LE Argonian Improvements

[Derok]

Maybe a little too late, but I want to say that the Naga race idea remains abandoned (I just gathered some information and concepts, not much), since I don't have enought modding skills to make it happening (for now). For now enjoy this awesome mod, Unique Beast Races, still wip:

http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/935973-unique-beast-races-wip/

The ultimate mod for beast lovers, both Argonians and Khajiits will be redone to a digitigrade form, but a lot better looking than Morrowind ones!

And also more to come...

Edited May 4, 2013 by Derok

[ElvenHeroine]

A good idea is to also maybe work on the different breeds or sub-races of Argonians as well.

 

You have Agacephs, Archeins, Nagas, Sarpus, and Paatrus as well as the Tsaesci (which some suspect is related to Argonians) and the Dragh which is a new modded race facilitated strictly in Skyrim.

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img4/5617/agacepha.jpg

 

Agaceph

 

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img809/7430/archeinf.jpg

 

Archein

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img809/3143/nagac.jpg

 

Naga

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img42/3375/paatrua.jpg

 

Paatru (Some work needs to be done on the face and the horns should be more Argonian and less Daedric)

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img9/2627/sarpuc.png

 

Sarpu (Refer to the Drakien mod that is available)

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img22/6274/tsaescic.jpg

 

Tsaesci (No Horns)

 

http://imageshack.us/a/img849/702/dragh.jpg

 

Dragh (No Horns, plated scale heads, lore friendly, but not lore derived, it would be amazing to think of how Argonians would evolve after being refugees in Skyrim)

 

Those are my ideas on how to expand the Argonian race to have a little bit more variety and to some extent lore friendliness.

 

EDITED:

 

What I was thinking is that each breed should have its own uniqueness further included like the shape of their feet and hands, their tails, if they have one, and more.

 

Strictly speaking, the Naga should be the least human looking type of Argonian, thereby having strict raptor type of feet. The Agaceph, Dragh, and the Paatru are sort of hybrid in this regard, not as raptor looking, while the Sarpu, Archein, and Tscaesci have dynamically human looking feet, just with a more reptilian sort of skin. Horns are also different on each race with certain races not having any at all (the Dragh).

 

Or simply noted

 

Raptor feet for Nagas

 

Plantigrade Feet for Agacephs, Draghs, and Paatrus

 

Reptilian feet for Sarpus, Archeins, and Tscaescis

 

Of course that is just feet, I have to consider the other material, but I am sure good ole' Derok will come up with something amazing to allow Argonian Breed differentiation.

 

I also want to add height specification as well.

 

Nagas should be about Eight feet tall. One of the tallest races.

 

Agacephs and Draghs should be about 5 and half feet tall, close to where Argonians currently stand.

 

Paatrus are about the height of a Nord

 

Sarpus are five feet tall, sort of short like Bosmer or rather the Adoring Fan type of Bosmer.

 

Archeins slightly taller than Imperials, but shorter than Paatrus.

 

Tscaescis should be on par with Altmer in terms of their height.

Edited May 5, 2013 by ElvenHeroine

[Drohung]

Just to say, I'm working on argonian hairstyles, such as new horns, some frills, new quill styles, etc.

 

If anyone has any argonian hairstyle concepts, I'd be happy to work on modeling them!

 

As long as it's not real, human-like hair. I won't do work on actual hair for argonians.

[Derok]

@ElvenHeroine Agaceph: still don't understand what kind of crazy faces they should have, so I don't know. Archein: they are not a particular type of breed, just a powerful rank of Argonians. So they don't have an unique appearance. They look like normal Argonians.

Naga: an interesting race, they feel really unique. their heads should be shaped like snakes, with round eyes, lacking of eyelids. Paatru: Maybe a similar appearance to Sload, but slimmer and less ugly faces. Sarpa: they are "winged" but this doesn't mean they can fly, probably they have frills like this lizard:

 

http://www.varbak.com/images/photos-winged-lizard-nb18980.jpg

 

Tsaesci: seems fitting, though in my opinion they don't have legs, but a snake tail.

Dragh: I don't like much this idea. They don't really feel lore-friendly. Also they are not unique enought, just bigger slightly recolored Argonians. Their role can be easily taken by Naga.

 

About human looking Argonians. They are heavily mutated by the Hist sap. Skin tone and appearance similar to Dark Elves, but no pointy ears and colorful hair. Pretty much like Arena. Never player that game, just a thought.

 

http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/www.ign.com/9109/2011/08/Argonian_Arena.jpg

 

Also, there's another type of Argonians. Legendary beings, with tree-like appearance. The closest reference I can find are the Spriggans. Probably, the amount of ingested Hist sap was really large.

My knowledge comes from The Elder Scrolls offical wiki, I'm sure is the most valid lore-friendly wiki.

I'm quite a lore nazi. :smile:

 

Also, thanks for listing my mod.

Edited May 7, 2013 by Derok

[Danidragon]

Uhm,I'd also like to note here that Drachis Argonians description was updated and that Drachis allows whatever use of the mod . Someone may continue it ?

[Drohung]

Thanks for the update on that, Dani. I've been waiting for permissions to use that mod... *cracks knuckles* Now, time to get to work using my measly-but-good-enough texturing skills!

[necromanzee]

Oh my land, all my agreement and support for this thread. I've been wanting to try to teach myself how to 3D model for a while, for the sole purpose of making new "hair" types for Argonians. Longer feathers, more and shorter horns, quills, frills, fins--! It's just such a delight to see that there are people on the ball with this. :)

 

I'll see if I can't whip myself into some sort of shape to contribute to this endeavor. :)

[Drohung]

I've produced a few new hairstyles recently. Once I'm done with my Argonian Assassin armor and my skin for the Flight Rising web game, I'll be fixing their texturing to upload pics.

[ElvenHeroine]

@ElvenHeroine Agaceph: still don't understand what kind of crazy faces they should have, so I don't know. Archein: they are not a particular type of breed, just a powerful rank of Argonians. So they don't have an unique appearance. They look like normal Argonians.

Naga: an interesting race, they feel really unique. their heads should be shaped like snakes, with round eyes, lacking of eyelids. Paatru: Maybe a similar appearance to Sload, but slimmer and less ugly faces. Sarpa: they are "winged" but this doesn't mean they can fly, probably they have frills like this lizard:

 

http://www.varbak.com/images/photos-winged-lizard-nb18980.jpg

 

Tsaesci: seems fitting, though in my opinion they don't have legs, but a snake tail.

Dragh: I don't like much this idea. They don't really feel lore-friendly. Also they are not unique enought, just bigger slightly recolored Argonians. Their role can be easily taken by Naga.

 

About human looking Argonians. They are heavily mutated by the Hist sap. Skin tone and appearance similar to Dark Elves, but no pointy ears and colorful hair. Pretty much like Arena. Never player that game, just a thought.

 

http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/www.ign.com/9109/2011/08/Argonian_Arena.jpg

 

Also, there's another type of Argonians. Legendary beings, with tree-like appearance. The closest reference I can find are the Spriggans. Probably, the amount of ingested Hist sap was really large.

My knowledge comes from The Elder Scrolls offical wiki, I'm sure is the most valid lore-friendly wiki.

I'm quite a lore nazi. :smile:

 

Also, thanks for listing my mod.

 

Well I am looking at it in a lore sort of manner.

 

"Also, there's another type of Argonians. Legendary beings, with tree-like appearance. The closest reference I can find are the Spriggans. Probably, the amount of ingested Hist sap was really large."

 

Well I haven't heard of them.

 

"About human looking Argonians. They are heavily mutated by the Hist sap. Skin tone and appearance similar to Dark Elves, but no pointy ears and colorful hair. Pretty much like Arena. Never player that game, just a thought."

 

Those are Paatrus. The major Argonian Breed with a flat, almost toad looking face are the Paatrus.

 

http://oyster.ignimgs.com/wordpress/www.ign.com/9109/2011/08/Argonian_Arena.jpg

 

Those are Paatrus.

 

"Dragh: I don't like much this idea. They don't really feel lore-friendly. Also they are not unique enought, just bigger slightly recolored Argonians. Their role can be easily taken by Naga."

 

Well it is not a monarchy, so it doesn't really matter so long as someone does like it. Someone can always take whatever mod you make and make whatever changes they like. I actually do like and it is lore friendly if there is a fifth age in which the Argonians who migrated to Skyrim (those in Windhelm) stayed long enough to evolve to be better able to live in Windhelm's environment, which is what the Dragh are suppose to be. Just as the Skyrim Khajiit or Faliit (Fal meaning Snow and -iit meaning those who dwell or reside) would be .

 

Falmer are just Skyrim's Bosmer just so you know and the Ayleids are just the Bosmer of Cyrodiil. This proven by the fact they use the same language and refer to themselves as Che, not mer, which means they are not core mer, but part of the macro-mer race. Nevertheless, the Che subrace, separate from the Dwemer subrace and the Core Mer Race (Dunmer and Altmer) as well as the Orc (Orsimer) subrace.

 

Much of the lore is mostly mythology like wheter Aldmeris is real or whether Lorkhan is a Daedra, Aedra, or Et'Ada. Whether the moons, Nirn, or whatever actually comes from Lorkhan.

 

I think we think too much like Comic Book Geeks and obsess in lore too much as fact like Christians who estrange themselves from the bible that we don't understand that all the lore is wrong, because none of the races know really what they actually are and accept whatever is told to them, otherwise they would susceptible be to the Daedric Prince of Knowledge and Raping Japanese School Girls with his so many black tentacles. Or they would succumb to the same fate as the Dwemer, who probably do know everything but sought to turn their entire race into energy to fuel a massive golem, which Tiber Septim used to conquer Tamriel, Numidium. So you have to take whatever everyone says in all of Tamriel as half-truths, because it is discouraged to actually seek the truth in Tamriel due to those two factors I just pointed out.

 

"Agaceph: still don't understand what kind of crazy faces they should have, so I don't know."

 

Dude, just use the stuff I provided already.

 

"Archein: they are not a particular type of breed"

 

That is incorrect.

 

"just a powerful rank of Argonians."

 

Argonians don't live in ranks. They live in breeds, silly. There is no lore material suggesting that they divide society into classes like the Nords and Imperials or by rank of military service like the Thalmor and Imperials. The Argonians are an Organic "race" that divides their society by breed. Each breed has unique abilities and characteristics, which makes them more useful for certain abilities over others.

 

The Archeins are the masters of the mind, thus they rule over the others. The Agacephs are the workers (thus why they are susceptible to slave trade between the Archeins and the Dark Elves, the Nagas are the soldiers, the Sarpu are the scouts, and the Paatru (well I don't know what they are used for).

 

"So they don't have an unique appearance. They look like normal Argonians."

 

Well if you look at my images I had listed you would notice what I said they should look. STOP skimming through everything I TYPE.

"Naga: an interesting race, they feel really unique. their heads should be shaped like snakes, with round eyes, lacking of eyelids."

 

I think what I had listed fits well enough. No need for two Tsaescis.

 

 

"Tsaesci: seems fitting, though in my opinion they don't have legs, but a snake tail."

 

I think it is better if they could transform. It is better if you have races that can transform, creating more lore to them. So like the Tsaesci for instance can have two legs that morth into a tail for quick movement to escape from hostiles or to fight in a fast horseriding sort of manner. But then they can morth their tail into two feet in order to mate and walk around or to fight without the need for running away or ambushing from a distance at fast speed. That sort of like balances the advantages and disadvantages to having a tail, plus it gives them more than just being a bunch of Lamias.

 

 

"Paatru: Maybe a similar appearance to Sload"

 

Ah no. I don't know who told you that or why you think something like that up, but that is wrong. Sloads are Slug-Toad mix looking people. Paatrus are simply toad looking in the face. Aside from that they are Argonian just like Archeins and Agacephs.

 

 

 

"Sarpa: they are "winged" but this doesn't mean they can fly, probably they have frills like this lizard"

 

Frills are not wings. Stop thinking of Jurassic Park. And I think using much of the content that is already available avoids the need for much work. What I keep hearing from you is rather dementing and lack of constructive criticism. Much of it you sound like a thirteen year old, which I am not even sure you are aware of or you are semi-conscious about.

Edited June 18, 2013 by ElvenHeroine

[Derok]

So is yours a constructive criticism? Mine are just personal thoughts, and you attacked me calling me an ignorant. My source is mostly from the official wiki. For example the wiki says:

 

Archein was a position created by the Septim Empire in the Imperial province of Black Marsh.

Their ranks were generally composed of native Argonians who had assimilated into the Imperial culture.

 

Remember, this is a discussion.

 

PS: The lizard really exists, and it's called winged lizard.

Edited June 18, 2013 by Derok