Skyrim stuttering 2014

[Deleted5770650User]

a lot of interesting stuff...above...

1) have you UNparked your CPU cores. (i did see a nice improvement from doing it.)

2) test with Hyperthreading on and Off...I bet ON wins.

3) Test with a page file and no page file...(playing Skyrim my System commit ranges from 5 GB - 10 GB)

 

have fun...

 

I did just that, I saw no difference with it on or off.

 

@Reynard131

You can quote all the articles you want from the Microsoft website but none of them were written by Bill Gates.

The average article on Microsoft's web site is not aimed at gaming PCs.

I used to have the page file turned on (until I took a pagefile to the knee), and (long story) Windows update failed (like normal) cause a bsod it took 5 minutes saving the crash dump and nothing could read it no tool from Microsoft, or any other tool.

No I don't have that crash dump for 2 reasons...

1 a reinstall of windows fixed the issue

2 I saw no reason to hang on to a 64GB crash dump file that could not be read.

 

 

as for

 

 

As for the paging file, keep it on. It's not hurting anything.

 

 

For me it is a large waste of space.

I don't see the need to keep a 64-192GB pagefile with not gains.

I also get better performance overall, just not with Skyrim.

I mean with things like 3ds max for example.

I would love to see something get close to using all 64GB of ram other then a RAMdrive.

 

 

• Crash dump setting: If you want a crash dump file to be created during a system crash, a page file or a dedicated dump file must exist and be large enough to back the system crash dump setting. Otherwise, a system memory dump file is not created.
• Peak system commit charge: The system commit charge cannot exceed the system commit limit. This limit is the sum of physical memory (RAM) and all page files combined. If no page files exist, the system commit limit is slightly less than the physical memory installed. Peak system-committed memory usage can vary greatly between systems. Therefore, physical memory and page file sizing also varies.
• Quantity of infrequently accessed pages:

I don't want a crash dump created

I have no troubles with with the system commit being capped at 64GB

I normally cant get windows to use more then 8GB please tell me how I need to worry about the number of pages with 64GB...

Edited August 2, 2014 by Guest

[Akreontage]

Ok, time to add my two sense. You have a lot of hardware, but honestly, not configured correctly.

 

 

That looks like offensive comment to me pretty much.

It is configured correctly.

 

A quick read on the iFPSClamp...in my opinion, it's stupid. With that aside, I can move on.

 

 

What is stupid about iFPSClamp?

I mentioned this in this Steam topic http://steamcommunity.com/app/72850/discussions/0/810921273858659049/?l=english#p3 and people said it is the only thing that helped them. Absolutely everyone confirms this improves situation with stuttering. So this is actually the only thing so far that is not stupid at all.

 

The higher the settings, the higher the resource usage, the worse the performance. Regardless of the application.

 

 

Yeah that's right. I was talking about stuttering.

Despite ultra low/low/medium/high/ultra high settings with high resolution texture pack/without it there are stutters.

 

Please explain to me why you have hyper threading turned off on this cpu...

 

 

I turned hyper threading off for this app (Skyrim) because it utilizes properly only 4 cores. When HT is turned on you get less performance. I have some games which benefit from HT but Skyrim is not one of them.

Again, you say my hardware isn't configured properly and yet you have such questions.

 

And increasing only your bus bandwidth by a gigahertz doesn't do anything except give a faster transmission speed.

 

First of all it's sandy bridge-e.

Second, Skyrim is pretty demanding on CPU. The higher the clock the better the performance. I have a good performance on stock clocks too actually.

 

Won't help if the main GPU is still processing slower than the bus speed. Remember, the computer is only as fast as the slowest component.

 

I don't have CPU bottlenecks.

 

First, do you know what a solid state drive is?

 

Yes... why?

 

As for the GPU clocks at 6ghz, you'd burn it out. You mean the VRAM.

 

What? 6Ghz is stock speed of Vram on my GPU... http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=4178#sp

 

Now, as to your stuttering issue: You have 6 cores, all clocked higher than 4 ghz, plenty of RAM and a fairly powerful video card (about as twice as powerful as mine, a little more perhaps). And whether or not you have an HDD or SSD, it kinda does. If it's solid state, then access times to the textures will be much lower. If it's a HDD, access times will be far higher, which will account for stuttering as your system has to get the hard drive spinning, the heads moving and it has to find and read the information. SSD, they'll find it and load it in about 1/15 the time. 15 ms vs < 1 MS. I'll take the 1 MS or less.

 

Mate, I installed whole Skyrim onto Ram to eliminate this problem.

Do you know what the RamDisk is?

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--wfPiz1F3--/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/188ubq8p1m4rxjpg.jpg

 

I gave the Skyrim every drop of power (including HT off) and yet you tell me to do my homework.

 

While you may see a fraction of a second of micro stutter, it's natural.

 

It's not natural and that is the problem.

Absolutely everything runs perfectly fine on my machine. Monitoring software shows absolutely perfect flow of components. That is why I am so interested in this issue.

 

you can't eliminate time, and that's what this is. I believe this is time, time that the system is taking to process the game so that you can play it.

 

 

I am not so sure about it. As I mentioned before I don't get stutters at cell borders. I'll upload Save file somewhere and share with you. It's the point where stutters occur when moving mouse while standing still.

 

a lot of interesting stuff...above...

1) have you UNparked your CPU cores. (i did see a nice improvement from doing it.)

2) test with Hyperthreading on and Off...I bet ON wins.

3) Test with a page file and no page file...(playing Skyrim my System commit ranges from 5 GB - 10 GB)

 

have fun...

 

1) Yeah, sure thing.

2) Nope. It doesn't win. ) And yes I test every game with ht on and off. And use it/turn it off when I need to.

3) Sure I did. That was the first thing I tried. : ) I have perfectly stable (better performance in some cases) with page file off.

 

I wonder if anyone could write some nonstandard ideas! Craziest of them. Since I am ready to test them.

Edited August 2, 2014 by Akreontage

[Deleted5770650User]

Here is an idea I did not want to mention it as most on the forums here say it will make no difference at best.

Turn off vysnc in Skyrim and use something other then vysnc to limit the frames as needed, unless the game engine freaking out with over 60fps got fixed.

[Lord Garon]

<flame suit>

</quoting reason="TL;DR">

 

Back to the stutter issue...

 

What I have gathered of relevance:

 

VSYNC is usually OFF, ie, iPresentInterval=0 (your frame rate goes above 60 at times)

(iFPSClamp eq 60, ie, VSYNC= essentially ON) AND (uGridsToLoad eq 5) = No Stutter

(iFPSClamp neq 60, ie, VSYNC= essentially OFF) AND (uGridsToLoad eq 5) = Stutter

 

Your stutters may simply be sudden frame rendering issues ("1/100th of a second") as you look around (new assets load to be displayed) and your FPS changes from your monitor refresh rate with no frame buffer output control (VSYNC/iFPSClamp) in effect.

 

Just for testing, enable VSYNC (iPresentInterval=1), disable iFPSClamp (It may try to drop the FPS to half its setting if the system can't maintain the full FPS setting), and re-check for stutter on the bridge. (An enbseries can manage both VSYNC and/or FPS limiting without affecting game engine settings.) You can narrow the cause(s) further by using LOW texture qualities (a smaller mip map) and/or turning off AA, or reducing screen resolution, to check GPU throughput. Also, try a subjective test without Afterburner running.

Edited August 2, 2014 by Lord Garon

[Reynard131]

 

 

@Reynard131

You can quote all the articles you want from the Microsoft website but none of them were written by Bill Gates.

The average article on Microsoft's web site is not aimed at gaming PCs.

I used to have the page file turned on (until I took a pagefile to the knee), and (long story) Windows update failed (like normal) cause a bsod it took 5 minutes saving the crash dump and nothing could read it no tool from Microsoft, or any other tool.

No I don't have that crash dump for 2 reasons...

1 a reinstall of windows fixed the issue

2 I saw no reason to hang on to a 64GB crash dump file that could not be read.

 

 

 

 

 

We are here trying to help the O/P and anyone else that has a similar situation.

 

The O/P obviously got an issue that appears to be related ti the initial set-up of the system this is pretty apparent from the feedback we have gotten.

 

This kind of a stutter can come from many sources we were trying to deal with one of the most common ones.

[Akreontage]

Ok friends. Lets stop offending each other at once and I will try any suggestions on my end.

I am really interested in resolving this problem (if that is possible at all).

 

Since you mentioned vsync and iFPSClamp I did some test runs.

Here we go:

 

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, default nvidia settings > It seems that vsync is still working since I don't get screen tearing.

Stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, vsync forced off in nvidia settings > vsync is not working, physics bugs occur, stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, vsync is forced on in nvidia settings > vsync is working normally, stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, vsync is set to adaptive vsync in nvidia settings > vsync is working, also I can make conclusion that fps does not drop below 60fps since no screen tearing occured during this test run. Stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, vsync is forced on in nvidia settings, frame rate limiter is set to 60 in nvidia inspector > vsync is working, stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, vsync is forced off in nvidia settings, frame rate limiter is set to 60 in nvidia inspector > vsync is not working, stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, adaptive vsync in nvidia settings, frame rate limiter is set to 60 in nvidia inspector > vsync is not working. This tells us that adaptive vsync does not work in pair with frame limiter set to display's refresh rate. Stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, vsync is forced on in nvidia settings, frame rate limiter is set to 60 in nvidia inspector, pre-rendered frames set to 3 > vsync is working, stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, no iFPSClamp tweak, vsync is forced on in nvidia settings, frame rate limiter is turned off, pre-rendered frames set to 3 > vsync is working, stutters occur at specific points, also stutters occur when running every now and then.

ipresentinterval=0, iFPSClamp=60, nvidia default settings > vsync is working, stutters occur at specific points, stutters do not occur when running/doing other stuff at all.

ipresentinterval=0, iFPSClamp=60, vsync is forced on in nvidia settings > vsync is working, stutters occur at specific points, stutters do not occur when running/doing other stuff at all.

ipresentinterval=0, iFPSClamp=60, vsync is forced on in nvidia settings, pre-rendered frames set to 3 > vsync is working, stutters occur at specific points, stutters do not occur when running/doing other stuff at all.

ipresentinterval=0, iFPSClamp=60, adaptive vsync > vsync is working, stutters occur at specific points, it seems that with adaptive vsync stutters occur some times when running.

Changing ipresentinterval to 0 and 1 did not make any changes even when using default driver settings (vsync controlled by app). That was a strange discovery for me since I remember a few years ago when I had bad pc, turning it off definitely turned vsync off. I might be wrong.

Anyway I won't post results with ipresentinterval=1 here since they are identical to those I already mentioned.

The most useful information here so far:

The best way to run Skyrim is to use iFPSClamp=60 in pair with default Skyrim vsync or with vsync forced on in driver settings.

If your pc can handle Skyrim well and maintain MINIMUM 60 fps all the time you will be able to run Skyrim perfectly fine.

If you want your Skyrim to run at 30 fps (perfectly smooth, as far as 30 fps can be smooth...) use half-adaptive vsync and add iFPSClamp=30 to your skyrim.ini file.

But lets get back to our (mine) problem. As you can see Some in-game stutters don't occur because of vsync since they exist even when vsync is forced to be off via drivers.

Reynard131, I tried to turn on page file on another hard drive. It didn't improve situation at all. Also it didn't cause any problems/didn't make any degradation in performance.

Since this does not affect stability, I prefer my page file is to be turned off. Unless you/somebody else has another possible solution/idea which needs page file to be turned on.

I am looking forward to hear any possible ideas you have. Will try them all.

Maybe I'll add mentioned and working/not working methods to my main post.

Gonna try and do some tests on minimum possible settings, turn off official texture hd packs and stuff like that and will tell you results.

But a little bit later. Tired right now.

P.S. Uploaded 2 save files.

https://www.sendspace.com/file/1jcdbb

To test those load them, and DO NOT MOVE! Just turn your mouse slowly to the left till you see mountain.

I did stutter-free version to show you how moving only 1 (!) step to the left made scene COMPLETELY stutter-free. Don't turn your mouse too quickly or you won't notice that single stutter.

I am very sure if you have stable system you will see that stutter at the exact same point since I tried to reproduce this hiccup on completely different pc.

That also tells us that the problem is not hardware specific.

If you get warning when loading save files it's because I use USKP and Rainbows.

The only thing that comes to my mind comparing these two scenes is that there is fog/steam which raises from sawmill and you look directly onto it and the second scene hides steam behind the bushes. You can see but through another transparent textures. I don't know but maybe Skyrim renders steam/fog wrongly if you look at it directly.

But on the other hand I would stutter like crazy when it's foggy weather/foggy area which doesn't happen. Hmmm.

Edited August 2, 2014 by Akreontage

[camaro_69_327]

"" Gonna try and do some tests on minimum possible settings, turn off official texture hd packs and stuff like that and will tell you results.

But a little bit later. Tired right now.""

 

This could be your problem , first have you optimized the official Texture packs?....but lets move on..

 

At what level are you loading your GPU too? (amount of VRAM in use)? AND do you know if you are overfilling it, causing the GPU to swap textures out to the HDD/RAM.

Post a SPM (Skyrim Performance Monitor) Graph. I for one am curious to see at what % Load the Gpu is running.

System Internals has a replacement for "Task manager" Free from Microsoft. > "Process Explorer" it will show you if you are in fact using HDD to swap textures.

 

Being that this is only a 256 bit bus GPU with 2GB VRAM AND you are using the HR-DLC's could just be pushing it to the limits.

 

==========================================

Skyrim does use Hyperthreading, i have a 4 core CPU (I7 2600k) and in this Screenshot you can see 8 threads in use. (that's Process Explorer). Also have you turned all 16 Muti-threading tweaks ON in the Skyrimprefs.ini?

 

 

[General]

bUseThreadedParticleSystem=1

bUseThreadedBlood=1

bUseThreadedMorpher=1

bUseThreadedTempEffects=1

bUseThreadedTextures=1

bUseThreadedMeshes=1

bUseThreadedLOD=1

bUseThreadedAI=1

bUseThreadedMorpher=1

[NavMesh]

bUseThreadedMeshes=1

[Trees]

bUseMultiThreadedTrees=1

[backgroundLoad]

bBackgroundLoadLipFiles=1

bLoadBackgroundFaceGen=1

bUseMultiThreadedFaceGen=1

bBackgroundCellLoads=1

bLoadHelmetsInBackground=1

 

 

Disabled extra stuff in Skyrimprefs.ini?

 

 

bGamePadRumble=0

bMouseAcceleration=0

bUseKinect=0

bGamepadEnable=0

Process Explorer is an amazing program , way better then Taskmanager/Afterburner combination. as it will show you what both programs show in one program.

Screenshot here you can see on the GPU tab, 3 Graphs. Top is GPU Usage (how hard GPU is working), Center is amount of VRAM (Dedicated ) that is in use, and the bottom Graph is amount of System RAM in use by the GPU. When overfilling a GPU the Bottom Graph will start to fill up, when i had my 560ti i could fill that to half way...lol and had extreme stuttering....

Screenshot...here you can see Skyrim will use a boat load of Physical Memory. 8.2 GB in use playing the game. at rest system uses 1.4 - 2 GB. in that screenshot the System Commit is at 15 GB.

Skyrim will use every bit of a system if allowed!

[MDeckman]

Like you said, let's try to figure this issue out.

 

Here is what is happening from my perspective.

 

It's been stated that Skyrim is being given every possible amount of resource and power to perform at it's highest peak level. We have a game that can utilize 4 cores, and we're dealing with a 6 core machine with HT. [i personally believe that HT should be turned on, regardless of whether or not the game/application will properly utilize it.]

 

Skyrim does use Hyperthreading, i have a 4 core CPU (I7 2600k) and in this Screenshot you can see 8 threads in use

Thankyou.

 

Skyrim is loaded into RamDisk [i do know what this does, I looked into it a half year ago and decided it wasn't for me. I have only 16 GB of RAM and I'd need like 24 or something] so that loading resources from an HDD is minimized. A solid state would help remedy this situation and Ram Disk wouldn't be required, but regardless, that's not the current configuration.--this comes down to user preference.

 

It was mentioned that micro-stuttering can come from the computer loading different assets as the person is looking around. This is true as there is a lot of information to load at any given second, and with a finite amount of resources and stock speeds, there will be processing constraints that will demand more time for large amounts of data.

 

There has been lost of testing done, but the micro-stuttering still exists. And now that I think about the situation, the location given as an example, and everything that has been said, I believe Lord Garon is entirely, 100% correct, regardless of what anybody here thinks.

 

 

Your stutters may simply be sudden frame rendering issues ("1/100th of a second") as you look around (new assets load to be displayed) and your FPS changes from your monitor refresh rate with no frame buffer output control (VSYNC/iFPSClamp) in effect.

 

You utilitize RamDisk, you have 6 cores running at 4.4 Ghz. Skyrim uses 4. You have given Skyrim all the power it technically needs, along with the GTX 680 (1536 cores, 2 GB of VRAM, GPU clock of 1 Ghz) so there shouldn't be any issue there.

 

However, .... with only 2 GB of VRAM, you are limited by your 2 GB of VRAM, no matter how fast your memory bandwidth is or how fast the GPU/CPU rates are, you are limited by your VRAM storage amount. I'm going to explain myself, as I tend to jump forward several paces and people get lost, especially on forums. And I'll tie everything together, or at least try to.

 

Now, as you spin around and experience the micro stutter, I believe it's from the loading and unloading of assets- even if you have RamDisk installed and working, the CPU/GPU still has to swap out the information from RAM to VRAM and back. This takes micro seconds, which is the very definition of a micro stutter, as it's taking 1/100th of a second (well technically it's 1/1000th of a second, but that's besides the point). Even if your computer is thinking in nano seconds (that's what a Ghz is) it takes a few micro seconds for the data to be swapped out and your system is displaying that.

 

Like Lord Garon also said, if there is no buffer control and you're just loading the information back and forth, that could be it. Given all that has been said, i believe that if you incorporate an asset buffer of some sort into your configuration, the micro-stutter should be eliminated.

 

And Like I stated earlier...

 

 

However, i believe that this stuttering you see is the game working, it's the computer working, it's the time taken by the system to load the appropriate resources and process them to display and utilize them. While you may see a fraction of a second of micro stutter, it's natural.

 

the micro stutter may be caused by the computer working, as a buffer may not be present. Whether or not the paging file is to blame or not to blame. I read some interesting things, stating that the paging file does and doesn't help performance, specifically because Windows can't figure out when to actually use it properly.

 

Here are some links to posts out side of here of what people are experiencing. The one poster in the overlock.net forums has a similar setup with RamDisk.

 

http://forum.step-project.com/topic/5117-windows-page-file-and-skyrim-load-times/?do=findComment&comment=83966

http://www.overclock.net/t/1418940/is-my-ram-holding-back-skyrim/20#post_20624865

http://www.overclock.net/t/1418940/is-my-ram-holding-back-skyrim/20#post_20625365

http://www.overclock.net/t/1418940/is-my-ram-holding-back-skyrim/20#post_20628030

 

=======================================

and thankyou Camaro_69_327 for the skyrimprefs.ini info. didn't know that they were in there.

 

Does that "1" at the end of those tweaks signifiy that they are "on" or represent the "core" that they are being run on? [ie, 1 is core 1; 2 is core 2] I have a quad core and would like to know. I want to get as much processing power as possible out of it.

Edited August 2, 2014 by MDeckman

[Akreontage]

Completely eliminated stuttering!

 

As I thought it had nothing to do with textures.

The problem is actually really weird and I'll tell you why at the end of this post.

I turned off all dlcs and mods. Just Vanilla Skyrim. It didn't improve anything.

 

Then I started to lower every setting one by one. Changing distant object detail to high from ultra completely eliminated stuttering.

I opened skyrimprefs.ini and tracked down all variables which are affected by this setting.

 

So what matters here is this setting fTreeLoadDistance.

Tweaking any other setting has nothing to do with stuttering.

 

So in the end I can now play completely stutter-free with fTreeLoadDistance set to 40000.

Anything higher and the stutters begin to occur again.

That is the good thing. I can play skyrim stutter free with an eye-candy graphics and stuff, yay for me!

 

Now lets talk about weird stuff. Or at least I personally find it weird.

You see with fTreeLoadDistance=40000+iFPSClamp=60+in-game vsync or forced vsync via nvidia driver gameplay is butter smooth. Absolutely no single stutter. And I am very sensitive to those.

Whats weird is if even I turn every setting to low (by using low profile in skyrim launcher) and turn off every dlc and mod I have but set fTreeLoadDistance to 75000 (it's default ultra value) I'll get stutters.

it's like fTreeLoadDistance >>>> than every single option in this game.

And even more weird fact: if I change uGridsToLoad to 7 I don't get any stutters. If I change that vaule to 9 my fps drops to 58-59 at some locations but I still don't have stuttering. Even more... Just for testing purpose I raised it to 15 grids, and guess what? Low fps but no stuttering.

Don't you think that 15 grids to load is muuuch more demanding than some distant trees? :D

Funny.

[camaro_69_327]

Grabbed your saves, and this is what i observed.....

 

This is Asset stutter. not the micro stutter. this is the game loading assets for your viewing pleasure. As no constant hitching is happening, only as you turn you suddenly load in all of Riverwood. For me it happened on both saves. I may be loading in more (graphics) on a slower HDD so got it on both saves.

 

The instant the save loads (screenshot) the VRAM is at 2075 (more then a 2 GB card has).

as i turned , the stutter happened as the game loaded another 251 MB of data in an instant , for a total of 2326 MB of VRAM...well over your 2048 (2GB) card. As your card is also only a 256 bit bus ...

 

Now this may not be what you have for totals when the game loads , as i do run 254 mods and a crap ton of texture mods including the HR-dlc's and HD 2K Lite.

 

Asset stutter = momentary stutter (on occasion ) goes away once all assets are loaded.

Micro Stutter = always present.