san bernidino. what can we do/

[modder3434]

There is one very obvious point no one seems willing to admit about not letting muslims immigrate here:

For several years, we've been watching the brutal slaughter of jews and christians by ISIS. Far worse than any other nation from which we take political, religious, or war refugees. We've seen that some of these sects are based olmost exclusively on tribal affiliation; quite literally, their religion is ther "nationality", a mind-set that the rest of the world lost centuries ago.

 

We're watching honest genocide. These jews and christians meet all the qualifications for all three catagoriesm of refugee. The muslims oppressing them dont really need evacuation; the ones we see running, for the most part, are simply trying to dodge their nations' draft because they dont want to fight ISIS. The muslims fleeing arent in "lufe and limb" danger like the jewqs and christians are.

 

What is going on right now happened already in WWII; operation paperclip, where we imported nazi scientists instead of jews on their way to the camps. That at least was justified by giving us tools to end the war. (which is a *beeping beepy* reason) Your asking to do the same again, only this tome, there isnt even an attempt to justify it. You ask "Whats happened to America?" What indeed? That you would even consider letting in healthy young men that SHOULD be fighting these psychopaths and leave out the ones actually in danger?

 

I'm not against helping people who need help, what I am opposed to is it being forced down our throughts, and then the bulk of the refugees they want to import are the ones we should leave there, and save the christians and jews instead. that is what i think about the situation as a compassionate person.

 

However I can't afford any more compassion, those who don't need it, and those who abuse it have spoiled it for others....so with no motion in me, I have to say that if we can't verifiy with certainity ( not guesswork, not with x% margin of error) who we would be importing into the US for help then I'd rather we help noone especially since we can't seem to fix our own issues right now.....adding in foreign refugees that cost money and produce nothing will only hasten our destruction.

 

since my friend isn't here, I'' say it for him "I doubt these are legit refugees, rather a more subtle way to get agents of the enemy into far off countries en masse, in layman's terms a bloodless invasion, hosted and funded by the nations they seek to destroy"

[dpgillam]

I understand that sentiment. Im just saying that offering aid to "only" jews and christians isnt out of any bigotry or fear or other lies you hear from the media. These people are being beheaded with garden saws, burnt alive, dragged to dead, and other cruel tortures very few Americans can even comprehend, much less imagine.

 

But you do raise a good point. 51% of Ameruca is on some kind of federal assistance. The U6, the number of people un- or under-employed; that is, the number of people that want 40 hour work week jobs, but cant find one, is still at 14.4% To put that in perspective, at the height of the recession, it was just under 17%. The savings is long gone, the unemplyment is used up, people are out of every option except working like the Greeks: holding 2-4 part-time jobs to try and make ends meet. And thats the middle class.

[modder3434]

I understand that sentiment. Im just saying that offering aid to "only" jews and christians isnt out of any bigotry or fear or other lies you hear from the media. These people are being beheaded with garden saws, burnt alive, dragged to dead, and other cruel tortures very few Americans can even comprehend, much less imagine.

 

no disagreement here, but as much as it hurts my soul to say it.....that level of violence is nothing new for that region of the world.

 

yes it may have been stable...er under tyrant dictators and the US messed up, we arn't the first govt to interfere in tha region and casue problems, the Allies did so at the end of WW1 and that turned out so well.

 

hoever even under somewhat a stable govts in the region, violence is just a fact of life...and I'm tired of other nations getting involved, simply becasue they have resources we need to function (oil etc). If we had a reliable alternate fuel source, or found massive quanitites of oil that we could sell or some other govt thats friendly and stable....then nobody would really care that the people in the middle east want to slaughter each other.

 

I find it irritating, that for a region of the world that hoarbored great knowledge during europe's dark age and preseved it, that they are unable to move out of the middle ages. Its the samething in Africa, where someone gets their hand cut offf, becasue therir grandmother's sister was part of a diffrent tribe.

 

At a certain point I have to cease caring about those regions of the world and focus on saving the region that I live in.

[Vagrant0]

It's a bad corner we've backed ourselves into.

 

You can't just exclude people from entering the US. Not only is against the very thing that the US stands for. Not only does it put us in a precarious state when it comes to those business relations that have developed with the Middle East. But is also, unilaterally, does not work. Every day there are hundreds of people hopping across the border from Canada or Mexico, both legally and illegally. We can't even keep out people who essentially cross without any sort of documentation, how are we going to enact some sort of testing to see if someone is Muslim or not? It's just plain ignorant of how things are to even suggest such a thing in a serious tone. And we all know that the next brilliant idea along this line is to try and re-locate people where they can be more easily monitored and be assured that they are not near any major city... Because you have to do 'something' about the ones who are already here and who are likely to be rather pissed off.

 

We can't just ignore them since they are intent on bringing the whole house of cards down with them. They have taken the last 10 years to get organized, study the ways we've been responding to terrorism, and solidifying their power. The actions they're taking now are designed to use our news media against us, make politicians work towards impossible solutions, and complicate those things that were already working. They are resolute in bringing Western culture to its knees, while we've spinning our wheels uselessly and fighting amongst ourselves over crap that doesn't actually matter from one week to the next.

 

And we can't just kill them. Even if we could afford something as ambitious as a clean sweep of the Middle East, public opinion would be decidedly against it. Even if their attacks became more bold and destructive, there would still be riots in the US against any military action because that is the culture we've allowed to be created here. 100 or even 1000 deaths from a terrorist act don't mean anything when it isn't somewhere near you. 1,000 or even 10,000 dead Americans don't mean anything compared to the number of also innocent civilians in the Middle East who have died from bombing or drone attacks. Each of those deaths we've made happen only add fervor to their cause. Answering genocide with genocide only leaves too many bodies left to count and nobody better off. And yet, they're the ones who are committed to the notion.

 

 

The only solution is to not read from the script they are handing us, change the way we react to these threats. Look at the situation logically instead of emotionally. Where logical similarities exist, follow up on them to seek out other plots instead of stopping yourself short because some people might be oppressed. But in that same notion, not be blinded by trivialities such as race, religion or gender; Muslim is a co-relation, not a causation. Grant rights and training to mentally and psychologically stable and responsible civilians to arm themselves so that threats can be responded to as they occur; local militia was once a thing. Make these groups enemies within their own communities so they don't have help or resources to pull from when trying to devise a plot, leave them with no leg to stand on. If we're going to change our culture, then we might as well aim for a culture that is stronger and more resilient without slipping into fascist propaganda.

[WursWaldo]

There is no way to say what needs to be said here without getting banned; can bash Christians and Jews but not Muslims. That is huge part of the problem; not only on this skewed to the Left site but in politically correct Western society in general.

 

Conceal and Carry: it should be required by law that anyone with a licence be authorized to have their weapon with them at all times. Terrorist ignore 'Gun-free' zone signs so citizens who have the right to carry should be allowed to do so anywhere. Liberal butt-hurt be damned. I lived in a country where Muslim warlords and their Wahhabi goons lived by the rule of the gun and the only thing that stopped them was people with guns who were willing to shoot back.

[modder3434]

It's a bad corner we've backed ourselves into.

 

You can't just exclude people from entering the US. Not only is against the very thing that the US stands for. Not only does it put us in a precarious state when it comes to those business relations that have developed with the Middle East. But is also, unilaterally, does not work. Every day there are hundreds of people hopping across the border from Canada or Mexico, both legally and illegally. We can't even keep out people who essentially cross without any sort of documentation, how are we going to enact some sort of testing to see if someone is Muslim or not? It's just plain ignorant of how things are to even suggest such a thing in a serious tone. And we all know that the next brilliant idea along this line is to try and re-locate people where they can be more easily monitored and be assured that they are not near any major city... Because you have to do 'something' about the ones who are already here and who are likely to be rather pissed off.

 

We can't just ignore them since they are intent on bringing the whole house of cards down with them. They have taken the last 10 years to get organized, study the ways we've been responding to terrorism, and solidifying their power. The actions they're taking now are designed to use our news media against us, make politicians work towards impossible solutions, and complicate those things that were already working. They are resolute in bringing Western culture to its knees, while we've spinning our wheels uselessly and fighting amongst ourselves over crap that doesn't actually matter from one week to the next.

 

And we can't just kill them. Even if we could afford something as ambitious as a clean sweep of the Middle East, public opinion would be decidedly against it. Even if their attacks became more bold and destructive, there would still be riots in the US against any military action because that is the culture we've allowed to be created here. 100 or even 1000 deaths from a terrorist act don't mean anything when it isn't somewhere near you. 1,000 or even 10,000 dead Americans don't mean anything compared to the number of also innocent civilians in the Middle East who have died from bombing or drone attacks. Each of those deaths we've made happen only add fervor to their cause. Answering genocide with genocide only leaves too many bodies left to count and nobody better off. And yet, they're the ones who are committed to the notion.

 

 

The only solution is to not read from the script they are handing us, change the way we react to these threats. Look at the situation logically instead of emotionally. Where logical similarities exist, follow up on them to seek out other plots instead of stopping yourself short because some people might be oppressed. But in that same notion, not be blinded by trivialities such as race, religion or gender; Muslim is a co-relation, not a causation. Grant rights and training to mentally and psychologically stable and responsible civilians to arm themselves so that threats can be responded to as they occur; local militia was once a thing. Make these groups enemies within their own communities so they don't have help or resources to pull from when trying to devise a plot, leave them with no leg to stand on. If we're going to change our culture, then we might as well aim for a culture that is stronger and more resilient without slipping into fascist propaganda.

 

- I never said ban anybody from the US, however we don't have to accept refugees from other nations. It might be expected of us, as the leader of the free world, but its not a requirement.

 

- As for the muslims, christians and jews that are fleeing...I admit I would be more ready to help the christians and jews, rather then the muslim refugees, simply because, I'm somewhat paranoid about having kindness repaid with a shiv to the back, however if we were fighting Christian terrorists rather then Islamic terrorists, then I would be paranoid equally.

 

- I know that people cross the border all the time....and its dang impossible to do anything about it sort of drastic measures that won't happen. However IF, we were to bring groups of refugees here from the middle east, we could control the transportation personally and perform said checks etc that way, prior to letting them loss upon US soil. (not counting any who made thier way here and then came in through Mexico, in which case the leaky border point stands). As for the ones already here...we can keep an eye out and when they do something...solve the problem, but bringing more refugees, that we fly personally over here only complicates a problem we already have, and the only ones who like it are the bleeding hearts in certain organizations whose blind love of their fellow man will get them killed.

 

- we could ignore them, if they didn't have us by the short and curlies, and we had enough stones to say enough and walk away and refuse to play the game.

 

- I agree that if we play to their tempo then we have lost...in ways we already have.

 

- I know a total war plan to raze the Middle East isn't feasible, and I didn't advocate that..

 

- Yes there are groups in the Middle East that we can work with, train and fight with if needed, but the foreign policy is f****ed three ways from Sunday, and no one in the postion to do anything will perform those actions, or we just continue to support groups that are only slightly better then the ones we are fighting.

[HeyYou]

Want to reduce mass-shootings? Ban gun-free zones. We have the second amendment for a REASON, designating areas where it does not apply is pretty much claiming them to be "Target Rich Environments"....... Ever notice that almost EVERY mass-shooting has happened in a gun free zone? Ever wonder why you don't see mass-shootings are gun ranges, or police stations? So-called "gun control" only controls the law-abiding. Banning specific types of weapons, or high-capacity magazines, or any of the other nonsense isn't going to make one whit of difference. The folks committing these crimes are ALREADY breaking many laws, a couple more aren't even going to register for them. Banning assault weapons to 'reduce mass shootings' is roughly akin to banning whiskey to prevent drunk driving....... and equally as useless.

[kvnchrist]

There is one very obvious point no one seems willing to admit about not letting muslims immigrate here:

For several years, we've been watching the brutal slaughter of jews and christians by ISIS. Far worse than any other nation from which we take political, religious, or war refugees. We've seen that some of these sects are based olmost exclusively on tribal affiliation; quite literally, their religion is ther "nationality", a mind-set that the rest of the world lost centuries ago.

 

We're watching honest genocide. These jews and christians meet all the qualifications for all three catagoriesm of refugee. The muslims oppressing them dont really need evacuation; the ones we see running, for the most part, are simply trying to dodge their nations' draft because they dont want to fight ISIS. The muslims fleeing arent in "lufe and limb" danger like the jewqs and christians are.

 

What is going on right now happened already in WWII; operation paperclip, where we imported nazi scientists instead of jews on their way to the camps. That at least was justified by giving us tools to end the war. (which is a *beeping beepy* reason) Your asking to do the same again, only this tome, there isnt even an attempt to justify it. You ask "Whats happened to America?" What indeed? That you would even consider letting in healthy young men that SHOULD be fighting these psychopaths and leave out the ones actually in danger?

This is not religion. This is politicsas the vehicle and religion as the fuel.

What they hate is several hundred years of interfereance from the West into their society and the dismissal of their rights as citizens of their country and their worls, so those of the west can be more comfortable being around them.

[RGMage2]

Just a thought here, I’m thinking that instead of focusing on refugees fleeing war, it might be more productive to aim our anger at the wealthy and powerful elites of some of these countries, who not only condone, but also encourage the spread of hatred against western peoples and western culture. Countries like Pakistan and Saudi Arabia where promoting anti-western ideology seems to have become a cottage industry.

The wealthy and powerful of these nations enjoy shopping in London and pleasuring themselves on the Riviera, fully indulging in everything that western culture has to offer. These hypocrites, when they return to their own countries make a great pretense of being pious Muslims, promoting Wahhabism, and funding Madrasas that churn out thousands of potential terrorists. If all western nations were to sanction these people and keep them out, freeze their bank accounts (worth billions) then maybe they might get the message to clamp down on the purveyors of hate.

An arms embargo against Pakistan and Saudi Arabia could do wonders to fix this mess. Pakistan is living in fear of India, Saudi Arabia fears Iran. If we took away their ability to defend themselves, and maybe even threatened to ally with their enemies it could give them real motivation to move in the right direction.

Another solution would be to do something really radical and disengage from the middle east, stop interfering in the affairs of other nations, stop trying to subjugate the world in a vain attempt to remake it in our own ugly image.

Of course none of this can ever happen because for the west the truth is unthinkable and something we will refuse to embrace.