Valve/Bethesda announce paid modding for Skyrim, more games to follow

[boulegue]

In response to post #24566659. #24566689, #24566799 are all replies on the same post.

mikeloeven wrote:

boulegue wrote: then you will just alienate modders from the nexus there are those who want their stuff to be free... those who want to charge for their stuff and those that have free stuff and are thinking about maybe charging for it in the future... also impossible its their right to hide/delete their files from the nexus whenever and for whatever reason they see fit

mikeloeven wrote: doesent change the fact that there should be penalties for pulling content without good justification. for the most part the only times you will see files pulled by the author is if there are major game breaking bugs of a destructive nature or if there is an excessive amount of forum drama. frankly this is a new phenomenon that has the potential to literally damage the integrity of the nexus database by plain and simple greed

Some modders may end up butt hurt but in the long run such a move will serve to protect the community from this abomination. Currently many mods already have a donate button so you cant say that modders cant get paid for their work

its simply impossible the mods you upload are yours, nexus is a platform to share them, the content is still yours to do whatever you want or not (in the rules of the nexus of course) but the nexus cant tell you you cant delete your files to upload them somewhere else

[Swamianand]

In response to post #24565569. #24565839, #24565909, #24565999, #24566174, #24566714 are all replies on the same post.

Elianora wrote:

SirTopas wrote: I applaud your stand, especially in light of the exceptional quality of your work. Question is, what recourse will you have if someone releases a paid mod using any of your resources?

Aryell wrote: Believe me Elianora, I would love to pay for them! But I know it's not the amount of what I could pay that demonstrates the high value of your job and in fact your resources and ideias are being used for several other modders.

A1Shareef wrote: now THIS deservse a Donation Mr.

Elianora wrote: I will file a DCMA and release the wrath of a very angry lady upon them. It's like the fury of a thousand storms.

sheider wrote: I may not use any of your mods, but I have just made a donation to you just because you take this stance. I encourage others to do the same.

I always thought that you are a nice person Elianora and today I'm sure about that.
Stay as you are ;)

[Rigmor]

In response to post #24565164. #24566054, #24566794, #24566804 are all replies on the same post.

undedavenger wrote:

danielleonyett wrote: I think Gopher makes a good point - this won't happen. It would tick off WAY too many people.

Aedred wrote: I hadn't thought about this, but it is a very real possibility.

Jakal256 wrote: It didn't stop them from making paid mods in the first place which also ticked off A LOT of people lol

I beg to differ and predict the next thing Valve and Beth will do is go after mod sites, and I bet Dark will get a nice cease and desist pretty soon. Where there's money involved, which now there is, it's inevitable.

[1erCru]

In response to post #24565684. #24565749, #24565819, #24565874, #24565944, #24566139, #24566154, #24566189, #24566214, #24566264, #24566339, #24566349, #24566439, #24566459, #24566504, #24566524, #24566569, #24566579, #24566644, #24566769, #24566779, #24566819, #24566909 are all replies on the same post.

Brumbek wrote:

Zaldiir wrote: Wait a little bit. See if the updated donation system here on NexusMods will make more people donate. :thumbsup:

If it doesn't increase the amount of donations, then I don't blame you for wanting just a little bit of compensation for your hours of work. $1 or $2 is definitely not greedy - just a shock for a lot of people.

athiust wrote: Your awesome you have caused alot of joy in alot of people and have created satisfaction and an echo within the community

RJ the Shadow wrote: What I think is an option, and an error on Valve's part for not thinking of/considering this, is to make payment optional.

Was there not a thing in the music market (with CD sales only suffering more as years go by) where some artists put up a "pay what you want, or nothing at all" for the mp3's and the sales made for them reached above what they had earned on previous works?

A non-negotiable option should have been to have the mod for free, with payment a convenient option (ideal with Steam have it's Wallet).

There ARE people out there who want to vote with their wallet. But they're not given the option. Instead, they are forced to offer their wallet or are refused the content. And as made obvious, Valve will paywall anything, not even trusting us to use our money to show thanks.

It differs from Paypal Donations because the question is directly forced upon the user. Whereas a Donation button can be skipped or ignored.
Being asked on the spot if you actually want to pay nothing for the content you're about to receive, plays on our sense of morality.

Velgath wrote: My biggest problem with the new system as-is is it kind of screws with people using alternative modding tools like Mod Organizer. Your mod is very worth a fee, but I still wouldn't buy it if it were on Workshop... that said, I may have just clicked a button on your profile page.

Brumbek wrote: Thank you for the comments. Again, I'm so torn. I view myself as an average person. I don't want to be greedy or unfair. Sadly, this new system will bring out the greed in many. Valve, itself, is already pushing $1-3 weapons/armor. Then there's my mod and others like it...so much effort and passion into it. I hate to say human nature is the real issue here...

SMIM does accept donations on Nexus of course (much thanks to you and others who have donated), but in truth my total donations has been very, very low. So for Steam, I see why they want to force a price...people just won't pay if they don't have to, even if they adore a mod and wouldn't play without it. I'm not judging. I will continue to develop my thoughts. Thanks again to everyone who makes this a great community.

heero328 wrote: Do what you have to do. I don't believe anybody would blame you for charging around $2 for SMIM. For what the mod does, that's incredibly generous on your part. I think many are more concerned with the long term implications this could have on modding and the adverse effects of it. It's not necessarily the issue of mod authors receiving money, but the fact publishers and developers are now trying to get a piece of the pie as well.

1erCru wrote: Torn? Um, you have 2.3 million unique downloads. If you charge $2 bucks for the SMIM and take 25% of the cut thats over a million bucks bro.

This is a game changer.

A1Shareef wrote: Its not greedy but think about the modding community as a howl, i bet if you write this in the description of your mod people would be happy to donate you anyway. Its not worth for 25% killing this Community and putting Gamers out there into Electronic Slavery. Plz think about it.

boulegue wrote: to be honest before the paid service for the steam workshop came out i have never even seen the donation button (im not using SMIM since i play on a potato) but you sir defnetly deserve donations or payment period.
you can also set up your mod on both the steam workshop and the nexus and just see what happens

ambria wrote: @ 1erCru
That's presuming everyone who'd downloaded would pay though.
As someone who's made music and put it on bandcamp I can tell you the drop off between downloading for free and paying is huge, even with a tiny paywall like $0.50
I'll have 100 download for free, but only 5-10 with that paywall there

Blademaster1215 wrote: All I'm going to say, while I very much love SMIM, and I appreciate the work you do. I would uninstall SMIM right now if you started paygating. I'd more than happily donate to you -- In fact I'll drop you 10 buck through the Nexus donation system if you don't do paygating.

Psijonica wrote: what is the difference if I pay or donate? If people think that they will get donations then they might as well sell them.

I will never donate or pay. I will sooner stop playing these games altogether just like I don't buy music any more... There will always be a way to get these mods for free...

This is a sad sad day indeed... sadder still is that the Nexus sees it's future in begging people top donate money for their modders... this place lacks vision and the Nexus will fall apart if they don't change they way they conduct business.

SirTopas wrote: Brumbek, I understand your position. You've put in a ton of work on SMIM and you certainly have kept it supported and working. You certainly deserve compensation for your work, but does Steam/BethSoft deserve 75% of the proceeds?

RJ the Shadow wrote: Torn or not, if you join in the paywall game, the rules will change. Nothing guarantees you'll get a lion's share of those 2.3 million unique downloads to be turned into people paying.
And you'll still be paying a huge part of the result to Valve and Bethesda.

If this proves a successful venture (for Valve) in the end, there is very little stopping these companies from looking for ways to counter websites like the Nexus. Valve has proven well enough to happily chase after any angles that make money, consequences be damned.

I know, I know. It's real easy for me to talk like this and not be in your position. It's very easy for me to say that taking part could set a worse precedent for the future. And I am, deeply, sorry that you are forced to find yourself in this position.
But it doesn't make it any less true.

EvilDeadAsh34 wrote: @1erCru

You think that many people would download it if he charged? Think again.

Don't get me wrong. I love what he did and i have made compatibility patches for one of my mods to work with his, but if he charged i wouldn't use it. That goes for any mod.

1erCru wrote: that wasnt my point. My point was simply that a mod like SMIM could generate enough money to make millions of dollars assuming that eventually all mods will be pay to play ( I'd bet on this being true after 5-7 years, its what happens when you monetize just about anything )

Even a fraction of those numbers is hundreds of thousands of dollars. I was clarifying that this isnt about making some " extra coin ". Top modders will get rich off this.

Free modding is dead.

IgnacyOrder wrote: Im for rewarding a modder who did spend a lot of time on his work. Im not a fan of iddea that all mods will be charged. Especially before testing them out. I mean I saw a crowbar for 1$...

I hope donations will work better. Especially since modder will get 100% for his work than 25% only

Uranium - 235 wrote: I think in part the reason donations are low is because Nexus has no unified, easy way to do it. Logging into a paypal and s#*! is just way too much work, not to mention Paypal is garbage in its own right.

If I had a 'Nexus Wallet' or something where you could easily chip $0.50 or $1 in the direction of a mod with a single click of a button, that'd be one thing, but the other problem is you have to get people to fill their wallet.

RiffyDivine wrote: Don't make me pay steam and I'll give you two dollars but since I paid for it I will expect support and updates since I now bought something. This adds expectations on you since you are selling a product now.

Brumbek wrote: Thanks for the continued input. To be clear, SMIM will NEVER, EVER be removed from Skyrim Nexus. It will always be free here, ALWAYS. I've never enjoyed sharing donation info because it makes me seem like I'm pressuring people. But changes to Nexus to improve the visibility of donations would be fine of course.

As for Steam, I understand people not wanting modding to die or something, but honestly I doubt that would happen. The type of people who overcharge or force people to pay are generally not the people we want in our community anyway. Also, there's no denying thousands of people on Steam way overspend on nonsense stuff. Just look at DOTA2 and CS:GO. Artists put out a simple skin and make lots of money. It pains me that people pay so much for so little...plus it tends to drown out the truly worthy content...and in my mind SMIM is worth $2 for the convenience of using Steam Workshop for casual users.

For clarity, SW currently doesn't allow us to truly limit prices. We pick a default price and then the range of $0.25 to $99 always shows in the list. You can force a minimum but not maximum! I do not want to let users pay over $2 because I don't want to engage in extortion! But currently I can't limit it...hence why I'm undecided.

Rigmor wrote: You will eventually isolate yourself, maybe not you IF all your work is your own. But take my mod, employs a team of over 12 voice actors, who pays them? never mind about the other mod authors works included, with their kind permissions, and I worked over 1300 hours in the CK, but I cannot (wont) charge a fee. It's untenable. So why should YOU make money, but not ME? Already the split is showing.

It will eventually be greed wins the day, modders will change the way they do things cynically based of making money. The users, should speak with their wallets, and NEVER entertain this disgusting act Valve and Bethesda (shame on them) have unleashed, a pandoras box, endorse and donate yes. Pay to play NO!

RJ the Shadow wrote: More like pay for the luxury of having it modded...
sigh

Rigmor you nailed it. This is real bad stuff. The money involved is just way too much.

Greed never loses

[RiffyDivine]

In response to post #24566889.

LuDux wrote:

It would be closer to 300 to 600.

[LuDux]

Mod authors deserve compensation, yes.

 

But does Valve and Bethesda deserve 75% of that?

 

Remember, whatever you're paying a mod author, they only see 25%.

[badkrma]

In response to post #24565139. #24565889 is also a reply to the same post.

lilquickguy wrote:

AfroGamerNinja wrote: And signed.

Nothing will change as long as there are people who join them. The only way to stop it is for no one to use it.... Good luck on that.... I love the modders out there but I can't afford to pay for every mod I use, especially if I only use the mod for a short time to try it out and then never use it again. This is a polarizing idea by companies to extort more money wrapped in a "good intent" scenario... a no go for me...

[Lunyra]

Ive hidden some of my Mods on Nexus.

 

Don't want them stolen and sold by someone else on the Black Market Workshop.

 

I might unlock them when the s#*! storm has passed.

[TheVampireDante]

In response to post #24566659. #24566689, #24566799, #24566914 are all replies on the same post.

mikeloeven wrote:

boulegue wrote: then you will just alienate modders from the nexus there are those who want their stuff to be free... those who want to charge for their stuff and those that have free stuff and are thinking about maybe charging for it in the future... also impossible its their right to hide/delete their files from the nexus whenever and for whatever reason they see fit

mikeloeven wrote: doesent change the fact that there should be penalties for pulling content without good justification. for the most part the only times you will see files pulled by the author is if there are major game breaking bugs of a destructive nature or if there is an excessive amount of forum drama. frankly this is a new phenomenon that has the potential to literally damage the integrity of the nexus database by plain and simple greed

Some modders may end up butt hurt but in the long run such a move will serve to protect the community from this abomination. Currently many mods already have a donate button so you cant say that modders cant get paid for their work

boulegue wrote: its simply impossible the mods you upload are yours, nexus is a platform to share them, the content is still yours to do whatever you want or not (in the rules of the nexus of course) but the nexus cant tell you you cant delete your files to upload them somewhere else

Their files, they can do as they wish with them.

That is not going to change.

[sojourner22]

I would like to draw attention to what I believe is the best possible solution. I would love to see more modders getting behind a system like this.

 

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=430718983&searchtext=

 

Use steam workshop as a donation page, but otherwise continue offering the mod on a free basis through the nexus. I believe that this author should be commended and this seems to offer the best of both worlds.