An informative article about Female Boob armor...

[MightyZ0G]

I find the spikes and wings on helms more unrealistic.

 

a decent blow that would otherwise miss or glance off can hit one of those and damn near break your neck.

[BaadKaarma]

1. There's also no fat people, starving skinny people, dwarves (not the race but people with dwarfism), no people mutilated from the war (amputees where are you?) and children cannot die (with a mod). All the men ar built like body-builders and the women are model-skinny. They are designed to appeal to the largest market for these types of games; men. Specifically young men. The men represent what they want to look like and the women what they want their women to look like (obviously I am generalizing). It's a game, you bought it, so it must not bother you too much.

[ZeroKing]

A simple solution: make your own armour.

 

Take up Blender, Nifskope and learn to use the CK, and you make more use of your time making "immersive" or "realistic" armors for yourself instead of the "fantasy" or "skimpy" armors some of you dislike so much. Trust me, it's frustrating at first, but the learning process for armor mods and such gets better and fun, especially when you see your finished products. Heck, you can even publish your work here on Nexus. Everyone wins.

Edited May 8, 2013 by ZeroKing

[billyro]

 

• The first thing is, when designing fantasy worlds, a writer will always come across the issue of believability. In order to accept something fantastical and maintain immersion, you need to base it on a certain amount of realism otherwise it will be impossible to empathise with the characters and the story.

 

On a very basic level, this is why in most fantasy worlds, gravity works to hold things down and living people breathe air. This is why fantasy world people are not usually amorphous indescribable blobs who have no human traits, living in an amorphous blob-world which conforms to none of the known laws of physics, where the story conforms to no literary conventions (and I'm talking really simple conventions like, things happen and there are characters)-- they'd be impossible to empathise with.

 

You can do a bunch of things that are irrelevant to the main storyline in this game for the sake of role-playing and immersion. Pretty much the only thing you can't do in Skyrim is take a s***, and there are buckets under and near the beds, if you look carefully. (Something to bear in mind the next time you put a bucket over an NPC's head so you can steal all their things.) Why do you think there are grates in the street that lead to running water in Solitude, or sewers under the boardwalks in Riften?

 

In a nutshell, you need some things to be realistic in order to accept the things that are completely unrealistic. We can only suspend our disbelief so far.

 

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• The second thing is that if we can believe that there are dragons, then just as we can believe in boob plates, we can believe in no boob plates. This works both ways.

 

In fact, I'd say it's much more lore-friendly to have no boob plates. If women can be guards, hunters, soldiers, housecarls, assassins, bandits, sellswords, and warriors-- Bethesda is not a group of complete tools and recognises that not making women feel constantly undermined essentially gives them about a 100% larger potential customer base-- then in-universe it makes no sense to provide them with non-functional armor.

 

(On an actual realism note, this world is clearly previous to the invention of sports bras. Just so anyone who doesn't own breasts knows, having them jiggle about is in fact very painful, can lead to severe bruising, and would majorly get in your way when fighting. You would probably bind them down or wear stiff padding under your armor, which would give you anything from a flat silhouette to a kind of boob-loafish look. Funnily enough this means that the Blades armor probably has one of the most believable chest pieces if nothing else. Sure, it's not sexy or flattering, but that isn't the point of armor.)

 

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• The third thing is that it's a lazy appeal to sexuality. It's breaking immersion in a game which is largely about immersion and it sticks out more than the Wilhelm scream.

 

I don't feel it's on the same level as four-foot shoulder spikes. Making a character look cool is one thing. I can forgive that. Skyrim is a game designed to make us feel cool. It's a game about having a vicarious power trip and in many way that is its appeal.

 

The female armor has a lot of "just for cool" too. Armor is designed to be both functional and scary-looking. It gives you a larger physical presence. Shoulder spikes obscure your figure-- they give you huge-looking shoulders, adding to the appearance of strength-- and look, well, spiky. It'd hurt to be on the receiving end of a tackle from someone wearing Daedric armor. It's a lot like being a hedgehog. (If you want to get through a door, you... turn your shoulders*. I don't think armor is really meant to be worn indoors anyway, though.)

 

On the other hand, breasts are a very vulnerable part of the human form. You don't have to masculinise your figure to look scary-- femininity can be just as powerful-- but it isn't terror-inspiring to mold armor to the exact shape of the female torso. It implies nakedness, which looks vulnerable, and that isn't the same thing as looking cool. It purposefully makes female characters look weaker and more vulnerable than male characters, which I don't appreciate.

 

Is the feminine figure/breasts being considered synonymous with weakness bound up in a lot of sexism? Is it a social convention? Yes. It doesn't make it unimportant any more than a bank note being a piece of printed paper means that you'd happily flush it down the toilet.

 

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• Lastly I don't complain about a game in which, say, dragons are largely the antagonists and the game is about killing them and eating their souls, because dragons don't exist. No dragons are being affected by this design choice.

   

  Women, on the other hand, do exist, and media reflects and informs society. When all my high-level armor choices are about comically overemphasising that yes, my character is indeed the proud owner of two breasts despite the fact that in real life this would kill her, I hear the following: "You are a piece of meat and how sexy you are is more important than your life itself."

Sure, some gamer women want their female characters to be sexy, and that's fine. I like to make sexy women characters now and again too, not least because sexy women exist. My thief archer lady is damn sexy in that form-fitting Nightingale armor (which looks like it's made of metal-reinforced leather so I consider that much fairer game than plate armor). On the other hand, unsexy women also exist, and if I'm playing a big bald Nord tank lady built like a barn and taller than anyone else in Skyrim** (thank you, PC gaming), I want her to look like a walking tank-- someone you would absolutely not want bearing down on you with her battleaxe held aloft, taking all your blows like it's nothing. Cartoonishly oversized boob plates just don't do it.

 

I want some armor for my character. And I want it to look like it fundamentally works as armor, yes, even if it's covered in shoulder spikes.

 

You can keep your boob plates, I'm not denying you boob plates. I just personally don't want them. How about for once, we get sensible vanilla armor and leave it to the modders to give us giant boob cup chestplates? (Come on, the Ebony armor boob cups are like twice as big as my character's underlying boobs.) And let's not have the forum staff telling us we need to see a specialist because we're tired of seeing the same old in a game which aims to make medieval fantasy fresh.

 

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*Unless you are literally controlled by Skyrim's AI, like that ancient frost atronach in Auri-el's temple that was desperately trying to run at me through a too-tight tunnel while I casually stood around just out of its reach and yol-toor-shul'd it back to Oblivion.

 

**Which I personally find pretty damn sexy myself, but each to their own.

 

Everything she said. This sums it up perfectly: just how I feel about this issue.

[Derok]

There's a mod that removes breast cups on the stel plate armor, sadly I don't remember his name.

The sad thing is that Bethesda based this game more on comics and what is generally considered "cool" rather than actual TES lore or realism.

I don't hate armors like studded, hide or forsworn, since they are for bandits and supposed to look feral. But 3D breast on plate armors are plain stupid.

Edited May 9, 2013 by Derok

[TheObstinateNoviceSmith]

@ghoulrainbow

 

I was tempted to address every aspect of your well written post, and perhaps in the future I will, but for right now I am just curious.

 

Did it equally offend you that in the vanilla game there were no women with large breasts when there are women with large breasts or that only the bar-maid outfits really showed any of a woman's shape?

[Tidus44]

I too am one who is completely frustrated with the lack of realism that exists in fantasy games and especially the fantasy game Skyrim. This anti-realism stance taken by the game developers just breaks immersion and is not lore friendly whatsoever.

 

I mean look at the glass and ebony armor. Honestly, who would want armor made out of volcanic glass? Not only is it highly doubtful it would protect someone, but even if one could make armor from volcanic glass no one would be able to stand up or move in it. Every time I see some NPC walking around in glass or ebony armor like they were wearing casual clothes, the immersion just breaks for me.

 

And can someone explain how water flows out of the top of the highest point on a mountain to create a water fall that never diminishes in volume or pressure? Have a look at Whiterun sometime and explain how that water flow is realistic. Not only completely immersion breaking because it isn't realistic, but it isn't lore friendly either.

 

I also get frustrated by the unreality of someone being able to produce fire (or frost or electricity) from nothing and throw it from their hands or a staff.

They throw fire from their hands! From! Their! Hands!

I don't find this to be realistic but, then I think maybe I'm not living on the right part of the world where it is possible to do this.

 

And what about getting married? You get married and your spouse goes off and does whatever and you never have a meaningful conversation with your spouse who loves you and who would want you to stop living dangerously and settle down on a farm someplace and raise crops and kids and be home every night or at the very least have you help out a bit at the store. So completely unrealistic and immersion breaking. Not very lore friendly either.

 

There is a lack of realism pretty much anywhere one looks in the game (see BaadKaarma's post for more on this), and I agree with the author of the article posted by the OP who made the point that, "Science says....."

This is exactly what I want from the fantasy games I buy and play. I want real world lessons on science and physics and social culture that don't break immersion and that are lore friendly.

 

The one thing I do wonder about though is why those who want realism and immersion and believable lore in their game always point out female armor as an issue and never anything else about females? Which brings me to my biggest concern of realism in a fantasy game set in a middle age or medieval time frame that is so immersion breaking and lore unfriendly. I want realistic females. Ones who know their place. And that isn't out adventuring.

I want females to be under the thumb of their father or husband or some male relative and treated like chattel. Women who do as they're told.

Female guards or soldiers, no way. Just another unrealistic immersion breaking lore unfriendly aspect that needs to be changed.

Joining a guild? Not permitted. Maybe go be a nun, but allowed to join a guild and work - no way.

See some female throwing fire around? Witch!!! Hang her, tie a big rock to her and toss her in the water and see if she floats.

The idea that any woman would buy a store or inn or own a farm or any property is also just immersion breaking and so lore unfriendly that it is ridiculous. Owning property? I don't think so. Maybe a widow if the Jarl lets her under the watchful eye of a man.

I want females sitting at home spinning and knitting and doing housework, raising the kids and working on the farm and looking after her husband or a man who will make sure she does what she is supposed to be doing. Maybe a little bit of helping out at a store.

 

Now that's realism that doesn't break immersion or lore.

[Monkinsane]

I too am one who is completely frustrated with the lack of realism that exists in fantasy games and especially the fantasy game Skyrim. This anti-realism stance taken by the game developers just breaks immersion and is not lore friendly whatsoever.

 

I mean look at the glass and ebony armor. Honestly, who would want armor made out of volcanic glass? Not only is it highly doubtful it would protect someone, but even if one could make armor from volcanic glass no one would be able to stand up or move in it. Every time I see some NPC walking around in glass or ebony armor like they were wearing casual clothes, the immersion just breaks for me.

 

And can someone explain how water flows out of the top of the highest point on a mountain to create a water fall that never diminishes in volume or pressure? Have a look at Whiterun sometime and explain how that water flow is realistic. Not only completely immersion breaking because it isn't realistic, but it isn't lore friendly either.

 

I also get frustrated by the unreality of someone being able to produce fire (or frost or electricity) from nothing and throw it from their hands or a staff.

They throw fire from their hands! From! Their! Hands!

I don't find this to be realistic but, then I think maybe I'm not living on the right part of the world where it is possible to do this.

 

And what about getting married? You get married and your spouse goes off and does whatever and you never have a meaningful conversation with your spouse who loves you and who would want you to stop living dangerously and settle down on a farm someplace and raise crops and kids and be home every night or at the very least have you help out a bit at the store. So completely unrealistic and immersion breaking. Not very lore friendly either.

 

There is a lack of realism pretty much anywhere one looks in the game (see BaadKaarma's post for more on this), and I agree with the author of the article posted by the OP who made the point that, "Science says....."

This is exactly what I want from the fantasy games I buy and play. I want real world lessons on science and physics and social culture that don't break immersion and that are lore friendly.

 

The one thing I do wonder about though is why those who want realism and immersion and believable lore in their game always point out female armor as an issue and never anything else about females? Which brings me to my biggest concern of realism in a fantasy game set in a middle age or medieval time frame that is so immersion breaking and lore unfriendly. I want realistic females. Ones who know their place. And that isn't out adventuring.

I want females to be under the thumb of their father or husband or some male relative and treated like chattel. Women who do as they're told.

Female guards or soldiers, no way. Just another unrealistic immersion breaking lore unfriendly aspect that needs to be changed.

Joining a guild? Not permitted. Maybe go be a nun, but allowed to join a guild and work - no way.

See some female throwing fire around? Witch!!! Hang her, tie a big rock to her and toss her in the water and see if she floats.

The idea that any woman would buy a store or inn or own a farm or any property is also just immersion breaking and so lore unfriendly that it is ridiculous. Owning property? I don't think so. Maybe a widow if the Jarl lets her under the watchful eye of a man.

I want females sitting at home spinning and knitting and doing housework, raising the kids and working on the farm and looking after her husband or a man who will make sure she does what she is supposed to be doing. Maybe a little bit of helping out at a store.

 

Now that's realism that doesn't break immersion or lore.

 

 

Your being sarcastic right? If you are BRILLIANT!! LOL hahahahaha!

[Tidus44]

Your being sarcastic right? If you are BRILLIANT!! LOL hahahahaha!

 

Small attempt at some sarcastic humor, yes.

[ZoMHead]

Yeah, I'm thinking of all the chain mail thong bikini wearing players out there. Your "sexy" armor will get your lady killed!!!!

 

http://www.tor.com/blogs/2013/05/boob-plate-armor-would-kill-you

 

First of all, i like CBBE/UNP shapes in game, but i never supported those "skimpy" armours, thongs, tops etc.

 

Secondly, i love the fact that ONE article on the INTERNET mentioned something related to SCIENCE must be true. You can get a PhD from some online quack you know?

 

Never believe everything you read, watch and listen online, you can even spot mistakes on wikis FYI.