StormHammer81

@Sithis "The Empire must die" Why? Because you want it to? Or because, you disagree with her politics? The only thing which "must" happen is an end to the Civil War. There have been numerous occassions already where the Empire "must" die. I think that's one thing which makes me more and more certain that the Empire still has a chance. Everyone says it "must die". Well, we all "must die" eventually, however, "When a man is convinced he's going to die he will probably find a way to make it happen." - Guinan So, I must disagree with you on this one. Although, I agree with most of your other points. I also kinda think you guys are stretching this about this uhh, "Skyrim and Redguard Alliance". I very highly doubt that this would ever happen. Their common ground ends with the Empire and the Dominion. I mean, yeah that's noteworthy however, they historically, have not really gotten along at all. Skyrim is kinda like the dividing line between East and West Tamriel. I highly doubt those two would ever achieve anything significant in the way diplomacy unless it's in the Empire. Because they've had numerous territory disputes, even today, the Nords don't like em in their country one bit and, most important - OF ALL... Ulfric and the Stormcloaks have a real problem with foreigners and non-Nords. No way they would ever work together. What's more likely now, is Highrock would leave the Empire and get with Hammerfell. That's money in the bank. Just like you were more accurate about the fate of Cyrodil, it would be torn apart. Dominion might try ~ however, just very unlikely they could absorb it all overnight. They would try. Either way, you're going to have a fractured mess. It could work to dissolve the Empire ok? It could work except the Thalmor are waiting at the gates. They're ready to do something according to Ondolomer. And he's saying next time it till be worse than before. I believe him.

@MidbossVyers If Empire loses CW, then there will be a permanent rift of hatred and hostility between Skyrim and Cyrodil. The Stormcloaks do not believe in Imperialism, in fact in Ulfric's last speech he talks about how he's glad it's broken. They will not work together, that is "empty words". Ysgramor was a king and he was for Skyrim. Talos was an Emperor and he was for Imperialism. Two different ideaologies. WGC is irrelevant to this point.

@Sithis Except this time everything is different. What you're saying will only hold up if the Empire survives and stay unified. Otherwise, all bets are off. We're having to pull our troops from the front lines in order to deal with Ulfric. Assuming the Thalmor are indeed powerful enough to invade I highly doubt the Empire without Skyrim will last for very long. For the Empire to loose Skyrim would be like giving someone a "frontal lobbadomy". Empire only made it last time because of help from Skyrim and now between GW and CW it's even weaker than before. Then again, so is AD. Although AD would be able to bring more to the table than a post Skyrim Empire would. And, AD's infastructure is still in place while Cyrodil is a smoldering ruin - still.

@Sithis Correct, a naval invasion would be suicide and very much unsustainable. It's called Hammerfell. Annnd one reason why the AD wanted Hammerfell so bad was to try and STOP the pirate harassment against AD shipping/ports. Tat said, during the Great War, the AD conquered ALL of Cyrodil except for Bruma. Every other city fell, although not at first. After WGC and annhilation of AD primary army + reinforcements, Cyrodil was returned to the Empire.

@sajuukkhar9000 I also must agree with that. The Civil War will put EVERYBODY in a bind financially and socially. This Civil War could not have come at a worse time. I acknowledge there are problems of this nature already, however having a Civil War will make things 10x worse and create a great deal of uncertainty. The aftermath of this will put a FURTHER wedge between Skyrim and Cyrodi, which is what the Elves want. This. This is their "final solution". A house divided cannot stand. Only thing I would like to add is, Cyrodil will tear itself to pieces without resources from Skrim too. The Elves will not go after Skyrim first, they'll just walk into Cyrodil. Whoever controls Cyrodil, rules Tamriel. This is why I fight for the Empire. Other than of course, it still being Talos's Empire. It's nonsense for Legions and Stormcloaks to be killing each other. And *every* province the Empire has lost so far has been directly related to Thalmor influence, whether that be direct or indirect. Which indicates there is a high probability that the Thalmor are behind the war in Skyrim as well, which in turn further indicates that... there is a "lie" somewhere in Ulfric's cause. Which is why the Dossier is important, because it helps indicate that "something" is/was/ between Ulfric/Stormcloaks and Thalmor. Thalmor even admit, they're fueling Ulfric's cause. And Ulfric at very least, knows they're playing him. However, there is also something in that Dossier which talks about how Thalmor were in contact with Ulfric prior to Markarth. No need to hash thru that anymore, however I sat around a kitchen table last night just thinking about that alone and you know, I realized the Empire still does alot of good and the Empire is the reason why Hammerfell, Skyrim and Cyrodil are "prospering". Perhaps not the only reason I'm sure, however it is the main reason. There is so much more at stake in this scenario than just the WGC. Feel free to try and dispute this all you like, but all of this is lore and game accurate. Although there is also some speculation in this post as well.

The AD would be insane to attack Skyrim. It would be suicide. They also met a similar fate trying to invade Hammerfell, it just won't work. With the ruggid terrain and all, they would pay dearly for any ground they take and there would also be too many places for pockets of resistance fighters to raise hell.

@Gabryal Ok so on "oppression"... what you're saying is anyone who receives a title as "liberator" or "freedom-fighter" gets a free pass into "oppressing" whomever they want but when the lawful Gov tries to stop the violence, then we're somehow the "oppressors"? I don't buy that. So... Ulfric can murder people in Markarth for not coming to fight for his cause while Stormcloaks were sieging their city. Then when he captures said city, young, elderly, shopkeepers, children old enough to wield a sword... whoever didn't fight for his cause he had them executed and now you're saying he gets a free pass? Give me a break dude. When does it end? Ulfric has killed as many neutral parties in his revolution as he has killed Imperials. Ulfric "oppressed" the Reachmen, and Whiterun (a neutral city), he "oppresses" elven races, in particular the Dark Elves, the Stormcloaks in general are "oppressive" towards non Nords even Imperials, the Stormcloaks are in nature "oppressive" and, if you can't understand that then you're the one living in a fantasy. I'm here in the real world, a zebra does not change it's stripes. And, whenever anyone tries to approach you guys about it, you're like, "Oh well that's just how it works, they'll be some blood and alot of violence but it has to be done" B$ Just because you are not happy that you're not getting your way all the time DOES NOT give you or me the right to start killing and stealing from people who are BYSTANDERS and/or otherwise neutral parties. STALIN, HITLER, MAO all of these guys were revolutionaries and they took the same route as Ulfric by using "oppression" as some kind of "tool" as a means for their personal ambition and for revolutionary change. In ALL of these cases Tens of Thousands of people if not millions died so they could have their way. When you have Ulfric murdering civilians and innocent people at Markarth because they weren't with him and then persecuting elves because he has a chip on his shoulder, you HAVE NO RIGHT to turn around and point the finger at us and say we're the bad guys. Seriously, if you guys want to know where the enemy is at, then look in a mirror. I can't tell you how many "people" I have had to deal with that have this disorder. They seem to think, "Ok well, Hammer is really stern and he gets paid alot of money, so he's part of the problem, he's somehow the reason why I can't get ahead in life" LMAO Weak-minded creatons. Or how 'bout, "Well, I'm not aloud to do such and such for whatever reason and it's only me, so I'm going to make sure that Hammer has no liberty either." I guess that mentality is, if I'm being punished for something, then I should make sure that everyone is punished with me. A very childish, self-centered attitude and I won't have any part of it. In order to maintain law and order, some people are going to be "oppressed". Soldiers in the military during their training are "oppressed". There will "oppression" in Skyrim under Ulfric either way. This in the US, is a FEDERAL REPUBLIC, we are NOT a Democracy. And because it's not possible for everyone to be represented, then some people are by nature, going to be "oppressed". Some people probably think it's ok to just walk into their neighbors house and take things, then when pulled over, the policemen was "oppressing" them. Cannot get around "oppression" your whole argument is up in smoke. What about the tax payers? I'm OPPRESSED because they keep taking my taxes and sending said money to the damn illegals, but I'm kool about it. I haven't killed anyone over it, it's my problem my neighbor has nothing to do with it. And furthermore, I'll never ever receive any type of "assistance" from the Gov because I'm of the White class... and everything is my fault. Religion can be oppressive, religious authorities can be *willfully* oppressive towards others who don't share their cause. The whole oppression argument is old and bogus. Stormcloaks are oppressive. In order to maintain society, there will *always* be a certain level of Liberty and a certain level of Oppression. Unless they go around, removing everyone's frontal lobe from their brains, then you would have neither because people wouldn't be people anymore. The concept of the Revolutionary party being a victim of "Oppression" is a tool which provides an *excuse* for said Revolutionary parties to justify carrying out acts of violence against other parties and/or individuals for their own agenda, *regardless* as to whether or not these parties and/or individuals are anyway directly or indirectly related to whatever the "supposed" reason for revolutionary change may be. If the Revolutionary party is indeed a victim of oppression themselves, then no positive change can or will ever be accomplished if said Revolutionary party acts as the "oppressor" themselves, without ever "rising above" their sh*tty situation and showing the world how things should be done, history will inevitably repeat itself and the only real change will be the Revolutionary party will now become the former "oppressors". "The Last Imperial" http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/images/32122-1-1361464638.jpg http://www.google.com/imgres?hl=en&biw=1760&bih=839&tbm=isch&tbnid=IXbKp2OCDGmFOM:&imgrefurl=http://ezhovs.deviantart.com/art/The-battle-near-Whiterun-281627223&docid=D_R5iy-1GShB4M&imgurl=http://www.deviantart.com/download/281627223/the_battle_near_whiterun_by_ezhovs-d4no8yf.jpg&w=1280&h=1024&ei=WxgpUc7DIoj69gSiioCwAg&zoom=1&ved=1t:3588,i:85&iact=rc&dur=214&sig=110628997490072880098&page=1&tbnh=184&tbnw=240&start=0&ndsp=24&tx=64&ty=77

@Kayyyleb Correct. Another example. Well, after all they're the lesser races, you know. Not like Orcs and Snow-Elves lived in Skyrim first. Nords came from Atmora but *somehow* they also "originally came from" Skyrim. And then, if you're not a Stormcloak, then you're also not a true son/daughter of Skyrim. Yep. It all makes sense now. Good talk. :biggrin:

Well, at least you are willing to admit the Stormcloaks can be oppressive as well. Although, your reasoning sounds more like an analysis of Imperial oppression: 1. They are aristocrats, and thus naturally oppressive. 2. They must repress counter-revolution. 3. They must repress further revolution (ie, the Nordic people rising up against them). However, you my friend are the first Stormcloak ~ever~ to admit that the Stormcloaks also are oppressive. Carry on... LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE!!!

@kradus Correct, Markarth is another fine example. Seems like a conflict of interest earn your freedom by taking away someone else's, even when their cause more or less mirrors yours. While I am no fan of Jarl Ingman, he's not the worst Jarl in the world, that would be Lawgiver. Secondly, the Silver Bloods are responsible for most of this, what goes on in that mine is not because of the Jarl, although, I'm more than sure he profits from it. Finally, how quickly we forget that General Tullius is trying to straighten out that mine and the sh*t which goes on in there. The Imperial already control Markarth, they get their share of that Silver. This is actually the Empire trying to put a stop to the evil which goes on in Silver Blood mine.

The Question was for Sithis. :) It doesn't matter, it's the same "If you're not with us, then you're against us" criminal B$. Umm, I think the term, "genocidal tendencies" is specific enough. Please see Windhelm for further info. Another similarity between Thalmor and Stormcloaks, I'm afraid. :/

@Sithis You didn't answer my question... Admit it, the Stormcloaks are "oppressors". You guys have used this club against the Empire time and time again. Based on your response then, a Stormcloak must have your *exact* same views, they must *hate* the Empire and follow Ulfric *unquestioningly* or else they're not "real"? Know what I mean Sithis, "real"? How many tragedies were committed throughout history because people were just *following orders*? You can respond or continue to ignore me, IDC. Stormcloaks are oppressors too and it's time you Stormcloaks own up to it, or admit you're cause is wrong. I stand with the Empire, and I remember how "oppressive" you guys were to me in the beginning when I was a Stormcloak, you would not hear anyone else's opinion if it did not fit *precisely* into your doctrine. LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE!!! http://static.skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/images/32122-1-1361464638.jpg

Correct. I think in time, Elisif will get her feet... or perhaps the moot will choose someone else. We'll have to see.

@hardarg Agreed. I have never understood why all the hatred for Elisif. She seems like she really has a good heart and it's obvious she puts the good of her people before her own ambition.

@Asensio We will see what fate the Empire meets, however you are correct about playing as a Nord. I believe that defending the right of any group of people to fight for their culture and heritage is worth rebellion, and with it total war, with all the madness and horror that comes with it. I believe that maintaining the empire is worth oppressing all of it's citizens, and that should they rebel it is worth total war, with all the madness and horror that comes with it. LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE!!!

So, if that's how you Stormcloaks really feel then so be it. I must admit, there are some things that you guys believe which I cannot come to terms with. Honestly, as I have said, there is truth found in both sides. Another thing, calling me out like this doesn't really make me feel to welcome. I make no apology and perhaps this was just a bad idea. It seems you have "misinterpreted" the meaning behind my posts here. If you are going to just be "dismissive" of anything which could put a postive light on the Empire, then maybe some of these guys on here are right... you guys really are biased. And that's one thing I am not. You know, when Ulfric "shouted down" Torygg. I guess that could be misinterpreted as well... The Dossier on Ulfric seems pretty clear though. Also, I didn't give you guys a bad name, don't even go there Sithis. If anyone gives you a bad name, it's you. So, my question is, or line thinking is, the Empire and the Stormcloaks need to work together, ok? Because they need each other. All this fighting and bickering won't solve problems for either of them. You know, this reminds me of like the "Season Unending Quest' where Tullius kinda left the door open to the Empire wanting to settle with Ulfric. But would Ulfric have it? HELL NO. He wouldn't hear a word of it. Just like you are doing now. So nevermind me, forget about me completely. What if another Stormcloak was thinking along these lines? What if they like, hated the Empire but still felt that Ulfric wasn't doing the greatest job in the world. What then? Are you in fact, telling us that Stormcloaks can be oppressive as well as Imperials then? Granted, yes, folks. I have been an Imperial for a very long time. I have fought the Imperial cause more times than I can remember and have fought on some issues that no one else here as even brought up yet. I'm curious Sithis, you guys wanted us to tell the world how "oppressive" we are. Are you NOT saying to me and before the world that you are not being "oppressive" towards myself and other Stormcloaks who MAY or MAY NOT think along your "party lines"? All Stormcloaks out there can't possibly agree with you and your methods. Just like all Imperials didn't agree with me, although most did. Just like in the Empire, some of us agreed with TMII and the WGC, while the rest of us including myself wanted to give the Empire time to earn another chance at the game, to start over fresh with no TMII or WGC. And no one, I mean no one Imperial EVER fought against another one of us because of a different "party line". The downfall of the Stormcloaks cause is, you can't just keep rebelling forever. At some point, you must FORGIVE and unite. The Empire understands this as we have "direction", our downfall is right now, we don't have a leader to make this happen. Whereas the Stormcloaks have a leader, however, you have no real "direction", with sometimes leaderless armies rebelling over every little thing they don't like. LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE!!! http://static.skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/images/32122-1-1361464638.jpg

LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE!!!

LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE!!!

Yep. The man lost his nerve... or lost his mind. Stress can do this to people. Either way, he's not fit to rule and def not fit to be an Emperor anymore. Instead of putting the Thalmor back in their place, he's encouraging them. Course he did that before too... hmmm. The only real, logical explanation I can come to would be so that TMII could have an easy means of recapturing Cyrodil. Because based on what I read, nearly every single city in Cyrodil fell to the Thalmor and even after Red Ring, the Thalmor were in control of those cities. Sieging a city can be extremely difficult and perhaps worst of all, Time Consuming. He did it to reclaim Cyrodil because his few remaining Legions were at or below 40% cap + injuries and could not have reclaimed Cyrodil on their own. This DOES NOT mean I agree with him, although it makes sense. Because before this, things looked very dark for the Empire as the Thalmor did in fact, control every city in Cyrodil except Bruma.

@Kayyyleb Let it be noted that for the record, I tried to meet this guy half-way. OK. Your S*TTY LITTLE ATTITUDE is reason enough for anyone to rebel. ATHE-ISM. It's an ISM. Therefore, it's a IDEA, a state of mind. Ideas can be banned, you are NOT special in this regard. This is not exactly like WWII. For one thing, the ALLIES were not allowing Hitler to extend his policies into their countries. Britain DID NOT allow Htiler to go throughout their nation gathering up Jews for the bon-fire(s). WE FIGHT FOR HONOR AND GLORY. HONOR AND GLORY. GLORY AND HONOR. You fight out of FEAR and GREED. And I don't give two sh*ts what somoene like you thinks about me hahahaha. You have nothing on me little man. Least I'm not the one trying to make excuses for putting innocent people in shackles. And another thing, it's a video game, ok so then stop posting if it ain't worth talking about. Unless we have a point somewhere that you can't comprehend / rebuttle. EVERYONE IS BIASED in some way, just like you're biased against Religion and people who don't agree with you. It's a part of who you are. And I don't see anything wrong with it. No one should be FORCING ANYONE ELSE into thinking or liking anything. And your petulant attitude is one thing which turned me on Atheists a long time ago... among other types of people... and yet, even so I try to be understanding and TOLERANT.

@Kayyyleb Yes, you're correct. And that Dossier on Ulfric does not look good. There's a ton of info which can be deduced from just those 2 or 3 paragraphs which have been summarized. He's also not doing a very good job as Jarl and he's obstructing the Gov by not allowing the Moot to meet. So, Ulfric is guilty of some wrongs too. The thing is... Titus Mede II has IMO done worse than Ulfric. True though, TMII was vindicated in the end after his retreat from IC and indeed, he may be vindicated again. Still, you have a ton or horrible atrocities and really foul sh*t going on because of the Empire. It could be that one day the WGC is no more and the Empire will once again be under sound leadership, but I doubt it. And it wouldn't take me all of 5 secs to start fighting back the very moment any Thalmor came for me or one of the members of my family. That would be their first and last mistake. This is why so many Nords and others want to just scrap the Imperial system and start over because we are not in control OR we do not have a say in this Empire. Not like the good ol days with the Imperial Council. Although Tullius doesn't force the Legion on Whiterun, he accepts Jarl Baalgruf's demands. So, there is some good left in the Empire. But to sit here and say that Ulfric is the reason for everything going South and that the Stormcloaks are instigating all the problems in Skyrim is biased. If you fight for the Empire, then you have to accept resp for your failures, with said goal supposedly to make the Empire better. Nothing will change for the Empire as long WGC is upheld and as long as the Empire allows the Thalmor to ride them, they will ride the Empire for all it's worth. And if TMII will not listen to reason, then he can listen to Ulfric.

@Kayyyleb Ok, well then you're not too different then we are in a sense... 1) Atheism is a Religion in and of itself. For example, Atheism is a personal decision to NOT accept or believe in a "God" or "Gods". They could have decided to ban Atheism. No different. 2) We don't want your pity. We want you to leave us to live our lives without having to answer to the onerous Empire or Thalmor Dominion. Your opinion is not required on whether or *not* we choose to worship whoever. The thing is, if they can take away (1) right, then they can take them all away. We see what's coming and who knows what new treaty or under table deal Thalmor will make with the Empire next, again without representation. What this has proven is the Empire can be manipulated. TMII opened the door to make this possible. And, as usual, because we want to be left alone and want the "oppressors" out of our lives, then now we're the bad guys. But, it's ok for TMII to make these decision for people without their consent. Much like what is going on now with the US Gov, but this ain't the place for it. Just saying. We want our freedom and we want to live peace and live as our ancestor's lived in honor and glory. We've fought your battles, we've paid and paid and paid for things that do not and will never benefit us and we're just, just sick of the Imperial system. Btw, we're also sick of being left to die, alone in cages and having our heads removed for speaking out against the insanity. Yes we're a little biased but so what? Dark Elves are, we know that. Khajit are as well against Woodelves. The Thalmor, OMG they wrote the damn book on being biased and how to treat those beneath you with the utmost contempt. It's normal, it's natural and it's a part of the healing process. You have to let the Nords express their frustrations with what primarily the Elves and now the Empire have done to us. Have to let it out and come to terms with it before things will improve. You know, if you kept getting stung by bees for no reason, you might be biased against bees. Least until you get to understand them better. Nord culture is under attack right now in sooo many different ways, all we're doing is fighting one enemy after another, with no one willing to sit down around a kitchen table and here us out. So... hate and hope is all we really have left. And you know, in the end all (9) Divines have their totems in the temple. I think that really says alot about the Stormcloaks cause. Think about it. Another thing, we don't want or expect everyone to join us. Either you're a true son of Skyrim or you're not. You have to "feel it" in your bones. Our actions do the talking because the Empire talks all the time nowadays, and it's just talk.

@Kayyyleb So... anytime you have a "Great War" there is going to be fallout. And if you follow this up with a revolution, it's going to be even worse. Many of the Stormcloaks fought in the Great War and it's these same people who are really, really mad at how the Empire has rewarded them and their country. I don't blame them. The thing is, we just want the ability to not have "strangers wearing familiar faces" telling us what is best for us. This is what it comes down to. There are some good Imperials from the war who are still with the Empire. There are some good things about keeping the Empire together. The fact that it's a unified Empire is one thing the Thalmor don't want. Another thing, if Dragonborn is of Talos's line, then there is indeed hope for the Empire. Especially if Hammerfell could be persuaded to return. This all sounds so very nice but I seriously doubt it will ever happen. Even if it does, you still have to decide what is best for Tamriel... the Empire or Independence. There are pros and cons to each side, there is truth to each side. Personally, I really do not trust the Empire. However, I'm very sad that joining Ulfric pits me against Jarl Baalgruf. I happened to like him. It's a very, very difficult choice but either way, good people are going to get HURT.

LONG LIVE THE EMPIRE!!!

I am a White male and am also a responsible gun owner. Served (6) years in the Military and am skilled in proper usage of Assault Rifles and Pistols. Every day in my life, including my time in the service, I had to deal with crazy, racist, confused and bitter people. Still do. This is interesting, you guys keep talking about how the White Male is "no longer necessary" and how many of us are "Right-wing extremists". Of the people that I have met and dealt with, people will be people. A racist and I would say a bitter person towards White Men would make a statement such as this. You cannot say something like that and then turn around and be like, well they're not all that way blah blah blah. Either you are racist against White Men and are bitter towards us, or you're not. For my part, I'm not racist, I'm not bitter. Although, I'm a little perplexed at how so many people can hate on White people, especially directly going after the White male. The White male is why you have America. For better or worse, this was our dream, this was built by us. The reason you can sit and use at a computer to spew your hate - at all today - is because White people invented the Computer and the Corporation and America and and and... It seems your hatred towards White people is politically motivated. So now, are *seriously* going to tell me you are willing to hate and bias a race because of "party platform"? Excuse me, I'm not perfect, not the smartest, most likeable guy in the world but that's sick. If your ideology ever puts you in a place to look down on someone because they're not the "politically correct" race or gender, then you've got some serious issues yourself. What's even sadder is you people are allowed to jump on here and broadcast your left-wing hate speeches to the entire world. I don't care who you decide to vote for, I don't care what race or gender you are, I am a man who really only cares about his freedom. That's it. Like my ancestor's did who were FORCED to flea from people like you for their very lives, from the onerous Catholic church and from the Tyrants trying to burn people at the stake and rape them with taxation because they weren't "politically correct". The right can do the same thing as the left, but, there is such a thing as left-wing extremism and it's all over the posts on the page alone. Sukeban. No surpise there. I think everyone should be open to free speech and if you or I don't like it ~ change the f*cking dial. The next time someone irritates your political opinions, calm your self down and realize that this is at least *supposed to be* a free country and as citizens, we need to try and respect one another no matter the race and gender. Unfortunately, I'm afraid particularly the left-wing and right-wing leaders won't allow the hate to die and keep fueling tension in their "sermons". I must agree though, once the "White male" population dwindles you will see more violence, in particular against White people just like what happened in South Africa. The White people want to defend what's ours, we want our freedom. And the minorities do not seem to believe in freedom like we, you have other beliefs which are tied in Relgion, culture and history. That's how things work in South America, Middle East, Africa and everywhere else they don't believe in Freedom and self-determination and the right to protect oneself. That's the difference between us. White people make some mistakes but we try and follow LOGIC and reasoning. In many of these countries, they follow religion and family ties and what happened 3000 years ago. Not saying that some White people don't do these things too, but how many Democracies and Republics did you see before they developed this stuff in Greece? Then Rome thought is was a good idea, and Europe was ruled by kings (not dictators or despots) during the Dark ages but even then it was different. Knowledge was rewarded, it was highly regarded. Progress was made in countries with White-males. Doesn't mean we're better than anyone and that's not what I'm saying. What I am saying, is you f*ckers better hope the White males last a good long time or else this civilization we have will break down almost overnight and the US and Europe will become a warzone with gangs and thugs fighting over Religion and race. The most racist people I have EVER encountered were Black. My friend is an policemen and his friend is narcotics office and there are some places that they will not even enter. Some areas of Europe have no-go zones dominated by Muslims, they're like min-police states. Scary. How many white neighborhood no-go zones have you encountered? Have you ever been afraid to walk down one of our streets? Has anyone ever been afraid on offending a "White-male". And then there are some examples sure but in general and on average, I would say no. Truthfully Sukeban, I think minorities aren't necessary. I think we have enough minorities and illegals "poruing in" in droves while Legitimate Immigrants are BEGGING and PLEADING to be allowed to enter this country legally. Whose going to pay your EBT and your Food Stamps and your welfare checks if all the White people stop working. If we're all so unnecessary, then you should be able to pay your own way. And if you're so responsible, then you should be man enough when you go to the pulpit to stop blaming white people for all your ills and grow the f*ck up. Or better yet, GET OUT OF MY COUNTRY. If you can't respect the founder of this great land, then you don't need to be among us. We're hit hard enough as it is and we don't need to deal with anymore spite or hostility coming from the very people we're FORCED to support. Can you handle the opinion of another fellow American citizen? A veteran who just wants to be free and cares about the direction his country is going? As a White male, do I not anymore get a say in what my fore-fathers built? Thank you for your time.