Political Correctness,

[marharth]

 

FACT: Political Correctness is here in all of its obnoxious, choking glory, whether it exists in your particular neighbourhood or not. :wallbash:

FACT: Political Correctness is a load of cobblers. :whistling:

FACT: The Sensible Majority just wish that Political Correctness would go away. :thumbsup:

 

Couldn't have put it better myself Sync182.

That pretty much sums it up.

 

I am trying to figure out how someone can think political correctness can not exist on the internet... Just because it is in a physical place does not mean the communications in that sense are different.

 

Saying that "Every white straight male is OK for life" or something like that is completely untrue. Its discrimination to make such outlandish statements based on race.

[MrDoctorDD]

20 years ago this term didn't exist.

 

I think we should go back 20 years.

[HeyYou]

20 years ago this term didn't exist.

 

I think we should go back 20 years.

 

Gotta agree with ya there doc. We have gone so far "PC", that it is impossible to tell anyone anything bad, as it might "damage their self-esteem"..... no one fails, no one is responsible for their own actions. And we wonder why the world is such a screwed up place...

[myrmaad]

 

We have gone so far "PC", that it is impossible to tell anyone anything bad, as it might "damage their self-esteem"..... no one fails, no one is responsible for their own actions. And we wonder why the world is such a screwed up place...

 

That's not my experience.

 

If you spilled the sugar you should clean it up, but if you bumped someone and they spilled the sugar, then you have a responsibility in the spill and your role should be acknowledged when evaluating the culpability of the sugar spiller.

 

This ignoring the culpability of the sugar spiller is what I see going on politically on a grand scale.

 

I see a lot of scapegoating and blaming that has nothing to do with the reality of how the sugar actually got spilled. If we ignore how the mess was made, we'll never actually get the mess cleaned up.

 

Another way to describe it would be a scenario such that I backended you in my car after I was backended by someone else. What is going on politically is I'm being blamed and asked to pay for the damage to the car I backended, without acknowledging or even addressing the damage my own car sustained, completely letting the culprit who backended me off the hook.

 

--Not going to fly in court and for good reason. If we're going to talk about responsibility let's talk about it responsibly.

 

I also see that in the absence of a population which strives to communicate clearly, concisely, precisely and reasonably we have a population that latches on to catchphrases, soundbytes, rhetoric and cliches that do nothing to enhance actual problemsolving.

 

Life may have become more complex but I doubt it's any worse than it's ever been, universally.

[BlackBaron2]

Going back in time, as I keep saying, would mean that things are worse for most people. Things in the past sucked for everybody who was not a nobleman.

[HeyYou]

 

We have gone so far "PC", that it is impossible to tell anyone anything bad, as it might "damage their self-esteem"..... no one fails, no one is responsible for their own actions. And we wonder why the world is such a screwed up place...

 

That's not my experience.

 

If you spilled the sugar you should clean it up, but if you bumped someone and they spilled the sugar, then you have a responsibility in the spill and your role should be acknowledged when evaluating the culpability of the sugar spiller.

 

This ignoring the culpability of the sugar spiller is what I see going on politically on a grand scale.

 

I see a lot of scapegoating and blaming that has nothing to do with the reality of how the sugar actually got spilled. If we ignore how the mess was made, we'll never actually get the mess cleaned up.

 

Another way to describe it would be a scenario such that I backended you in my car after I was backended by someone else. What is going on politically is I'm being blamed and asked to pay for the damage to the car I backended, without acknowledging or even addressing the damage my own car sustained, completely letting the culprit who backended me off the hook.

 

--Not going to fly in court and for good reason. If we're going to talk about responsibility let's talk about it responsibly.

 

I also see that in the absence of a population which strives to communicate clearly, concisely, precisely and reasonably we have a population that latches on to catchphrases, soundbytes, rhetoric and cliches that do nothing to enhance actual problemsolving.

 

Life may have become more complex but I doubt it's any worse than it's ever been, universally.

 

Erm, color me confused. :D First, you state that the premise of my earlier statement was false in your experience, and then you provide two examples of exactly what I am talking about? Or, at least, pretty close.

 

I refer more to our corporate criminals... and the justice system in general. It has been acknowledged that wall street was pretty much the main instigator of the current economic woes we are experiencing, but, were ANY of them held accountable? No, quite the opposite, they were bailed out with taxpayer money. You know, the very folks that they screwed in the first place? So, not only did they make millions (individually) from the deals, when things went south, the government gave them billions of dollars (millions of which was paid out as "retention bonuses"......) to keep them solvent, and then the banks turned around and foreclosed on the homes anyway. So, they get the profit from the original deals, the government bailout, and they STILL get to keep the properties? Who gets screwed here? The folks that paid the taxes that provided the bailouts for bad home loans, that STILL lost their house.

 

And what about schools, and bullying? Do the schools actually DO anything about it? Not in my experience. (I have a couple kids, and grandkids currently in the public school system...) The bullies can do whatever they want, without fear of recrimination. The schools are too afraid of parents with lawyers, to actually even attempt to have anything even remotely resembling discipline in the schools. Not to mention, if the boot little Johnny out, because he beats up kids everyday, they lose their funding for that child...... but of course, it can't possibly be a problem with Johnny's behavior, he has to have some disorder or other, or, a bad home life, or even some traumatic experience when he was in the womb that explains away all his bad behavior, and we should 'make allowances' for that.

 

I say: BullTicky. (you get the idea.)

 

Do the crime, do the time. I don't care if you are a certifiable screaming lunatic, if you kill someone, be it with a weapon, intentionally, or with your car, because you are drunk, either way is still murder, and life in prison should be where you end up.

[myrmaad]

 

Erm, color me confused.=

 

Then that makes two of us, as I don't understand what Political Correctness has to do with a bipartisan wall street bailout, or what Political Correctness has to do with bullying in public schools.

 

As the great-aunt and godmother of a 5 year old with a severe mental disability (already diagnosed as bipolar, at 3 threatened to behead the kitten and throw it in the dumpster; his mother is drug abuser and used heavily prenatally, and went to jail when he was 3 months old leaving him abandoned at a critical developmental period.) He's basically the kid you described.

 

This is simply the facts and not "PC" because I don't want my kid around him, and yet what to do? What exactly do you suggest again? Do the crime, do the time? Remember this is a five year old. He does not respond to spanking, and I worry that violence begets violence especially in his case.

 

Sure his mother has responsibility in this, but I witnessed her serious abuse at the hands of family members when I was too young to do anything about it, none of those people were ever held accountable over 20 years ago in that idyllic perfect world you all mentioned.

 

This is exactly what I mean when I say I'm sick of cliches and want reasonable, constructive, thoughtful solutions.

[HeyYou]

It isn't the acts themselves, it is the reasoning behind them. Have you noticed the trend of late, where colleges/universities have been forced to add more remedial courses, as the incoming students are not quite up to snuff on basics, like reading, and math? Why do you think that is? Could it possibly be because the schools can't fail students, as it might cause them undo stress???? (not like going out into the world unprepared isn't going to be stressful.....)

 

Trouble becomes, there are no "perfect" solutions. We live in a flawed world, and sometimes, the only real solution, is just a choice of the lesser of two evils.

[myrmaad]

It isn't the acts themselves, it is the reasoning behind them. Have you noticed the trend of late, where colleges/universities have been forced to add more remedial courses, as the incoming students are not quite up to snuff on basics, like reading, and math? Why do you think that is? Could it possibly be because the schools can't fail students, as it might cause them undo stress???? (not like going out into the world unprepared isn't going to be stressful.....)

 

Trouble becomes, there are no "perfect" solutions. We live in a flawed world, and sometimes, the only real solution, is just a choice of the lesser of two evils.

 

Yes I've noticed the dismal state of higher education and I arrived at a different conclusion as to the 'why'. I certainly disagree with the conclusion that the reason kids aren't held back is because it might cause them 'undue stress'. <-- Laughs sadly at cliche. Coming from a family dominated by farmers and teachers, I do realize that teachers are human too, but with all their flaws I know without a shadow of a doubt that's not the reason. Now, we can get into the reasons, but that may be fodder for a different debate, but I'm game if you are. It just needs a new topic/thread. Short answer is that grade retention seldom leads to subsequent success, in fact failing fails.

 

I guess it's much easier to choose the "lesser of two evils" now and kick the can down the road for someone else to solve, hm? :) I know you well enough to think you can do better than that.

[HeyYou]

For some things, there is no really "good" solution. The child you mentioned is a perfect example. Unless something dramatic changes in that childs life, he is going to grow up to be an adult, with all of the same issues, and the same behavioral problems. So, what do we do? I seriously doubt counseling is going to even make a dent..... shall we stuff him into an institution for the rest of his life, to protect the rest of society? Shall we euthanize him, so that society doesn't have to bear the burden of supporting him in an institution all his life? Exile him to an island somewhere, with others that are also unable to function normally in society? Now, what would have to change, to make that child into a "successful" adult? That is a very good question, and if we could find the answer to that one, the problem would become quite simple. Trouble is, we don't have the answer, nor do I expect us to any time soon. One solution would be to see to it that the circumstances that brought that child to the point he is at now, don't happen. But, there are many, many stumbling blocks to that one as well. Not sure if it falls into the "PC" category...... but, you have to have a license to drive, you need some manner of certification to legally perform a rather large number of jobs, yet others, require years of education, before you can even begin, but, any one and their cousin can create a child.... whether they have the means/ability to raise them or not. Start stepping into that arena, and the hue and cry will be heard round the world.... and the torch and pitchfork gang will come a'huntin'...... (unless of course, you live in a country with a totalitarian government...... China, for instance....)

 

I too grew up around teachers. Oddly enough, I went to school too. :D (granted, horses and buggies were still common.....) My father was a teacher all his life. (something I considered doing as well, but, circumstances prevented me from going that route.) What I see around here, and other places I have had dealings with schools, and school authorities is, teachers have no authority. None. Zero. The students can do whatever they want, and the teacher has zero recourse to prevent it. The rules have change dramatically since I was in High School even. (as an example..... for my demonstration speech, I took a japanese Nambu light machine gun to school, my speech was on care and cleaning...... lets see ya try THAT trick these days..... yes, I cleared it with school authorities BEFORE I walked into school with a flippin' machine gun.) School administrators are saddled with several layers of managers above them, they seem to be severely out of touch with reality. My teenaged daughter had a leather bracelet, that had FLAT studs in it. It was confiscated, because it was deemed a weapon....... I just looked at the principle sideways, A weapon??? I can do more damage to you with a damn PENCIL, you gonna ban those too?? I offered a demonstration, but, he declined......

 

And why is that? Most of it is due to the government sticking their noses where it really doesn't belong. Passing laws that they have no clue what the impact will be, in the interests of 'protecting the child', or some such nonsense. This is where the "can't fail" thing comes in....... after all, we wouldn't want to crush little Johnny's fragile developing ego, by telling him that his work just isn't good enough, now would we?? I have seen "graduates" that couldn't even flippin' read their own diploma. But they get full ride athletic scholarships....... another school here wants to spend 800,000 dollars, resurfacing their football PRACTICE field, at the same time, they are talking budget woes, and are going to lay off six teachers......

 

But again, I digress...... WAY off topic. (nah, I would NEVER do that.......)

Edited May 21, 2011 by HeyYou