS, and run it after you've set up your mods in Wrye Bash; this will sort out your load order and reduce conflicts.

 

As for Elys, you'll need to find a mod that doesn't have voice acting in it; quite a few mods out there rely solely on subtitles and Elys makes sure you can read them. (Not all mods seem to work with Elys though; I've got a few that don't, not sure why.) At the risk of shamelessly plugging my own work :biggrin: you could try this one, Bodies-B-Gone. Just find and talk to Mr. Grimm; if the subtitles show up, Elys is working (I recommend my mod solely because it's one I know works with Elys.)

 

Hopefully that should get you up and running. :thumbsup:

[Forehandzebra]

Thanks for the reply, DocRob. I'm gonna try your tips tomorrow morning. I really appreciate it.

 

One other thing, because of the "overwrite fear" that I had, I was putting the mods in new folders, like for example, say I downloaded a mod named, "FOREHANDZEBRA MOD", I'd create a folder on my desktop, name it after the mod, then extract the .rar into the folder, then proceed to place the folder in the Oblivion/Data folder. I just want to take a stab in the dark and say that that probably doesn't work like I thought it was, huh?

[Lanceor]

Your method of "unzipping somewhere before moving it into Oblivion/Data" will work just as well and is actually quite sensible. You can have a look at the contents before moving it, and if you make a mistake, you can use the Windows Undo function straight away.

[Striker879]

Even though most older mods encourage you to extract the downloaded archive directly to your Oblivion install it's really a bad idea. You've now placed yourself at the mercy of the mod author (and his/her competence).

 

I suggest you download your mods to a named folder, outside of the game folders (I have a separate hard drive for data). If I want Joe's Cool Sword mod then I download to H:\OblivionDownloads\JoesCoolSword. I extract the mod to that same folder (which is 7-Zip's default behavior). This way I can examine the mod's files and folder structure without affecting my game install. If I suspect that Joe's Cool Sword may overwrite some files I can open a second Explorer window with my game folders open and compare (a life saver with some older mods that came packaged with a 'new' for the time BBBed skeleton ... I don't want some old version of the skeleton overwriting my latest and greatest version).

 

Once I'm satisfied with a mod I install using copy and paste from the right click menu. The rule of thumb when copy/pasting folders is always paste into one level higher than you copied (if you copy 'Data' you'll paste into 'Oblivion'). For files you paste into the folder you copied from (if you copy 'skeleton.nif' from 'Data\meshes\characters\_male' then you paste into 'Data\meshes\characters\_male' in your game install).

 

If you read the overwrite message carefully you'll see that it's telling you a folder already exists named Data (for most commonly structured mods). As DocRob mentions it's the folder contents that will be written to your game install, which is what you want if you expect the mod to work. Actually the overwrite message is a clue you can use that you're putting it in the right spot in your game folders (i.e. if you don't get the overwrite message your pasting or extracting to the wrong folder in your game ... pasting 'Data' into 'Data' for example).

[DrakeTheDragon]

Just adding to further eliminate some confusion. You do not put your folder "FOREHANDZEBRA MOD" into "Oblivion/Data" but its "contents". For example when there's a "meshes" or "textures" folder inside or a "FOREHANDZEBRA MOD.ESP", you put those into "Oblivion/Data". That's why on a normal mod install it will always ask you whether to replace/merge (merge is usually what you want) "meshes", "textures" and others of the prominent folders. You don't put "Data" into "Data", "meshes" into "meshes", "textures" into "textures" or any arbitrally named folder containing "Data", "meshes", "textures" or ESPs/ESMs into "Data", or likely the mod will not find those files. The contents from "meshes" have to go into "meshes", from "textures" into "textures", but never those folders themselves. If you see any structure like "Data/Data/textures" or "Data/textures/textures" afterwards, it will very likely not work.

 

Oh, and on a side-note, having a "Data" folder inside your mod package is actually "bad" practice. For usual mods only containing plugins/masterfiles and resource files there's no need to add to the confusion by adding a "Data" folder around the actual contents. You can simply move the contents of the archive ("meshes", "textures", esp files) from your extraction folder into your "Data", folder when there's no "Data" folder needlessly wrapped around them.

OBMM can decipher those package structures and locates the actual files and folders inside such a bogus "Data" folder. Likely BAIN can, too, but I'm not sure. But the gist of it is, a "Data" folder needlessly wrapped around the mod's actual contents inside an archive just isn't necessary and only adds to the confusion for the "I just extract into my data folder"-people.

There are cases where a "Data" folder is required inside your archive though, for example when the mod contains more than just plugins and resource files but also executables like "obse_loader.exe" or other things which need to go into "Oblivion" directly instead of "Oblivion/Data". That's not your regular every-day kind of mods though.

Edited September 17, 2012 by DrakeTheDragon