Hardwaremaster Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 (edited) There is a big difference between sexual preference, and love. I can have sex with someone, without loving them, and I can love someone, without having sex with them. They are two entirely separate issues. Love may not be able to be 'manufactured', but, gays can be. (example already given.) This is exactly what I'm talking about if we assume Homosexuality is based on genetics that causes an attraction to your same gender. Then what causes the following: Pedophile, Bestiality, Necrophilia. I think its safe to say these exist and are not based only on attraction. I have often wondered, if people mistake sex and love for each other, or the other way around. To put it another way, do we want to be satisfied, or do we want the satisfaction of being satisfied. If you to know what I'm talking about you can see this with everything that Humans Beings happen to do. This is not to even mention Bisexuality, which others have already addressed, that kind of reminds me of this story. Edited October 13, 2013 by Hardwaremaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyYou Posted October 13, 2013 Share Posted October 13, 2013 interesting point, so, if homosexuality isn't a 'choice', should we therefore accomdate the rest of what some consider to be 'deviant' sexual behaviors? Do we treat it as a mental illness, that homosexuality was once considered? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheo3309 Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 interesting point, so, if homosexuality isn't a 'choice', should we therefore accomdate the rest of what some consider to be 'deviant' sexual behaviors? Do we treat it as a mental illness, that homosexuality was once considered? The thing about mental illness is that with homosexuality, it's counter-indicative to mental illness. The same argument can also be applied to heterosexuality. All I know is, I'm gay. If people wanna change that, they gotta do it over my dead body. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keanumoreira Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 interesting point, so, if homosexuality isn't a 'choice', should we therefore accomdate the rest of what some consider to be 'deviant' sexual behaviors? Do we treat it as a mental illness, that homosexuality was once considered? The thing about mental illness is that with homosexuality, it's counter-indicative to mental illness. The same argument can also be applied to heterosexuality. All I know is, I'm gay. If people wanna change that, they gotta do it over my dead body. :tongue: Lol, IDK about that; some people who are bitter might argue that heterosexuality is the problem. A good friend of mine who is gay once said "If homosexuality is a 'disease', then why is heterosexuality so special? Maybe those who are straight and bias are the ones with the illness." He could be a satirist if he wanted to. ;D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyYou Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 interesting point, so, if homosexuality isn't a 'choice', should we therefore accomdate the rest of what some consider to be 'deviant' sexual behaviors? Do we treat it as a mental illness, that homosexuality was once considered? The thing about mental illness is that with homosexuality, it's counter-indicative to mental illness. The same argument can also be applied to heterosexuality. All I know is, I'm gay. If people wanna change that, they gotta do it over my dead body. :tongue: It is? How so? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheo3309 Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 interesting point, so, if homosexuality isn't a 'choice', should we therefore accomdate the rest of what some consider to be 'deviant' sexual behaviors? Do we treat it as a mental illness, that homosexuality was once considered? The thing about mental illness is that with homosexuality, it's counter-indicative to mental illness. The same argument can also be applied to heterosexuality. All I know is, I'm gay. If people wanna change that, they gotta do it over my dead body. :tongue: Lol, IDK about that; some people who are bitter might argue that heterosexuality is the problem. A good friend of mine who is gay once said "If homosexuality is a 'disease', then why is heterosexuality so special? Maybe those who are straight and bias are the ones with the illness." He could be a satirist if he wanted to. :laugh: That he could! For me it doesn't matter what age. What matters is if they're responsible. And that goes with any sexuality. And not only responsible in the sense of sexual activity, but in many other ways. For instance kindly telling people that you're one or the other if you get advanced by a party (gender) you don't fancy. Things like that. I think that the stigma is overly exasperated to the point it's been beaten to a dead horse. Mental maturity has been found advancing in young children all the time. For instance, I'm probably more mature than the rest of my siblings and I'm not speaking from an egocentric point of view, but mainly because of the fact on how they blow their money (fiscal responsibility), blood to them is not thicker than water, and a whole slew of other things. When they were in high school, they were partying. When I was in high school, my idea of a good time was either gaming or hanging at the library. Actually that still IS my idea of a good time. interesting point, so, if homosexuality isn't a 'choice', should we therefore accomdate the rest of what some consider to be 'deviant' sexual behaviors? Do we treat it as a mental illness, that homosexuality was once considered? The thing about mental illness is that with homosexuality, it's counter-indicative to mental illness. The same argument can also be applied to heterosexuality. All I know is, I'm gay. If people wanna change that, they gotta do it over my dead body. :tongue: It is? How so? I was about to answer that for the other person. But the thing with a lot of mental illnesses is that generally, people who are afflicted with them don't know it or aren't aware of it. Now after it's been explained in lucidity it can go either way, but generally speaking; as the saying goes... Crazy people don't know they're crazy. When people are under true delusions, they don't have the metacognitive ability to think like those who aren't under true delusions. It's that exact reason why that saying exists. Mental illness is usually associated with people who suffer from delusions who aren't even aware that they're suffering from it. Especially with people who are psychotic (in the sense that they suffer from some form of psychosis). So with homosexuality, it would be counter-indicative in that respect. As would be heterosexuality. The only reason why it was in the DSM at the time was due to the fact that the behavior differed from that of the sociological norm. Or at least what society dictated it to be. There are still many people that do still believe that it's a disorder, however there's proof that suggests otherwise. Sexuality in any degree isn't a disorder. But then the same could be said about the other taboo subjects you had mentioned, however with the other taboo subjects, you have to remember that those cases are people who DO have some form of mental disorder already. I've been pretty good with my mental health. I check up with a therapist regularly just for that extra-reassurance. The question is; why should it matter that it's not a mental disorder? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keanumoreira Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 (edited) @Pheo: I agree completely. There seems to be this social norm that adults are more mature than adolescents and children are, which is not always the case. I've seen adults act completely immature for their age, things that make you shake your head and ask "why?" It's sad to see an adult who doesn't act the way they should: no decorum, disregard for etiquette, destructive rhetoric, things like that. Some are simply rude when they don't have to be. And when it comes to sex? Well, we all know the dirty jokes we used to make. When it reaches that point, there's a low possibility that they're tolerant to other people's differences. I think in the case of your siblings, you're more "economically mature", if that makes sense. You know how to spend your money wisely. I'm somewhat okay with that to be honest. :laugh: But back to topic: People like to put labels on things Pheo, at least in my experience. Homosexuality and Bisexuality are often called "unnatural". That's both true and false, true, because for obvious reasons, one can't reproduce directly. False, because it is natural in respect to what one can observe in nature. Homosexuality is widespread and accepted in other species. Therefore, some people argue that society is "animalistic" for this reason. Makes me laugh, because we are animals, no matter how sophisticated we pretend to be. People who are simply ignorant of society's diversity might argue the contrary. Homosexuality doesn't hurt anyone, so why society complains about it, I will never understand. Edited October 14, 2013 by Keanumoreira Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheo3309 Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 (edited) Exactly. I seen the subject of normalcy brought up earlier in the thread, and while normalcy can be objective in some cases, most of the time it's subjective. For me, I wouldn't know normal if it hit me in the face, waving it's arms about, telling me to take a ring to Mordor... BUT! What I do know is that I've came across some pretty interesting people in terms of sexuality or the debate around it. Last month I was even threatened with Gay Exorcism. It was pretty absurd, but I pretty much replied to him like many Anthropologists would who researched the topic, to just let the belief of possession stay (personally I have my doubts) by bringing up the physiological and psychological effects that the possessed undergo during their experiences. None of them match with any kind of case in regards to possession, so I asked him how his exorcism would bring about the psycho-spiritual shock that any exorcism is intended to provide? Eventually he was escorted out of the event I was helping with. Like I said, it was... Interesting. Hilarious at the same time because of what I know about possession, but the fact that he equated and labeled homosexuality to demonic/spiritual possession was beyond baffling. What relevance does this have, some may ask. Well, for instance labeling is everything. It's how we categorize and characterize our world that we can rationalize with our inane human abilities. What we should start doing is removing many of these labels. There's a lot of research that has came out about orientation in general in terms of trying to explain it, when there really shouldn't be any need for explanation. That person is straight just like that person is gay or bisexual, pansexual, trans, what ever it is. At the end of the day people all around the world who are trying to explain it, discern it, they never ask themselves the question of "Does it really matter to explain it?" In the end, it doesn't change who or what we are or may be. What it does, and the only thing it does, is prove why it happens. We still really don't know why life exists, yet we constantly try to search for that reason. It's like Hardwaremaster was reminded of. As am I. Edited for grammar. It made my eyes twitch that I made some of those mistakes. Probably made more, but I'm in a bouncy mood today. :o Edited October 14, 2013 by pheo3309 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisnpuppy Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 ((You would be seen as a horrible affront to humanity by my family, Pheo..not for being gay -but for all the grammar errors. *snickers*)) You guys are doing well in this thus far and you have my thanks for it. ~Lisnpuppy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyYou Posted October 14, 2013 Share Posted October 14, 2013 Ok, so, we postulate that homosexuality isn't a mental disorder, so by extension, that would indicate that pedophilia, beastiality, etc, aren't mental disorders either. So, why should we not accept the latter, if we are supposed to accept the former? Because it isn't socially acceptable? As has been pointed out, homosexuality is only barely accepted now, if you could even call it that. One could argue that beastiality harms no one, (unless the dog bites you....) so, why should it not be 'accepted' as well? In some societies, pedophilia, by western definitions, isn't a crime, girls are married off at a very young age. And yes, this still happens today, in supposedly 'modern' countries. Of course, in some of those same countries, homosexuality is considered a crime, and is punishable by death..... Although, I gotta admit, we are wondering WAY off the stated topic here. :) I will accpet my share of the blame for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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