[WIP] Apocalypse New

[mikegray]

Dude!

 

I just kind of surfed over from a STEP mod page, and I LIKE what I see. Because I'm a SkyRe guy, I've considered the old version of this spell package time and again, then decided not to complicate matters further.

 

So ... I don't have any good tips about the spells themselves. But just a couple very general thoughts:

 

- Again: a SkyRe compatible package would be terrific - I'd slurp it up in a minute.

 

- Also: I'd love to see the spells done in such a way that NPCs can get at them and use them effectively. By means of ASIS, if necessary.

 

- Just a thought: I saw some pix of your planned conjuration stuff. Wow. Sweet. I love that stuff - it's definitely my favorite branch already. There's one issue I have with conjuration, however: I'm guessing that most people travel Skyrim these days with more than one companion - I mean, who doesn't use EFF/AFT/etc.? But if you already have, say, Vilja, Farkas and a dog - and then maybe Esbern or Serana along for the adventure - conjuration tends to end up creating too much of a crowd to be practical. I've found myself wondering now and again whether there could be some way of doing conjuration that is somehow more crowd friendly. Just a thought ...

[AdventureCat]

So, it looks like you'll be removing the summon zombie spells? I'm glad to see that, those are the ONLY spells I really don't like at all in the original. Partly because they don't get the visual effects from the 'undead fx' mod (which I love) but also I feel it takes away from the gameplay of reanimating bodies yourself, that's what being a necromancer is all about, and I like necromancy and summoning to be different. Those new lich lords that you posted pictures of are awesome though, that works I think because a lich is a special case, and they look great. I don't know if they use the word in ES lore or not, but in D&D lore at least they're wizards that zombified themselves intentionally and still retain their intelligence, summoning something like that makes sense. I really hope they cast reanimate spells on their own. Not as good the player ones of course, you wouldn't want your summoned lich to be a better necromancer than you :tongue: I like those buff spells you made that you cast on zombies.

 

It looks there's gonna be a lot of good stuff here, I can't wait to see it. Personally, I think your 'balance' is pretty damn good, at least in my game with all my other mods and insane amounts of enemy spawns. I know I'm not smart enough to figure out all the balance issues, but the way I judge things is this: I can make pretty much make any build of character and use any spell/ability from this and doomstones and resplendent and my game is still really damn hard (just the way I like it). And I like to use lots of different characters/builds. I tried a few other spell mods and they were mostly just all overpowered destruction spells that made my game too easy compared to a straight warrior/theif build.

[AdventureCat]

 

There's one issue I have with conjuration, however: I'm guessing that most people travel Skyrim these days with more than one companion - I mean, who doesn't use EFF/AFT/etc.? But if you already have, say, Vilja, Farkas and a dog - and then maybe Esbern or Serana along for the adventure - conjuration tends to end up creating too much of a crowd to be practical. I've found myself wondering now and again whether there could be some way of doing conjuration that is somehow more crowd friendly. Just a thought ...

 

 

If you're playing with four or five followers, I think you're making conjuration obsolete anyway :sad: I don't know what Enai could possibly do about that and still keep it balanced. One of the reasons I stopped using those follower mods. I do use Selene Kate myself, with her settings turned down a bit (I love her and my game would be impossible without her and all my difficulty enhancing stuff) I'm able to use her along with one vanilla follower, and personally I would never want more than two followers.

Edited December 10, 2013 by AdventureCat

[EnaiSiaion]

Dude!

 

I just kind of surfed over from a STEP mod page, and I LIKE what I see. Because I'm a SkyRe guy, I've considered the old version of this spell package time and again, then decided not to complicate matters further.

 

So ... I don't have any good tips about the spells themselves. But just a couple very general thoughts:

 

- Again: a SkyRe compatible package would be terrific - I'd slurp it up in a minute.

 

- Also: I'd love to see the spells done in such a way that NPCs can get at them and use them effectively. By means of ASIS, if necessary.

 

- Just a thought: I saw some pix of your planned conjuration stuff. Wow. Sweet. I love that stuff - it's definitely my favorite branch already. There's one issue I have with conjuration, however: I'm guessing that most people travel Skyrim these days with more than one companion - I mean, who doesn't use EFF/AFT/etc.? But if you already have, say, Vilja, Farkas and a dog - and then maybe Esbern or Serana along for the adventure - conjuration tends to end up creating too much of a crowd to be practical. I've found myself wondering now and again whether there could be some way of doing conjuration that is somehow more crowd friendly. Just a thought ...

 

Every spell can be used by NPCs, the issue is that NPCs need to be edited to receive those spells. All of the NPCs. That's why ASIS exists: it has a script that edits your mod for you. Which you should only do as an end user, otherwise there goes compatibility with just about anything.

 

I am however getting rid of scripted damage spells, which means NPCs should more reliably know what to do with them. It may mean eliminating a few destruction spells, but eh.

 

So, it looks like you'll be removing the summon zombie spells? I'm glad to see that, those are the ONLY spells I really don't like at all in the original. Partly because they don't get the visual effects from the 'undead fx' mod (which I love) but also I feel it takes away from the gameplay of reanimating bodies yourself, that's what being a necromancer is all about, and I like necromancy and summoning to be different. Those new lich lords that you posted pictures of are awesome though, that works I think because a lich is a special case, and they look great. I don't know if they use the word in ES lore or not, but in D&D lore at least they're wizards that zombified themselves intentionally and still retain their intelligence, summoning something like that makes sense. I really hope they cast reanimate spells on their own. Not as good the player ones of course, you wouldn't want your summoned lich to be a better necromancer than you :tongue: I like those buff spells you made that you cast on zombies.

 

It looks there's gonna be a lot of good stuff here, I can't wait to see it. Personally, I think your 'balance' is pretty damn good, at least in my game with all my other mods and insane amounts of enemy spawns. I know I'm not smart enough to figure out all the balance issues, but the way I judge things is this: I can make pretty much make any build of character and use any spell/ability from this and doomstones and resplendent and my game is still really damn hard (just the way I like it). And I like to use lots of different characters/builds. I tried a few other spell mods and they were mostly just all overpowered destruction spells that made my game too easy compared to a straight warrior/theif build.

 

Liches exist in TES lore and they are spellcasters. The ApocNew Lich is an offensive spellcaster with 40 damage single target bolts and a 50 damage levitation grab; it costs 0 magicka (while still giving experience) but does drain 500 charge from an equipped enchanted weapon as its casting cost. The Nether Lich (the one with spiderweb robes) is a minion for prolonged encounters, having a 5 damage/30 seconds disease damage attack and the restoration spell Ruin that permanently reduces all stats by 5 with each cast.

 

 

 

There's one issue I have with conjuration, however: I'm guessing that most people travel Skyrim these days with more than one companion - I mean, who doesn't use EFF/AFT/etc.? But if you already have, say, Vilja, Farkas and a dog - and then maybe Esbern or Serana along for the adventure - conjuration tends to end up creating too much of a crowd to be practical. I've found myself wondering now and again whether there could be some way of doing conjuration that is somehow more crowd friendly. Just a thought ...

 

 

If you're playing with four or five followers, I think you're making conjuration obsolete anyway :sad: I don't know what Enai could possibly do about that and still keep it balanced. One of the reasons I stopped using those follower mods. I do use Selene Kate myself, with her settings turned down a bit (I love her and my game would be impossible without her and all my difficulty enhancing stuff) I'm able to use her along with one vanilla follower, and personally I would never want more than two followers.

 

 

To be fair, you can get a Lord of Bindings to summon a Herne for you, which then summons 3 Spirit Wolves for you.

http://www.team-dignitas.net/uploads/tinymce/images/lingrush.jpg

[mikegray]

 

If you're playing with four or five followers, I think you're making conjuration obsolete anyway :sad: I don't know what Enai could possibly do about that and still keep it balanced. One of the reasons I stopped using those follower mods. I do use Selene Kate myself, with her settings turned down a bit (I love her and my game would be impossible without her and all my difficulty enhancing stuff) I'm able to use her along with one vanilla follower, and personally I would never want more than two followers.

 

Yeah ... I expect you're right. I mean, vanilla has various weapons you can conjure, but somehow, they don't really feel like proper conjuration magic. (And they're just not as interesting as "real" weapons ... ) But I do like the idea of conjured creatures that are relatively small and quick - or maybe that can kind of fly or skip around in a messy fight.

 

Thing is, I think conjuration is probably the coolest form of magic in a fight - but outside of fights, I love having a couple followers/companions for the social interaction they add to the game. (Vilja's conversations with other followers and NPCs in general is a lot of what keeps me playing Skyrim.)

 

(Not quite sure why I keep getting stuck with a dog, though. They just kind of turn up ... )

[EnaiSiaion]

Did two out of three remaining minions today.

 

Expert - Dremora Honor Guard

Shiny scarf and armor in reflective royal purple. Has average stats, but while alive it taunts all nearby opponents to attack it first, reducing their armor by 60 in the process. The Xivilai Sorcerer does the opposite, by the way: he makes the enemies go after you instead of him. (The Xivilai Lord just takes all of your magicka instead. Many of the stronger summons don't like you very much)

 

Master - Lord of Bindings

A daedric spellcaster with a weak magic damage attack but it also knows the conjuration spell that is in your other hand when cast and will duly summon it in combat and replace it when dead.

[Xander9009]

Master - Lord of Bindings

A daedric spellcaster with a weak magic damage attack but it also knows the conjuration spell that is in your other hand when cast and will duly summon it in combat and replace it when dead.

What do you mean by replace it when dead. The Lord of Bindings will replace the spell in your other hand when the Lord of Bindings dies? Sorry if it's obvious, but my brain is failing me.

 

Also, those sound nice.

[ryanshowseason2]

 

 

Teleport will be put back in and Levitate/Kinetic Charge removed.

 

 

 

I am disappoint kinetic charge sounded interesting.

 

DAT conjuration tree though.

 

I've always hated conjuration.

You summon things,

you sit back and watch.

You get frustrated with trying to walk through doors

 

What you'll add though is a very user interactive summoning system. I like it a lot! I may actually run a conjuration character which is crazy.

 

Could these spells also work on followers?

[EnaiSiaion]

I left the Necrowitch until last and started work on restoration.

 

So far I already rescripted the instant death spells (did you know Circle of Death didn't proc if the target drops below the threshold while already in the circle?) and added more gameplay to Slay Living by making it a touch spell (plus new awesome visuals). Much more is to come, of course.

 

Restoration is a little harder because the school is about status effects, meaning no interesting aiming (destruction), no metamagics (alteration) and no minions to interact with (conjuration) and on top of that any spells that don't deal damage will have to deal with "why don't you just kill him" syndrome and you can only use one healing spell at a time really.

 

A few ideas:

- Circles are unique to restoration and could do interesting things due to the positioning requirement providing more interactive gameplay.

- Karma: after 10 seconds, any healing or damage you have taken is converted into the opposite and multiplied by 2.

- Bleedout: if target loses 50% health in 10 seconds, target dies.

- Teabag: entering sneak mode while on top of an enemy corpse gives you +10 health each time you do it.

- Health gain or loss multiplied by 2 for 10 seconds.

- TARGET CASTS THE RESTORATION SELF-CAST SPELL IN YOUR OTHER HAND.

So on an obvious level you can make your follower cast a free heal on himherself. Or you can make an enemy at 2/3 health (after 3 Static Fields = 61.4125% health remaining) cast Karma followed by a few grand healings until he's at full health again and then Karma kills him. (Set up this combo using the alteration sequencer) Etc.

 

 

 

I wonder whether I should upload this as a separate mod or an Apocalypse update. A new mod = more attention and videos/endorsements/mod of the week/etc, but Apoc is #65 top mod of all time, which I'd be throwing away. An update = more chance of continuous attention as opposed to it just dying after the first week, but no videos and probably no interest in its release. Arf.

 

 

 

 

Could these spells also work on followers?

 

 

I'm not sure what you intend to use on your followers. Consuming Power? They'll appreciate you reducing their lifespan to 10 seconds. Banish Living? You can do that, though I'm not sure why, unless Lydia is annoying you and you feel like sending her to Quagmire.

 

On an unrelated note: today I ended up with a Churl that had a summoned Churl that had a summoned Churl. Edge cases are fun.

 

There's also an unused spell that gives both you and your enemy a Churl and whoever loses his Churl first takes a gob of damage. It isn't in the mainstream spell list because 1/ direct damage isn't a conjuration thing and 2/ you can cheat with command/banish daedra, but it's funny. I could implement it with a spirit bear or something but Churls are cute and bears aren't.

 

Kind of like that one illusion spell that sneaks a "looks like an attack spell but actually blows up the caster" spell into the target's spellbook.

Edited December 13, 2013 by EnaiSiaion

[TehKaoZ]

For restoration, throwing some random ideas down.

 

concept of Judgements - perhaps several types of debuff's (non-aoe) that cause something to occur when a certain requirement is met.

- Such as when an enemy heals, they loose stamina, or armor, or something

- when they use a power attack, they stagger

 

- protection from daedra from the original package could be moved to resto, could add a toggle protection from undead as well.

 

- of course I'd be remiss if I didn't mention possibly adding a smite like toggle (increases weapon damage toward undead while active)

 

I like the ideas of circle spells you put down, IMO they were the best spells for restoration