LE Speechcraft Overhaul

[baltasaronmeth]

Why is it so difficult to tie speech tests to more than just speechcraft? Was it Fallout 3 or something else, that required you to have, say, medical skill of 30 to detect, that an NPC required healing during a conversation.

 

I'd make this simple. Everything in Skyrim needs to be trained seperately, so in a conversation about Swords, you need a basic speechcraft as well as either one or two handed at a certain level. Want to intimmidate a daedric follower? You need to be champion of at least three devine entities. Conversation is generally very dull in skyrim, it's all about learning about the story (which is good), obtaining quests (which is also kind of like the butter on the bread) but nothing else. I never had the feeling, that my character develops during conversations. Basically all conversations follow one of the three routes (yes, no, more info). Most text adventures without a big budget have a more sophisticated conversation system. It would not be enough to add more gameplay depth to the speechcraft skill, because speech itself lacks depth in Skyrim. We also need proper consequences. I have in many hundred hours of playing vanilla skyrim not once had the feeling, that I will miss out anything, if I do not have the speechcraft skill to persuade or intimidate. You can usually talk yourself out of any situation without it and most of the time, gold prices are too low to hurt. That's another "problem" in Skyrim: After around ten hours in the game, I already swim in gold. What? 5k for a house? Maybe another 5k for the interiors? Why would I want to barter at such prices? For roleplay reasons, yes. I have to do so much RP, because most of the NPC are as shallow as they have been for the past 15 years.

 

Okay, I see, while I typed this, my mood changed from "I have an idea" to "warrrgglgl!". Sometimes one should just not think about things too much.

[Shadeybladey]

Why is it so difficult to tie speech tests to more than just speechcraft?

 

so in a conversation about Swords, you need a basic speechcraft as well as either one or two handed at a certain level.

 

Basically all conversations follow one of the three routes (yes, no, more info).

 

We also need proper consequences.

 

Okay, I see, while I typed this, my mood changed from "I have an idea" to "warrrgglgl!". Sometimes one should just not think about things too much.

 

 

I think you've hit all the nails on their heads, there.

 

Vanilla SHOULD have had more of this kind of thing. It SHOULD have had more options AND more consequences. As a Paladin, when I find the kid summoning the Dark Brotherhood, I have to ignore it or kill the evil b&@*$ at the orphanage. No option to turn her in to the authorities, donate 10,000 gold to the orphanage and adopt the kid or make sure he's otherwise safe. No Lawful and Good path, just the Chaotic and Good (kill the monster).

 

And those sorts of events seem very rare, very few and very far between. And they do not always have a Good/Neutral/Evil path, and certainly do not always have options for Warrior/Rogue/Mage, needing 9 different choices depending on class and alignment. That's not to mention the Lawful/Chaotic axis.

 

And there are not that many opportunities to persuade or intimidate, either. Or to bribe guards to get inside strongholds, just to pay bribe instead of a fine.

 

To make that sort of thing workable there would have to be a really massive overhaul of just about every Side and Radiant Quest in the game, as well as all the dialogues and a large number of casual conversations and so on. And most of the new dialogues would be unvoiced, which kind of spoils any modded quest dialogue.

 

I's not something I could do, but it would be really cool if someone did.

 

Especially with voices.

 

~.~

[threefoldmind]

Well I so far had 7 new perks and more being mulled over.

 

Fast Talk - Can begin dialogue with none hostile. Starts with ability to pay then to replace calm with non-combatant (like any town folk)

 

I Yield, I Yield! - Calms a foe for 10 seconds and enters fast talk.

 

Shor's Mercy! - Calms all nearby foes for 20 seconds and enters fast talk with target.

 

All three of these are unlimited use but cost stamina. Was thinking 15, 25, 45 respectively.

 

Non-Combatant - Allows you to persuade foes instead of pay them to let you be. Dependant on Speechcraft skill.

 

Terrifying Presence - Allows you to Intimidate foes instead of pay them. Depends in Speechcraft. Failure breaks debuffs.

 

Favor of Coin - Allows you to pay foe to add fury effect to them. This is risky because they may attack you first.

 

Man For Hire - Pay for to join your team. Turns them into mercenaries.

 

Infuriate - Persude foe to add fury

[baltasaronmeth]

Stammina cost could be a problem. This guy obviously ran into some obstacles, because Stammina does not seemt to behave like MP.