use of suggestive debate topic title

[xrayy]

so you seriously try to convince me that it makes no difference if your president is a total clown or a capable leader standing for values ?

and you also try to tell me - while the u.s had time to watch what happend in europe doing nothing for pandemic prevention - and germany locked down - it was good in march just to do nothing for prevention like not wearing masks and instead just to say the virus is a china virus ? it really hurts me reading your last post if this is really all what you can say. is the situation in the u.s really so hopeless ? what happened to america ?

[HeyYou]

so you seriously try to convince me that it makes no difference if your president is a total clown or a capable leader standing for values ?

and you also try to tell me - while the u.s had time to watch what happend in europe doing nothing for pandemic prevention - and germany locked down - it was good in march just to do nothing for prevention like not wearing masks and instead just to say the virus is a china virus ? it really hurts me reading your last post if this is really all what you can say. is the situation in the u.s really so hopeless ?

If you read what I actually wrote, instead of interpreting it with your "Dem Goggles", that automatically assumes that I 200% support everything trump does, and believes he can do no wrong....... Maybe we could actually have a discussion here. But no. You need to read your liberal talking points into everything I type, it's actually pointless to continue. So, I'm not going to.

[xrayy]

yes, we have diffrent points of views. i try to give you good arguments for my point of view. and you give not convincing aguments or fatalistic statements to defend the current situation in the u.s. which seems to me just sad.

sorry, but this is my impression. you try to defend a president who has no vision and no strategy and with it the current situation in the u.s. as a result is chaotic and unpredictable. trump even do not try to show any strategy. he only tries to be reelected at all costs and try to act like a 3rd world autocrat, what - thanks god - will not work in a democrathy. this is sad but it is evident.

that is what some republican voters think.

[vegawagon350]

So since the majority of people here are stuck in the false binary of Trunk vs Dems I suppose I'll offer a third alternative.

 

Alternative theory begins now:

1. A dirty sock on your face can't stop a fart, how can it stop a virus.

2. Trunk, Clinton, Bush, Nixon, Ford, FDR, LBJ & Obama are/were all leaders of the same crime cartel known as the United Stated of America which has its corporate headquarters in Washington District of Colombia (which is Legally not a inside the borders of the USA)

2a. By crime I mean they do the following:

2a1. Import / export - Drugs, money, crime, war, poverty, child slavery, slavery, and the list goes on.

3. If your waiting for the New World Order's Army to invade your country, just ask yourself, Does China have active Military base in 134 other countries?

4. The system of Government in the US is not Democracy, it is, has, and remains a Representative Republic.

5. Your vote for president means nothing it is a placebo, the electoral college hires the president candidate that is presented by your Party, that you still don't vote for (Super-pacs anyone?)

6. When you argue politics you are just arguing who has the best prison guard manager

[Perraine]

Unfortunately you actually don't provide "good arguments" just like you didn't in your OP. All you seem to be doing is demonstrating the sad extent of your TDS.

 

And sorry, but I'm not a President Trump supporter or Republican, as I'm not even an American. Personally I think President Trump is a bit of a dickhead and not particularly charismatic or "Presidential". But from what I have seen, and read, he is far and away the lesser evil, when compared to the poisonous, evil snakes that make up the Democratic Party in America.

 

And HeyYou is correct, you can't beat a virus by hiding from it. The lockdowns, the masks, the travel restrictions have done absolutely NOTHING except extend and perpetuate the social and economic devastation that a Pandemic may cause.You may want to cast your myopic gaze over the stats for countries that did NOT precipitate the virus hysteria, you may find them quite enlightening.

While you're at it, you may want to look up the statistics on the many previous "pandemics" that have befallen the modern world, all of which had far, FAR worse mortality rates, across a far wider age range than the current one, yet NONE of them garnered the hysteria and violation of human rights that this latest one has.

 

I guess i could at least take my Tin Foil hat out of storage and ask ... Is is just a coincidence that this has happened in a US election year?

 

Now, certainly during any virus season or outbreak, personal hygiene is important, as is a certain amount of social distancing to avoid infecting those in high risk categories (such as the elderly or the infirm) But that's the best you can do until/if a vaccine is created.

[Shadowheart328]

 

 

And HeyYou is correct, you can't beat a virus by hiding from it. The lockdowns, the masks, the travel restrictions have done absolutely NOTHING except extend and perpetuate the social and economic devastation that a Pandemic may cause.You may want to cast your myopic gaze over the stats for countries that did NOT precipitate the virus hysteria, you may find them quite enlightening.

Nah, this is the dumbest thing I've seen written in this so far, and both of you need to learn how this stuff works before you just start spouting stuff. The point of lock-downs isn't to fight the virus itself, the point is to stop the spread of the virus. The spread. You know, the things that makes a virus become a pandemic. You can't seriously say that lock downs and travel restrictions aren't helpful to stop the spread of a disease. That's why quarantines exist. That's why when you get the flu, you don't go to school, or you stay home on sick leave. It's to stop it from spreading.

[vegawagon350]

 

 

 

And HeyYou is correct, you can't beat a virus by hiding from it. The lockdowns, the masks, the travel restrictions have done absolutely NOTHING except extend and perpetuate the social and economic devastation that a Pandemic may cause.You may want to cast your myopic gaze over the stats for countries that did NOT precipitate the virus hysteria, you may find them quite enlightening.

Nah, this is the dumbest thing I've seen written in this so far, and both of you need to learn how this stuff works before you just start spouting stuff. The point of lock-downs isn't to fight the virus itself, the point is to stop the spread of the virus. The spread. You know, the things that makes a virus become a pandemic. You can't seriously say that lock downs and travel restrictions aren't helpful to stop the spread of a disease. That's why quarantines exist. That's why when you get the flu, you don't go to school, or you stay home on sick leave. It's to stop it from spreading.

 

This is a begging the question fallacy. There is no actual scientific proof that current quarantine at the levels the US has done has prevented any spread of the virus in any measurable way. Your logic fallacy relies on unfounded assertions that you know anything about virology and the spread of viruses beyond what you have been told by CNN/TV News which in itself is a false appeal to authority.

 

Your assertion requires proof that you understand anything about virology and the clinical studies that isolate the exact strain and its propagation within a populace unrestricted vs. quarantined before you can even be considered seriously.

[Shadowheart328]

 

 

 

 

And HeyYou is correct, you can't beat a virus by hiding from it. The lockdowns, the masks, the travel restrictions have done absolutely NOTHING except extend and perpetuate the social and economic devastation that a Pandemic may cause.You may want to cast your myopic gaze over the stats for countries that did NOT precipitate the virus hysteria, you may find them quite enlightening.

Nah, this is the dumbest thing I've seen written in this so far, and both of you need to learn how this stuff works before you just start spouting stuff. The point of lock-downs isn't to fight the virus itself, the point is to stop the spread of the virus. The spread. You know, the things that makes a virus become a pandemic. You can't seriously say that lock downs and travel restrictions aren't helpful to stop the spread of a disease. That's why quarantines exist. That's why when you get the flu, you don't go to school, or you stay home on sick leave. It's to stop it from spreading.

 

This is a begging the question fallacy. There is no actual scientific proof that current quarantine at the levels the US has done has prevented any spread of the virus in any measurable way. Your logic fallacy relies on unfounded assertions that you know anything about virology and the spread of viruses beyond what you have been told by CNN/TV News which in itself is a false appeal to authority.

 

Your assertion requires proof that you understand anything about virology and the clinical studies that isolate the exact strain and its propagation within a populace unrestricted vs. quarantined before you can even be considered seriously.

 

Um...what?

 

For starters, the point of my post was an objection to the statements that quarantine was how the virus is beaten. That isn't the case. Quarantines aren't how you beat a virus, they are how you stop it from spreading, basically containing said virus. And no I'm not a virologist, neither are you guys but apparently you know better than they do because pretty much every virologist agrees that quarantine is the best method of preventing a virus from spreading.

 

 

 

There is no actual scientific proof that current quarantine at the levels the US has done has prevented any spread of the virus in any measurable way

Except there is: I am going to link to a bunch of studies related to viruses and the effectiveness of quarantine. These are doctors, virologists, and health organizations all saying that quarantine is a great way to stop the spread of the disease. In fact, use your damn brain, whenever lockdown happens the cases in an area fall, mutliple countries were able to curb the spread of the virus through sweeping lock downs. This isn't some made up phenomena, the only reason this get's debated is because uninformed people like you jump out of the wood works to act like you know better than virologists and doctors, because your inconvenienced by the lockdown. Well guess what? We all are, people lost jobs, people are suffering socially, it sucks and it's hard. But that's life, sometimes safety isn't comfortable or easy.

 

 

 

Your assertion requires proof that you understand anything about virology and the clinical studies that isolate the exact strain and its propagation within a populace unrestricted vs. quarantined before you can even be considered seriously.

No, it doesn't require proof of my own personal knowledge about virology. Just like it doesn't require proof for you to say quarantines aren't effective......when they clearly are. I mean, you aren't even looking at the data, you're literally talking out of your butt, and want to throw logical fallacies at me? Like you're some pro debater?

 

This is one of the only studies i've found that even tackles whether or not quarantine is effective. And the conclusion is that quarantine is effective, but it all depends on the timing of said quarantine and how well the populace and doctors actually follow it. Basically the reason it is even as bad as it is, is because we waited way to late and didn't quarantine Europeans, and the the reason it's continuing to get worst is because people aren't treating the quarantines and lockdowns seriously. That's it. That's what the research and data is showing.

[vegawagon350]

 

 

 

 

 

And HeyYou is correct, you can't beat a virus by hiding from it. The lockdowns, the masks, the travel restrictions have done absolutely NOTHING except extend and perpetuate the social and economic devastation that a Pandemic may cause.You may want to cast your myopic gaze over the stats for countries that did NOT precipitate the virus hysteria, you may find them quite enlightening.

Nah, this is the dumbest thing I've seen written in this so far, and both of you need to learn how this stuff works before you just start spouting stuff. The point of lock-downs isn't to fight the virus itself, the point is to stop the spread of the virus. The spread. You know, the things that makes a virus become a pandemic. You can't seriously say that lock downs and travel restrictions aren't helpful to stop the spread of a disease. That's why quarantines exist. That's why when you get the flu, you don't go to school, or you stay home on sick leave. It's to stop it from spreading.

 

This is a begging the question fallacy. There is no actual scientific proof that current quarantine at the levels the US has done has prevented any spread of the virus in any measurable way. Your logic fallacy relies on unfounded assertions that you know anything about virology and the spread of viruses beyond what you have been told by CNN/TV News which in itself is a false appeal to authority.

 

Your assertion requires proof that you understand anything about virology and the clinical studies that isolate the exact strain and its propagation within a populace unrestricted vs. quarantined before you can even be considered seriously.

 

Um...what?

 

For starters, the point of my post was an objection to the statements that quarantine was how the virus is beaten. That isn't the case. Quarantines aren't how you beat a virus, they are how you stop it from spreading, basically containing said virus. And no I'm not a virologist, neither are you guys but apparently you know better than they do because pretty much every virologist agrees that quarantine is the best method of preventing a virus from spreading.

 

 

 

There is no actual scientific proof that current quarantine at the levels the US has done has prevented any spread of the virus in any measurable way

Except there is: I am going to link to a bunch of studies related to viruses and the effectiveness of quarantine. These are doctors, virologists, and health organizations all saying that quarantine is a great way to stop the spread of the disease. In fact, use your damn brain, whenever lockdown happens the cases in an area fall, mutliple countries were able to curb the spread of the virus through sweeping lock downs. This isn't some made up phenomena, the only reason this get's debated is because uninformed people like you jump out of the wood works to act like you know better than virologists and doctors, because your inconvenienced by the lockdown. Well guess what? We all are, people lost jobs, people are suffering socially, it sucks and it's hard. But that's life, sometimes safety isn't comfortable or easy.

 

 

 

Your assertion requires proof that you understand anything about virology and the clinical studies that isolate the exact strain and its propagation within a populace unrestricted vs. quarantined before you can even be considered seriously.

No, it doesn't require proof of my own personal knowledge about virology. Just like it doesn't require proof for you to say quarantines aren't effective......when they clearly are. I mean, you aren't even looking at the data, you're literally talking out of your butt, and want to throw logical fallacies at me? Like you're some pro debater?

 

This is one of the only studies i've found that even tackles whether or not quarantine is effective. And the conclusion is that quarantine is effective, but it all depends on the timing of said quarantine and how well the populace and doctors actually follow it. Basically the reason it is even as bad as it is, is because we waited way to late and didn't quarantine Europeans, and the the reason it's continuing to get worst is because people aren't treating the quarantines and lockdowns seriously. That's it. That's what the research and data is showing.

 

I've been trying to find a way to be nice with my response but I can't help you. I will forgive you your personal attacks as I see you are clearly emotionally tied to this topic and it has affected your ability to reason. I will not be bothering you again with trivialities such as "That is not an argument" or "your assertion relies on a assumption based on supposition". You clearly believe that everything an authority tells you is true and that in no instance would any agency supported by Government mislead you in any way.

 

I hope your blind faith in Government and those it supports proves to be beneficial to you in the future.

[HeyYou]

But we HAVEN'T stopped it from spreading. The numbers are still off the board. I note that the republican convention was blames for a spike in numbers, but, no one talks about what is happening after all the protest marches. Isn't that interesting.

 

We CAN'T stop the spread. We can slow it down some, and that's it. And maybe not even that........ We are still going to end up with the same number of infections. We *might* reduce the body count some, but, that is the best we can hope for. The whole idea behind the quarantine/lockdown/whathaveyou was to SLOW the spread, so hospitals weren't overwhelmed with patients all at once.

 

Currently, we don't have a vaccine, so, slowing the spread is ALL we can do. Of course, by doing so, we are doing horrid things to our economy...... there are going to be a large number of businesses that simply don't re-open when all is said and done. Recovery is going to take YEARS. Not to mention what it's doing to the national debt....... Although, I really didn't see the point of giving everyone on unemployment an extra 600 bucks a WEEK.... For a significant percentage of them, they are making more on unemployment, than they were when they were working.... What motivation are they going to have to actually go back to work, once the opportunity presents itself? Heck, I don't make 2400 dollars a month...... I would LOVE to be able to collect unemployment. (my job was considered 'essential', so, I still have work once in a while. But, I was part time anyway, so, I don't think I qualified. )

 

For what it's worth, I don't think Donnie is very bright, or very presidential either. I still liked him better than Hilary........ and that is the ONLY reason I voted for him.

 

But, folks here seem to only believe in black and white. You either hate him with every fiber of your being, or, you are a 'worshiper'..... No middle ground at all. One of the reasons that 'debates' here, never turn out well.