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Everything posted by jaime74
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Hi all, I have strange problems getting sound files to play, no matter whether I am using the vanilla StreamMusic function or the more sophisticated "PlayMusicFile" function from scantis SoundCommands add-on. At first I thought this would be a problem of StreamMusic only, but it doesn't work with PlayMusicFile either. So I guess there must be some issue with file paths, though I can't find the clue. I am wondering if anybody has faced this problem, too. What I do looks like this (both alternatives I have tested): StreamMusic "Data\Music\MyMusic\MyMusicFile.mp3"or PlayMusicFile "Data\Music\MyMusic\MyMusicFile.mp3" The code is executed from within a quest script in the "gameMode" block, once whenever the player enters the specific cell. I always face the same effect: With StreamMusic, the current music, that was playing before, fades out, pauses for some seconds, and then another track from the same type (public, dungeon or default, depending what is defined for the cell) starts playing again. According to the documentation, this should only happen when the track to play cannot be found, e.g. due to an invalid filename or path. With PlayMusicFile, nothing happens at all. I suppose that the reason in both cases is the same. After hours of experimenting, I don't know what might cause this. I tried everything I could imagine to exclude whatever reason comes to my mind: - I am absolutely sure that my file path is correct! I tried every possible combination, including both full and relative paths, both upper and lower case directory names, both custom and vanilla sound files, both forward and backward slashes, both mp3 and wav files etc. - I also checked this on three different computers, always with the same effect. - My sound system in general is working fine, I am even using BetterMusicSystem and SoundCommands without any issues, so I suppose that this is not a general sound problem. Disabling BetterMusicSystem and SoundCommands doesn't help either. - I checked for all types of cell music (Public, Dungeon, Default). - I also tried the workaround for "Default" type cells, which is explained in the documentation (in the TES CS Wiki, as linked above) for StreamMusic (i.e. call StreeamMusic random, then wait for some frames, then call StreamMusic <my file>). This showed exactly the same behaviour (fade out - pause - fade in of the next random track). But the cell in which I need to stream my custom file is of type "Public" anyway. - Inside the cell which I am talking about, there's absolutely no enemy, no combat, no teleporting, load dorrs or whatever. This means, any of the well-known reasons that cause StreamMusic to interrrupt (i.e. combat, change cell etc.) cannot be the reason of the problem. In conclusion, I suppose that for some very very weird reason my game engine can't find the sound files. but please note again that it makes no difference if I try to start a custom or one of the plain vanilla sound files. So I guess it's not the files, but rather something related to the paths. But I don't know... Can anybody help me?
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Hi myrmaad, You're right. I guess I misread that. When I was talking about using Wrye Bash to "break"/"work around" the regular load ordering, I was thinking of "importing" only, which I understand to be a means to explicitely extract certain records from a mod and place it into the Bashed Patch and thus at the very end of the load order. But as I understand now, hopefully (after lots of reading), importing is only a very special aspect of the Bashed Patch mechanism. My problem is that I don't need to create such "working guilds" in terms of gameplay: They won't have any visible appearance (like guild houses, dialogues, quests or whatever). It's just a technical solution for being able to detect whether the player is talking to a "smith" or to a "book vendor", so that I don't need to define multiple conditions, checking for a long list of specific NPC names. I'd be very glad if there was an easier solution. But as I don't know a better one so far, I have to understand Wrye Bash, which is very fascinating as well ! ;-)
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Well, yes. I think "faction injection" is a good term for what I am trying to achieve. Maybe I was thinking in far too complicated ways. All I really need is a "patch" (or whatever we may call it) that injects certain faction memberships into certain NPCs' faction list - without killing any other mods' faction assignments. Now I suppose that my solution could also be as simple as this (I am still optimistic): 1. remove the custom faction assignments from my main esp (the one called MyQuest.esp above) 2. redefine the faction assignments in another esp (MyQuestFactions.esp) 3. just MERGE MyQuestFactions.esp into the Bashed Patch (i.e. without any tagging, importing etc.), and deactivate it. Could it be that easy? Or am I completely confused now? If someone would't want to use Wrye Bash to play my mod, he or she could still place MyQuestFactions.esp as a regular esp in the load order (ensuring that it loads after MyQuest.esp). This would mean no full garantuee that there won't be conflicts, but I guess that without Wrye Bash such a user would face similar problems with other mods, too, so I probably would't need to worry.
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Well now... I tried to do some homework ;-) After reading and -hopefully, partially - understanding "Filtering", I can now imagine the following solution to my "custom factions" challenge. Let's see whether the experts here consider this a good solution, or rather complete rubbish ;-) What do I want to do? - create a custom faction (let's call it "My Faction"), which I need for my quest - add this faction to a vanilla NPC defined in Oblivion.esm (let's call him "Baurus") In my vanilla way of thinking (i.e. prior to using and trying to understand Wrye Bash), I have done the following (and this is what causes the problem): - created a new esp (let's call it "MyQuest.esp") - implemented my whole quest stuff... - defined "My Faction" inside that esp . also inside the same esp, added "My Faction" to the faction list in Baurus' form editor - saved the esp Now I want to distribute the esp. But I am afraid that it will cause trouble, because by assigning a new faction to Baurus, I have created a new Baurus record inside my mod that will shadow any other Baurus record that loads before my mod. So, whenever someone else's mod (let's call it "YourQuest.esp") should decide to also add some faction ("Your Faction") to Baurus, both mods will collide: Depending on their load order positions, Baurus will either end up to be a member of "My Faction" or of "Your Faction", but never as a member of both factions! Is this all correct so far? If yes, then I am glad that I have at least correctly understood the basic issue... ugh! :) Now this is how I'd like to resolve it properly, with my "quickshot" understanding of Filtering: 1. Reopen MyQuest.esp in TES CS and remove f"My Faction" from Baurus (but I leave the faction definition itself untouched!) 2. save my MyQuest.esp 3. Just to be sure, I open MyQuest.esp in TES4Edit to remove any remaining Baurus record (which would now be only a "dirty edit"). In addition, I cross-check that the "My Faction" record is still there 4. Now I create a new MyQuestFactions.esp, opening it as "active file" in TES CS, loaded together with Oblivion.esm and MyQuest.esp as parents 6. Now I reassign Baurus to "My Faction" and save MyQuestFactions.esp 7. I open WryeBash and add the tags "Factions", "Filter" and "Deactivate" to MyQuestFactions.esp 8. I use Wrye Bash's "Copy to Description" function to persist these tags inside my esp's description 9. Activate MyQuest.esp in Wrye Bash's mod list 10. Deactivate MyQuestFactions.esp in Wrye Bash's mod list 11. rebuild my Bashed Patch, checking MyQuestFactions.esp inside the "Import Factions" category That's it. Given that this is not rubbish, then it would mean that I have to distribute MyQuestFactions.esp together with MyQuest.esp inside my omod, and I should also add a proper comment to my readme.txt, explaining how to place both esps in the load order and also how to process the steps 9 - 11 mentioned above. The only question that remains: What about users that don't want to use Wrye Bash? Will it be sufficient just to tell them to maintain load order (MyQuestFactions.esp close to the end and after MyQuest.esp and any other mod changing faction memebership)? Or will this solution force anybody to use Wrye Bash? mmm... now I am really curious for feedback!! ;-);-)
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Hi Tomlong, Well, thanks! I didn't think of that, so this hint helps me a lot! I will try to see if I can find out something more about this myself! As soon as I know more, I will post it here. Don't worry! You already helped me! :) Just 2 additional notes: 1. I should explain why I am using custom factions: What I need to do is some "grouping" of NPC all over Cyrodiil (e.g. all "book vendors", all "blacksmiths", all "mages guild alchemists" etc.). I need to identify members of such "professional groups" in my dialogue conditions by using the "getInFaction" function. This is the reason why I created these factions and added them to vanilla NPCs. Maybe this is not the most elegant solution for my problem, but I had no better idea so far. 2. I hope that this all doesn't exceed this thread, as I am not talking about COBL at all. Maybe I should move this whole thing to another place (which is more related to Wrye Bash in general)?
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I think I should be more precise in explaining my problem: In my example, I defined a new faction and just added membership in this faction to several vanilla NPCs (by dragging the faction into the NPCs' faction list inside TES CS). Now I am worrying whether this will cause problems if anybody uses my mod together with other mods that do the same thing for the same NPCs (and I guess the chance for that is 100%). All in all, this is probably a "standard" issue of mod conflicts, but somehow I don't find the clue. What I already understand is that... 1. ... normally (in the vanilla load mechanism) the mod which loads later would force its own factions onto these NPCs, overwriting any changes of the other (earlier loading) mod --> this would be a killer argument not to use my mod! 2. ...that the safest (and at the same time hardest) way to solve such conflicts would be to create individual patches, let's say using TES4Edit. But this would require to identify any conflicting mod and creating a patch for each of them. --> this is not very realistic, or is it? 3. ... that Wrye Bash may be able to handle all of this in a more generic, elegant way. But then I need to tell my mod users what exactly to do to install my mod properly. This (i.e. the third solution) is what I am hoping for. What would users need to do? a.) Just include both mods in their Bashed Patch, without any tagging etc. (just relying on Wrye Bash to handle everything)? b.) Tagging one or both of the mods mods accordingly before building the patch? And if so, with what kind of tags? The "faction" tag? c.) Using "import factions" on one or both of the mods? d.) or maybe b.) or c.) in combination? As you may see, my main problem is to understand what "import" really does (if it makes sense in this case), and also what Wrye Bash perhaps does automatically without any importing, tagging etc.. I have several options that sound the same to me, but apparently aren't. What to do now?
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Yes, I'm sure your're right. I am still wondering how Wrye Bash manages to this all so easily! Talking about importing: What about factions? I read from the UESP articles, that there'd be no way to import of merge factions (though probably just misunderstood that?), and at the same time the options menu when building the patch offers me to "import factions". Just an example: I have created a mod that adds certain factions to certain vanilla(!) NPCs. Now I want to ensure that this doesn't break neither the vanilla game, nor any other mods' faction assignments. How would I have to use Wrye Bash now to ensure that my changes are only merged into everything else instead of overwriting anything? Maybe this is a beginner's question. But I haven't found an answer to this yet.
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Dear bben46, Thanks alot! Once again: Thanks alot, and even more alot! ;-) I think that's exactly what I was searching for. Especially the page related to Bashed Pathes (http://sites.google.com/site/oblivionpoinfo/finishinstall/bashedpatch) may be what I needed at last. So I will shut up and RTFM now! ;-)
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Hi myrmaad, first of all, thanks alot for putting this all together! I think that the most interesting question relates to this: Honestly speaking, it's exactly this part which I find so hard to understand, and where the documentation (if you mean the "official" readme) appears a little "cryptic" to me. Creating a Bashed Patch - more or less intuitively - is not the problem. The problem starts when I try to "click through" exactly this options menu that offers me hundreds of possibilities, but many of them make my game crash, without knowing why. The other problem is that the general logic is *not* that the last mod always wins, as you said. My understanding of Wrye Bash is exactly the opposite. It was invented to allow to "break" or "workaround" this strict "last wins" rule by merging, importing etc.. But as stated, I have more or less managed to get things running until now just by trying a lot. I'd only like to understand better what exactly all these option do, and why so many of them cause conflicts when you try to apply them without understanding. But I have already found some more wisdom by reading (RTFM). I am still hopeful... :) Hope to be able to contribute something soon...
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Hi everybody, my general problem in understanding Wrye Bash lies in the fact that I have not really understood what terms like "merging", "patching" or "importing actually do or mean! What are the differences between them? In what situation do I have to use which mechanism? What will work, and what will cause issues? And why? I know that there's a lot of information given in Wrye Bash's readme, but it doesn't explain the concept itself, so usage of the tool can be a quite "dangerous" trial&error, like trying to steer an aircraft without any training. What I'd really need is some basic explanation (e.g. some good examples). I can click around in Wrye Bash a lot, but the tool doesn't really help me in understanding which of the 1000s of options make sense at all. For example, when I try to rebuild my Bashed Patch, the wizard offers me to activate hundreds of special components of my mods to "import", "merge" or "patch", but from my trial and error turnaroaunds I did so far I know that any second "wrong" click can make my game crash! Why does Wrye Bash offer my to import certain cells, factions, relations or whatever, if I haven't set any tags to tell it to do so? I guess that it all *makes* sense, in fact. But you need someone to explain it to you. I am still in search of a tutorial that can help me to become a more experienced WryeBashian. Please help me! :) :) [Edit: Well, before I get accused for being too lazy to research, I should mention that there's at least some basic information in the UESP wiki: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Tes4Mod:Wrye_Bash/Bashed_Patch Though it's still not a real "tutorial", this might answer some of my basic questions. I will go on reading first... ;.) I am afraid that in the end mumbling won't help the case. Maybe there is no real tutorial unless someone takes up the task to create one and thus save us all. I don't think that I am capable enough for it. I'm still hoping for someone more intelligent. Maybe there's light at the end of the tunnel... ;-)]