Update on site work and NMM 0.50 around the corner

[wolverine2710]

In response to post #9101291. #9102688, #9103734, #9103839, #9103924, #9104346, #9104816 are all replies on the same post.

@Dark0ne and @manoqueen. It didn't feel right to talk about Mod Organizer here in this thread created by Dark One but since he responded I will give my view.

Automatic Variant which btw runs fine with NMM in its latest beta release introduced symlinks (like NMM is going to use) to prevent copying of files. It turned out that this works fine on some systems and does NOT on other systems. He reverted to the old systm for the stable version.

Because I needed more I switched to Mod Organizer last year. Initially there were problems with skyproc based programs like Automatic Variant, Asis, Dual Sheath Redux, Reproccer (and SUM to rule them all) etc but since a year or so that has been solved. The only thing you have to do is setup an executable in MO.

MO uses a virtual filing system approach. If I've interpreted it right The NMM 0.5 (as of now called simply NMM) approach is a bit similar. In both cases the mods are NOT installed in the physical <Skyrim>/data directory but each in their own directory. When starting Skyrim in both cases it gets presented a <Skyrim>/data directory which holds all the data needed for a mod like textures/meshes etc. The difference is that with MO its volatile AND after playing skyrim the <skyrim>/data directory is completely virgin, not a single file installed. With NMM this is not the case. The changes are permanent until in NMM the virgin profile (with no mods installed) is selected. After all you make a converter which removes all data from the physical data directory to the mods directory. After that <skyrim>/directory is virgin again. Both approaches have their merits.

What manoqueen says it true. Profiles are a REAL challenge, especially for your approach. Let my explain this with a Wrye Bash bashed patch.esp file (essential when you have many mods which use leveled lists). If you have two profiles. Profile 1 has 10 mods and profile 2 has 100 mods. For each profile you have to create a bashed patch (BP). You can't use the BP of profile2 for profile because then Skyrim will have missing master and it crashes. For profile 2 you want to create a BP, you first select profile2, the filing system (FS) is changed, now you create a BP, after that you must have a function to move the BP from the real FS to the Bash mod directory. If you clean a mod with Tes5Edit something similar is going on. The cleaned.esp must be moved back to its own mod directory because when you change a profile you want that that profile also uses the cleaned .esp file. Same for the skyproc based programs.

In MO when you run WB, Tes5Edit a skyrpoc patcher it is kickstarted by MO. That program then is presented with the VFS which its thinks is the real <skyrim>/data. The moment you change something this is put in the <MO>/overwrite directory in a place where it would exist in the real FS. Atm all profiles use one profile directory. This is a problem with WB/skyproc based stuff etc. Not with Tes5Edit becaue if you select a different profile and in that profile that mod is NOT selected the cleaned .esp file is also not selected.

Imho even after NMM has the symlinks implemented the real advantages of MO are:
1) You can change the load order of the mods and its assets like textures/meshes are changed in the VFS as well directly. The assets are overwritten in the VFS and then presented to Skyrim when it starts.
2) You can change the loadorder/priority of BSA files
3) Search function.
4) All colums are sortable
5) Filter function, show active/inactive mods, endorsed mods etc...
6) Quite a few more......

I wish you luck with NMM 0.50 but like manoqueen said the profiles in combination with external programs like WB ,Tes5Edit etc et is something you REALLY have to take into account.

MO has an NMM importer function which can not import all mods perfectly atm, due to the plethoria of ways mod authors have constructed there mods. I'm sure he is interested in your converter because it basically does what he needs. EDIT: When the NMM convertor works perfectly each mod is stored in its own directory. Hence its much easier to import mods between the two mod managers. Win win...

---- While I was typing manoqueen created another post. Possibly there is overlap... Edited September 11, 2013 by wolverine2710

[wolverine2710]

In response to post #9101291. #9102688, #9103734, #9103839, #9103924, #9104214, #9104816 are all replies on the same post.

While I was typing manoqueen created a new post.... . Again I really wish you luck and just wanted to help by pointing out possible issues. Edited September 11, 2013 by wolverine2710

[wolverine2710]

In response to post #9101291. #9102688, #9103734, #9103839, #9103924, #9104214, #9104346 are all replies on the same post.

@manoqueen .Good explanation (both times).
Why I why do my posts turn up in a place I did NOT intended them to be. Edited September 11, 2013 by wolverine2710

[PizzaHut420]

Im hesitant about updating with this news. Skyrim is fickle as is.

Im going to wait until this thread gets some positive feedback about the new mod install method.

 

Thanks for the info.. :)

[CuriousMarten]

In response to post #9102584.

1. NMM 0.5 is coming out soon, pretty major changes, but it is an open BETA (can't stress the BETA part enough).

2. Cluster troubles, they are workin' on it. Edited September 11, 2013 by HeavyDude

[sneakydeath1030]

how do i updat im new

 

[sneakydeath1030]

In response to post #9106854.

ghfhuef

[expired6978]

In response to post #9101291. #9102688, #9103734, #9103839, #9103924, #9104214, #9104346, #9104816 are all replies on the same post.

Tl ; DR of manoqueen's post:

When you make mods yourself, or install loose file mods without NMM, files are going to be left behind when switching profiles because NMM won't account for files not installed with the mod manager.

Result: Stuff doesn't work, or seriously breaks because now you have files being loaded that shouldn't be as they will be now technically be common to all profiles when they should not be. This wouldn't really be a problem if nobody edited vanilla scripts as the game would ignore scripts not actually linked by any loaded plugin, though it's not exclusively a problem for scripts.

I believe manoqueen's suggestion when changing profiles to actually relocate all physical (non-symbolic linked) files to an archive. Edited September 11, 2013 by expired6978

[Masafum1]

great added feature may i say.. also, i hope that the next major update will have the feature to merge esp for non scripted skyrim mod... if you can do that it will be great

 

[BigBodZod]

Thanks for the Updates Dark One :)