kvnchrist

Ya and while your at it , you might as well point out that water is wet ... hehe . But am curious what would constitute a society that did not build anything ? Is it a culture that does not exploit or at least very little ? Because the inverse is what I would constitute as not building anything . Which is where I think American society is at , always in Exploit mode. I've changed my mind on America splitting into 2 federal entities being a good thing. At least while I would have to live through the change ... since it would take 10-20ish years of turmoil before we would get a working government for the people out of it. (being the whole reason to do it) So meh ... let the non voting generation deal with it when they decide just looking at their iphones isn't working anymore. And technology is more what I was talking about ... since there are so many life skills that are getting phased out by it . Plus introducing so many new ways of exploit. (not in a good way) At a guess, I would say that the native americans were not exploitative, and most of them didn't really build anything permanent... (there are exceptions....) That would likely to apply to pretty much any nomadic people as well. And their lifestyle didn't change for thousands of years, and even then, it was because of an outside influence. (spanish introducing horses, europeans taking over the land.....) I'm not a great fan of technological advances as much as I am social progression. Just look at what we do with the tech we have now. We have the internet and look at how many who each day segregate ourselves into our own respective little forums to talk with people who agree with us about those we collectively hate. How much actual thought is needed to regurgitate old prejudices? Are we actually progressing or are we regressing, seeing how many times in the past few years that physical violence has erupted.? How many times have we heard the statement that someone had pissed someone else off when in reality those making these statements let themselves become pissed off. The fact is that no one can make any of us angrey. We let ourselves become angry because of our own assumptions. Admiral Rickover used to interview each candidate for submarine school. One of his tests was "You have 3 seconds to piss me off." This brought about a wide variety of behaviors.... the most effective of which was the guy that immediately grabbed the model submarine on the admirals desk, and promptly smashed it. Needless to say, the admiral was pissed. :D (and the guy got into submarine school.......) So yeah, it is most certainly possible for others actions/words to piss someone off. To deny that, is to deny reality. Humans are emotional animals. There is no getting around that. Sorry, but no. Emotions are feelings and as such can be controlled if control is more important to a person than being controlled. It's all in whats important to you. It's my experience that the less you think of imagery such as being arrogant or placing undue importance on material items the less chance of being effected by others interactions with you. Knowing yourself and loving others in such a way as to endeavor to understand the situation can do wonders at this. Booker T Washington had a very excellent quote " I shall allow no man to belittle my soul by making me hate him." When you are angered, you hate and that's something that can not be gotten around. You either hate what was done or the person doing what was done. Like I said its a value system. Yes, emotions are feelings. And for the most part, they can be controlled. But not 100% of the time. Terribly sorry, but, if you are a human being, and not some variety of sociopath/psychopath, then it is indeed possible for other people to piss you off. In fact, it's rather likely that it will happen to you quite frequently over the course of your life. You may not necessarily REACT, but, it's highly likely various folks have made you angry over the course of your life.... And really, hate doesn't enter into it. Many people have pissed me off over the years. I don't hate them, nor do I hate their actions. I get over it. Just like most other folks. Wow! Did you find a crowd rallying in the street while you walking your dog today? Did you feel the excitement of your youth surging in your blood and hope to see a fight break out? Which I conclude; from my own experiences how the thrill from the others in the crowd causes a vibrating sensation our bodies experience and does get me so excited. And yet I believe we share that kind of nervous thrill? When we are near the excited mass of people we hope we are able to run; fast enough if we see the battle begin; to either get into the brawl, or run away with the dog and find comfort behind our brick and mortar prison's concrete walls. Do you have a key to your cell or are you the warden of your keep? Sarcasm is a poor excuse for debate. If you have a point then bring it forward and we will discus it. If not then I will revert back to my statement that I am not here to be liked. Nor am I here to waste time respecting the post of someone who obviously disrespects mine.

Ya and while your at it , you might as well point out that water is wet ... hehe . But am curious what would constitute a society that did not build anything ? Is it a culture that does not exploit or at least very little ? Because the inverse is what I would constitute as not building anything . Which is where I think American society is at , always in Exploit mode. I've changed my mind on America splitting into 2 federal entities being a good thing. At least while I would have to live through the change ... since it would take 10-20ish years of turmoil before we would get a working government for the people out of it. (being the whole reason to do it) So meh ... let the non voting generation deal with it when they decide just looking at their iphones isn't working anymore. And technology is more what I was talking about ... since there are so many life skills that are getting phased out by it . Plus introducing so many new ways of exploit. (not in a good way) At a guess, I would say that the native americans were not exploitative, and most of them didn't really build anything permanent... (there are exceptions....) That would likely to apply to pretty much any nomadic people as well. And their lifestyle didn't change for thousands of years, and even then, it was because of an outside influence. (spanish introducing horses, europeans taking over the land.....) I'm not a great fan of technological advances as much as I am social progression. Just look at what we do with the tech we have now. We have the internet and look at how many who each day segregate ourselves into our own respective little forums to talk with people who agree with us about those we collectively hate. How much actual thought is needed to regurgitate old prejudices? Are we actually progressing or are we regressing, seeing how many times in the past few years that physical violence has erupted.? How many times have we heard the statement that someone had pissed someone else off when in reality those making these statements let themselves become pissed off. The fact is that no one can make any of us angrey. We let ourselves become angry because of our own assumptions. Admiral Rickover used to interview each candidate for submarine school. One of his tests was "You have 3 seconds to piss me off." This brought about a wide variety of behaviors.... the most effective of which was the guy that immediately grabbed the model submarine on the admirals desk, and promptly smashed it. Needless to say, the admiral was pissed. :D (and the guy got into submarine school.......) So yeah, it is most certainly possible for others actions/words to piss someone off. To deny that, is to deny reality. Humans are emotional animals. There is no getting around that. Sorry, but no. Emotions are feelings and as such can be controlled if control is more important to a person than being controlled. It's all in whats important to you. It's my experience that the less you think of imagery such as being arrogant or placing undue importance on material items the less chance of being effected by others interactions with you. Knowing yourself and loving others in such a way as to endeavor to understand the situation can do wonders at this. Booker T Washington had a very excellent quote " I shall allow no man to belittle my soul by making me hate him." When you are angered, you hate and that's something that can not be gotten around. You either hate what was done or the person doing what was done. Like I said its a value system. Yes, emotions are feelings. And for the most part, they can be controlled. But not 100% of the time. Terribly sorry, but, if you are a human being, and not some variety of sociopath/psychopath, then it is indeed possible for other people to piss you off. In fact, it's rather likely that it will happen to you quite frequently over the course of your life. You may not necessarily REACT, but, it's highly likely various folks have made you angry over the course of your life.... And really, hate doesn't enter into it. Many people have pissed me off over the years. I don't hate them, nor do I hate their actions. I get over it. Just like most other folks. you can not be angered at anything unless you give it permission to anger you. you can be bothered by something, you can even be upset by something that happens to you, but if you allow it to anger you, that is your fault that you are angry, not the antagonists.

There is every getting arou Ya and while your at it , you might as well point out that water is wet ... hehe . But am curious what would constitute a society that did not build anything ? Is it a culture that does not exploit or at least very little ? Because the inverse is what I would constitute as not building anything . Which is where I think American society is at , always in Exploit mode. I've changed my mind on America splitting into 2 federal entities being a good thing. At least while I would have to live through the change ... since it would take 10-20ish years of turmoil before we would get a working government for the people out of it. (being the whole reason to do it) So meh ... let the non voting generation deal with it when they decide just looking at their iphones isn't working anymore. And technology is more what I was talking about ... since there are so many life skills that are getting phased out by it . Plus introducing so many new ways of exploit. (not in a good way) At a guess, I would say that the native americans were not exploitative, and most of them didn't really build anything permanent... (there are exceptions....) That would likely to apply to pretty much any nomadic people as well. And their lifestyle didn't change for thousands of years, and even then, it was because of an outside influence. (spanish introducing horses, europeans taking over the land.....) I'm not a great fan of technological advances as much as I am social progression. Just look at what we do with the tech we have now. We have the internet and look at how many who each day segregate ourselves into our own respective little forums to talk with people who agree with us about those we collectively hate. How much actual thought is needed to regurgitate old prejudices? Are we actually progressing or are we regressing, seeing how many times in the past few years that physical violence has erupted.? How many times have we heard the statement that someone had pissed someone else off when in reality those making these statements let themselves become pissed off. The fact is that no one can make any of us angrey. We let ourselves become angry because of our own assumptions. Admiral Rickover used to interview each candidate for submarine school. One of his tests was "You have 3 seconds to piss me off." This brought about a wide variety of behaviors.... the most effective of which was the guy that immediately grabbed the model submarine on the admirals desk, and promptly smashed it. Needless to say, the admiral was pissed. :D (and the guy got into submarine school.......) So yeah, it is most certainly possible for others actions/words to piss someone off. To deny that, is to deny reality. Humans are emotional animals. There is no getting around that. Sorry, but no. Emotions are feelings and as such can be controlled if control is more important to a person than being controlled. It's all in whats important to you. It's my experience that the less you think of imagery such as being arrogant or placing undue importance on material items the less chance of being effected by others interactions with you. Knowing yourself and loving others in such a way as to endeavor to understand the situation can do wonders at this. Booker T Washington had a very excellent quote " I shall allow no man to belittle my soul by making me hate him." When you are angered, you hate and that's something that can not be gotten around. You either hate what was done or the person doing what was done. Like I said its a value system.

Ya and while your at it , you might as well point out that water is wet ... hehe . But am curious what would constitute a society that did not build anything ? Is it a culture that does not exploit or at least very little ? Because the inverse is what I would constitute as not building anything . Which is where I think American society is at , always in Exploit mode. I've changed my mind on America splitting into 2 federal entities being a good thing. At least while I would have to live through the change ... since it would take 10-20ish years of turmoil before we would get a working government for the people out of it. (being the whole reason to do it) So meh ... let the non voting generation deal with it when they decide just looking at their iphones isn't working anymore. And technology is more what I was talking about ... since there are so many life skills that are getting phased out by it . Plus introducing so many new ways of exploit. (not in a good way) At a guess, I would say that the native americans were not exploitative, and most of them didn't really build anything permanent... (there are exceptions....) That would likely to apply to pretty much any nomadic people as well. And their lifestyle didn't change for thousands of years, and even then, it was because of an outside influence. (spanish introducing horses, europeans taking over the land.....) I'm not a great fan of technological advances as much as I am social progression. Just look at what we do with the tech we have now. We have the internet and look at how many who each day segregate ourselves into our own respective little forums to talk with people who agree with us about those we collectively hate. How much actual thought is needed to regurgitate old prejudices? Are we actually progressing or are we regressing, seeing how many times in the past few years that physical violence has erupted.? How many times have we heard the statement that someone had pissed someone else off when in reality those making these statements let themselves become pissed off. The fact is that no one can make any of us angrey. We let ourselves become angry because of our own assumptions.

Did you mean " trying too hard to be the opposition than we are at being ourselves. " Cuz it certainly didn't make sense with the " Not" I used to be like you ... with a bleeding heart ... but the blood ran out. Now I could give a fu#k about ASPCA commercials. Because if you notice ... the filming is staged quality ... therefore they are making the animals suffer for video value. And that stupid biatch that sounds like she is on 20 quaaludes can go fook herself . Cheeze and rice ... imagine how much of your donation is going to pay for her habit ? And don't get me started about saving the holucuck survivors :down: Anyways sorry to vent ... but I can't see anyway through the conundrum ... but for people to start suffering and die . Most particular ... the self entitled Americans , which are basically spoiled brat children living off of what their ancestors built for them. 2021 I predict being able to watch a lot of people suffering from their own stupidity. Which I will enjoy for a moment ... but then I will have to pull up my bootstraps and fix it for them :pirate: What I said was what I meant. Trying too hard not to be something is acting out so ridiculously against something that you seem to the casual observer to be far more unhinged than your rival. Certainly in today's political circus we have seen over the top ridiculous statements and activities on both sides that have turned off the center so much I would submit that many of them will be more likely to be voting for Donald Duck than anyone on any ticket. Sorry about whatever you meant by bleeding heart, but as we all are, we are not here on this world to be liked or disliked. We are here to state our opinions as we see it and deal with the aftermath as we have the mind to do. I think too many people are so addicted to this FACEBOOK trend to take likes as some sort justification for more and more ridiculousness. They end up playing for short lived adoration instead of long term sensibilities. With that being said, I do appreciate respectful corrective criticisms and a swift kick in the pants when I go too far on a tirade.

Sometimes I think that we, as a people are trying too hard not to be the opposition than we are at being ourselves. The left is trying so hard to not be what they consider a racist republican and the right is trying too hard to not be their stereotypical imagery of what the left is. I think it is playing out in the cultural wars, which includes the migration question. At times I think the only people who really like what America is today are those who come from other countries. The rest of us are just fighting over the spoils of a world created by past generations, that we are taking for granted. Owning something is not necessarily buying or paying for something. It is a responsibility of acknowledgement that something was done that disrupted the lives of a good many people. I think our arrogance has taken away several opportunities to mend fences and to extricate us from several countries crap lists. I may be wrong. It was a long time ago, but I seem to remember after the Iran Hostage criss that the people over there was demanding an apology for our intervention in their internal affairs. Who knows. If President Carter would have given it, we might have been on friendly relations with those people instead of trying to stop their nuclear program.

The West has meddled in the Middle East far longer than Bush. We were in Iran and put up the Shaw in the mid 50's which was what lead to our troubles over there. The European countries have had their hands in there far longer. After WWI they carved the Middle East up like a wedding cake and gave it to themselves. I do understand why things have gotten so bad, but I agree with General Powell. If we break it, we own it. We own what happened in Iraq all the way up until today and will have to shoulder that burden for a very long time. I do agree with you, we should leave the Middle East. We all need to leave the Middle East and break our addiction to fossil fuels, which in my opinion has done more harm than good in just about every scale imaginable. Our addition to cheap oil has done as much damage over there as our addiction to drugs coming across the Southern boarder has done to the civilians South of the boarder who are terrorized by the Cartels that use the drug money to buy power and influence. President Trump keeps talking about a border wall to keep things out, when it is our need to entertain ourselves. I know that there is a terrible problem with the Opioid addiction, but our infatuation with recreational drugs has been around a lot longer and has effected far more peoples lives in several South American countries. We need to stop with this idea of being the benevolent benefactor of the rest of the world and really look at these places with a respect for the people instead of this idea that we are helping by supplanting our culture for theirs.

How can a majority of any people so uneducated and so indoctrinated by culture, by ideology and by religion determine what bills are in their best interest if they continue to believe in most politicians that even by their own words read only a portion, if any of the legislation that passes under their noses? Speaking of rights The public has not only the right, but the obligation to educate themselves on what is going on, not only in their back yards but all over the globe. They need to know why things are, because of what happened in the past and fully acknowledge any responsibility their government has had in bringing others to the state they are in. I don't think half the world would be in the state it is in if certain parts of the world hadn't decided to interfere in the cultures of others. I look at not only Iran, but the whole of the middle East and Asia, when I say this. I know that some of my Conservative friends take a dim view of this attitude, but most of them have a way of ignoring the past for the present, just as many of my liberal friends have a tendency to dwell on the past and ignore the present. I guess there is a comfort zone within eachothers perspective interests that, in their minds justify spitting in the other persons eye. This country is no longer populated by Americans, as much as it is populated by people grouped together by a color, a sex or a religious or political persuasion. People talk about legal citizens, but from what I've seen, there are a lot more ilegal citizens who seem to feel a whole lot better about being in America than many of those who were born here. At least many of them don't take the country for granted. How do we get a majority opinion out of uneducated, indoctrinated, self absorbed spoiled rotten people who think they are the leaders of a free world, when so many of them have freely given up the freedoms they once had [Patriot act] for a sense of security, given to them by the same people who have botched up so much in the past. The US Government. Many are more interested in how many likes they've gotten on their last cat video than they are about their legislative well being. A good measure are more interested in what someone else has than what they have and end up not appreciating anything at all.

It's not the government, but our system of values and our control of our financial system that we have too deal with. We put too much value in our own opinions and don't scrutinize them or those whose duty it is to indoctrinate us in the quote/unquote correct way of thinking for those in the seats of power. Unless we are willing to really willing to take an open honest and thorough self evaluation of ourselves, we will never know how full of crap we might just be. If we can't be that honest with ourselves, then how can we even contemplate what a government that we can actually say with a straight face is for the people. What people are we actually envisioning when we construct this perfect sounding image within our head? What form of commerce and what monetary system would support this so-called perfect order? America started out as an ideal that was considered a liberal idea when it was formed. Today, it is embraced mostly by conservatives and those who consider themselves on the left seem to want to accentuate the negatives, just as the founding fathers of Americas birth did the British system. My question in all this is what we mean by the term, people. Both sides flout this word as if it should be sacred, but what do they mean by people. Do they mean, people like us or people who think like us.? It seems like there are too many people out there who think they own the term People and use it exclusively to reflect their mental image of the people in the world and it is that very images that the thought police have taken such a long time to cultivate with the approval of those we really should be looking at, instead of those they claim are so evil. If we really look at the term PEOPLE, aren't those in government people? Aren't those who voted for and against President Trump, people? If so, why are so many upset that he sets in the White House? Why are there so many who hate those who voted him in, with a hatred so vile that they would attack them physically? Why do so many affix the term haters on those people, when they hate them? Is the any hatred in the world that can be considered any more righteous than any other? Hatred is not interchangeable to indignation, which leads me to believe that much of what we see in anger in this country is not about TRUMP or CLINTON. Its about us as human beings and about our own fears that we are far less interested in dealing with than blaming those around us. If we can't do that, then what the heck are we contemplating a more perfect union?

I don't know how old many of you are, but I remember when people would just come to an agreement on something mutually beneficial, or at least we could agree to disagree and part without either destroying each other or messaging one another's ego. I remember when the term enlightened came out so that those who agreed with someones ideals could verbally pat those people on their heads for following along. Now we have the word WOKE! that pretty much means the same thing. I just don't get the idea of seemingly having to message someones ego for agreeing with another. It reminds me of a carnival game show host that has to inflat others ego to make them feel better about themselves instead of letting the data speak for itself. Those who don't agree with that data aren't going to be persuaded by rhetoric and standing around praising each other will just amuse those same sceptics.

I don't think I ewas ever defending the media. More like pointing my fingers to the true culprate in this little shell game. We can't forget the the media is made up of people who are the public. This is not a one way street and to fixate on only one side of the delusion only allows that part of this little charade to find some other way of justifying themselves and their behavior. People want to be the heroes of their own reality and project attitudes and ideal on those around them according to how they feel about them. Lets not forget who it is who wears the chips on their shoulders and who does not. It is those with something inside them to prove. All the media does is message the shoulder that carries the chip.

Its imagery,. AOC hits all the markers in the lefts version of the underdog. A woman and a woman of color. One who unseated a Democratic stalwart and is one who is not afraid to mix it up with anyone who gets in her way. It's Christmas for the far left, but what they haven't learned is that they can't use scavenger hunt tactics to pick those who represent them. Just being a woman or a man or being outspoken doesn't make you effective. Shes even attacked her fellow Democrats for not following the Democratic agenda and is so doing told those peoples constituents that they are less important that the party line. These constituents vote in these people because they like what they say, not because what a junior representative from another state thinks is right. If that rep doesn't listen to them then they won't listen to the Democratic party. The media raised her up to the status she thinks she has and they will follow her all the way down if she ever falls from the heights she thinks she has attained. It's all about the bottom line for these media types and the mnore contriversial, the more readers buy their rags. Im thinking that the group or gang or whatever they are called has the political life expectancy of the Trump Administration because they are sucking up all the air. The American public has the attention span of a Cocker Spaniel puppy. Their will be some new shinney little bobble that will get our attention and we will run after that till we find something else to peek our curiosity. It's like watch a keystone cops movie on a contenious loop.

I don't think the media knows who they are following. I think that the entire political landscape is changing right under their feet and they are trying to stay relevant by pandering to those they feel is projecting the most controversial imagery. I think, with the the end of the Obama presidency was a watershed moment for both parties as neither side was fully satisfied with either sides performance. The left turned to Hillary Clinton, but those who really wanted real change went with Senator Sanders. From what I've heard many on the far left blame Hillary for loosing to Trump and those are the ones who now support people like AOC It's not without design that she is backing Senator Sanders. I think he is the most sincere of the hopefuls and would really like him to get the Democratic nod. Id like to see him debating whoever stands for the right. I have already said that I think Trump was a protest vote against those the republican voters thought was most ineffectual in combating the changes President Obama tried to bring in. All im all I think we are looking at the slipting of the Democratic and the Republican parties into two additional parties which I think would be a good thing.

I don't know why people seem to think the these news outlets are the reason for the divisions in AmericaThe divisions have been there for a very long time and it is cultural. Just look at the mannerisms of each of the idealistic campgrounds. They are very far apart as to how they look at the world. https://www.diffen.com/difference/Conservative_vs_Liberal This idea that they need to be lead to anything by the media is, to me ignoring the fact that each camp has been so far apart to begin with and through the years their own leaders have moved them even more apart due to demonization and messaging egos. The media simply, at times offers manipulated instances that supports many of the narratives each camp has already determined is the truth to begin with. Conservatives are stupid to liberals and liberals are immoral to conservatives. They set around inside their own respective camps and regurgitate the same old self aggrandizing thoughts about their own nature and snear at those who oppose them. It's not the medias fault that they have found a core group to peddle their own flavor of information and more than a drug pusher who suplies the drugs that junkies use to get off. People poison themselves every day. If not with drugs, then with the food they eat or the alcohol they ingest. They do so because they are used to it and it is convenient for them to do so. It is like President Trump blaming the Mexican Cartels for the drugs pouring across the Mexican border, when if their wasn't any demand over here, their wouldn't be any issue to begin with. The real issue is what our money is doing to those innocent people across the boarder, who have to live with the violence that our money facilitates. All we have to do is look at the example of that family of Mormons who were slaughtered just last week. Was that warfare due to how lucrative the drug trade is down there or how lucrative the drug trade is over here. Its our money that is flowing across that boarder that is feeding that, but just like normal.so many people are looking at what effects us. Right now we have a big debate on migration, but that gravitates towards only what effects America and not what effects the countries that these people are fleeing from. People are people and human beings are human beings. We act so magnanimous when we open our borders to those wanting assylum, but what about those people who can't make the journey? they still have to live through the same hell that have driven so many Northward. If people actually gave a crap they would have a system that would police up and provide the technology and the support that would allow each of these counties to thrive independently on an equal basis with the rest of the world. There is nothing that will prevent all crime, but, at least there would be an option for prosperity within that community that would promote the best that that country has to offer the world. There wouldn't be a 3rd world or even a 2nd. There would be the world and the countries that abound within it. In my opinion, the toothless United Nations is nothing more than a good old boys network that allows the richer nations to fondel the poorer ones with a growing sense of dispassionate benevolence that rivals Marie Antoinette mouthing the words, "Let them eat Cake"

You might as well ask who benefits by the drug trade. Does the person providing the drug profit more than the junkie who having an addictive personality and finds the drug offered to be to his liking? Both reap a reward off the exchange and both are satisfied enough to continue the exchange. Both are slaves to each other in that without the other, they could not exist in their present form. Lets not forget the greatest human trait is self delusion and information that feeds into a particular self delusion provides the same feel good experience as any illicit drug. Fox news and Cnn remain alive because there is a market for their wears and if they both disappear today, there would appear similar providers tomorrow They are simply Its not freedom of speech, it's regurgitating old tired ideas that are repackaged in shiny new boxes and sent out as new material. Its the perception of the observer that creates the reality each of these people. That's why those listening can take totally different takes on the same information. They want to see things the way they do and look for evidence to support that vision.

The political extremes couldn't get much of a foothold on society if it weren't for the myriad of people in that society who already convinced themselves of their own benevolence. The extremes on either side will eat their own in attempts to prove themselves as a purer example of their ideology. It's not really the second amendment. It's the hype of being the so-called lone protector of our liberties against the quote/unquote evils of government. A lot of conservatives talk about the left being the party of victims. Well victimhood was imagined by the far right long before the advent of the counter culture in the guise of protecting oneself from the so-called regressive government. The entire American political system was created by people who didn't trust government. Should anyone be at all surprized that the same sentiment is alive and well in many of these gun people. That and the idea that our culture romanticizes so much of the lone gunman ideal. I can number the amount of action movies who promote people working together, but the lone hero or heroine movies are innumerable. People can talk about guns being so destructive, but I see more issues with religious bigotry and the grip of the all mighty dollar as much more debilitating to the welfare of society.

The problem with the Democrats is they are reacting to everything around them, President Trump, The far Left, the media ect instead of acting for the country, itself. President Trump has irritated them so badly they are coming after him, hand and foot and aren't showing anyone what they can do for America. They've slavishly pandered to the far left and you can see that by the policies the Presidential hopefuls, where they are falling over each other promising free everything. Both parties are ham stringed by their own legacy of impotence. Trump was a protest vote against the establishment Republicans and now the far left has come up to demand the the Dems follow through on their legion of promises. I think that most people are fairly tired of American politics and will simply go for the crazy they know as opposed to the crazy that panders to those who they deem irresponsible and that pretty much is what the presidential candidates on the left is showing them. You can't pander to people who want Socialism in a country that has demonized socialism for such a long time. I hardly think the average citizen knows the difference between socialism and communism. Knee jerk reactions is what put President Trump in office. Now, the knee jerk responces of the Democrats will probably guarantee him a second term. I've heard about Erectile dysfunction but America is suffering from Electile Dysfunction. We vote more against something than we do for something and we end up running away from the problems instead of running to confront them head on.

I wish, if someone would take the time to comment on another post, they would direct it towards the person who posted it.

The biggest problem is, we have several different sides, and they each have their own idea of how to 'fix' them. Most of which, are diametrically opposed..... I think it would be more accurate to say they want to fix others. They have their own version of paradise they just want others to acknowledge their version and get in goosestep right behind their banner.

The problem is that people don't see a problem, nor has it ever occurred to them that they might be a part of the problem. They refuse to even consider a change in attitude because they been tought that the ends justifies the means which is an open door to every form of depravity known to man. All things are justified and no one is responsible for their own actions. In August two years ago a woman lost her life after being ran over in Charlottesville, va because of this mindset. She was less than nothing to the driver just because, i think she was wanting a statute removed from a public place of a state that he didn't even reside in. One can't change the world, but we can personally interact with others and not return aggression for aggression, which might just disarm them from the knee jerk reactions of those who anticipate a fight because they've experienced far to many time the knee jerk reactions of real jerks who just enjoy being jerks. I will broach this subject only once and only to substantiate where my understanding of the arrogance and the indoctrination of those who count themselves among those who it is inconceivable that they should ever be wrong. I was born and raise in a religious cult and I have experienced those who prejidiced against others, just because of the section of the country that they reside. Some are so proud of their ignorance that they wouldn't change their minds even in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary and I'm not just talking about those in the south or those who believe. It's the way they see themselves abouve all else. They just through every excuse that can find against the wall, hoping something will stick, in order to justify them to others.

Was it Trump that got them energized or was it the times they were living through, that brought them to action. Politicians are always promising this and always will. I still think Trump was a protest vote. Maybe those who were apolitical saw President Trump as not being apart of any political establishment and liked how he condemned those within the system. That was the primary reason I was willing to vote for him. He was most certainly NOT a politician, he wasn't taking donations from anyone, therefore, wasn't beholden to them, he was not a 'washington inside', which for me, was the biggest plus...... And yes, electing trump WAS a protest vote, against political cronyism, and the 'status quo' that exists in washington DC. But, as is usually the case, putting just one guy in there to fight against the system, the system still wins. The people can impeach their own state federal and city officials any time they choose to. The fact is most of the local people went to the same school, the same church, and started out in Kindergarten together. So they can't just replace the bum without one of them taking the seat. It's because of their long time together in their parent's businesses and establishments that they can't break up the system. They would have to let an outsider push their buttons. The only way to beat the so called system is to get on board pushing those neighbors buttons until they see the correct way to change so they all change together. Start with the next kindergarteners, before they reach 1st grade and plant the new system in their classroom and you'll have a new system in time for your funerals, but at least it will be established and working for the new generation. Get busy pushing the buttons so the house and senate tabled bills you want to get passed, are, and get busy rallying all your family and friends to make your state senator or representative do as you say, so they do not continue to do as you think they do and get them to doing what you want them to. There will be pain, but the hurt will come, time will heal all, when all things considered is done. The new rules the system has chosen to abide by will be easy for those kindergartners to handle who were prepared for them. Get the people to stop rallying around the house, and start putting votes in to impeach their senator's and representative's for not doing what the people want. It doesn't take as many people to remove one person from the house or senate. Most people seem to think they must gather outside in a peaceful rally. Do not rush the grounds, Do not try to fight security guards, and Do NOT rush into the house or senate when all it will take is to vote impeach them one and all to get them out of office. Oh! One last note. UNLESS YOU SEE THAT THE SYSTEM REALLY NEEDS CHANGES AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT NOW, NO CHANGES WILL OCCUR BECAUSE YOU DON'T BELIEVE THEY ARE REALLY NEEDED, YOU WON'T DO ANYTHING BUT SIT BACK WITH YOUR FAMILY, BUSINESS FRIENDS, RELAX, ALONG SIDE AND WITH THOSE OF THE ESTABLISHMENT AND DO NOTHING. The old cliche' still stands, The MOTHER of Change (invention not necessary because you already know we have all the inventions we need) is Necessity. I don't hold very much hope that America will come together politically towards anything other than an, in your face human tragedy. Look at what happened during 9/11. We had togetherness for what 4-5 months, if that long. Then the fingers began to be pointed and the tongues began to wag. We, as a people have the attention span of a Cocker Spaniel puppy. If we aren't hunting for likes on our Facebook account, we are snickering and pointing our fingers at those around us to hopefully distract those who accompany us from pointing and snickering at us. We live in a self important world were instant gratification is the order of the day. We are no more American than a fly climbing a tree in Jamaica, We are Democrats, we are republican or any one of various groups who think the world owes us our own little pathetic patch of ground that is devoid of bother. The politicians have offered that same simple fantasy to each and every one of us and arrogantly labeled it THE AMERICAN DREAM, The entire idea is repugnant to me, not because it isn't a noble cause, but because anything uniquely AMERICAN has to be saturated by money and buried in the same type of hype that gave us the assumption we could lead the free world and police up the rest. We are not going to come together on anything, because that demands we put forth a personal effort. Most of us are allergic to that. The break out in sweet and that takes away from our personal time. The only thing that's going to change the political system in this country is that we become that system and that means removing the importance of all the niceties we've accumulated, grabbing our political leaders by their proverbial necks and shaking the ever loving complacency out of them. If they don't have the fear of us in them, they will find something else to fill up that space and with lobbyists crawling all over the halls of congress, I will give one one guess what they will pick to fill it up with. You want to see America. Go down to the nearest restaurant and see an entire family, setting around a table with their faces planted in their smart phones. They aren't even talking with each other! I've heard people talk about corruption. When people see more value in spending time on line than they do, face to face with a human being then you see corruption. what people call corruption in government is just what happens when we try to hold those we send to Washington to a standard that we only wish we could hold. We send them there and we assume everything else will be fine. When they fall, we condemn them for not being the persons we wish we were. Angry?! You are angry enough to continue to kick a horse you feel is just faking it's death? You appear to write very well even though it seems to me your eyes are bloodshot, bulging out of your head, steam may be whistling out of your ears, and your mouth might be seething, while you use your hands to write. Somehow your hands still work; enabling you to post, post the words that you are absolutely not sure, but you will continue kicking the corpse until it either gets up, or you will continue to kick it enough times that after you do you will know for certain that it 'will' be dead. Stop! Go take a cold bath or shower! Before you overheat this thread. I clearly understand my era, my youth, and my life has begun to fade. My only regret I pondered; I wonder if anything I did was good for the people. I think I did, but I may be unfair judging myself. If not something for all the people, I hope, at least, I got some good from it to share. I am not sure I have what others might call "done good", either way, actually. So tonight when I rest with death knocking on some nearby door, reminding me of my own age, I will let my mind open and see if I have ever given enough to a cause so the people get some good out of having had me around. You know, this is the second time you've personalized what I said and now you've deduced intent behind what I've posted. This usually ends up both parties getting in a food fight with accusations being thrown back and forth, but since I have been doing this for a while stuff like this just runs off my back and I continue forward with the debate. If you have any arguments or if you need any clarifications on what I post then I would suggest you place in your next post because if you continue concentrating on me instead of the points I am making then I will conclude that you have nothing to confront my posts. I've seen through my 60+ years of existence the deterioration of human compassion and understanding between those on opposite sides of the political divide. I've seen the devaluation of human decency as people hide behind avatars in debate sites like these in order to assail others in which the disagree.and with all this we are now talking about fixing what some would call a corupt system. We need to work on ourselves and how we see others before we have the clarity to cleanse a system we have allowed to fester into something even we can not stand, No truer words have never been spoken than those who coined the phrase. "We get the Government we deserve" I'm not angry, I'm disappointed and that extends all the way to the previous post of yours when you seemingly didn't even give me the benefit of a doubt. You asked me nothing there on anything. Was this an over-site or was it intentional?

Was it Trump that got them energized or was it the times they were living through, that brought them to action. Politicians are always promising this and always will. I still think Trump was a protest vote. Maybe those who were apolitical saw President Trump as not being apart of any political establishment and liked how he condemned those within the system. That was the primary reason I was willing to vote for him. He was most certainly NOT a politician, he wasn't taking donations from anyone, therefore, wasn't beholden to them, he was not a 'washington inside', which for me, was the biggest plus...... And yes, electing trump WAS a protest vote, against political cronyism, and the 'status quo' that exists in washington DC. But, as is usually the case, putting just one guy in there to fight against the system, the system still wins. The people can impeach their own state federal and city officials any time they choose to. The fact is most of the local people went to the same school, the same church, and started out in Kindergarten together. So they can't just replace the bum without one of them taking the seat. It's because of their long time together in their parent's businesses and establishments that they can't break up the system. They would have to let an outsider push their buttons. The only way to beat the so called system is to get on board pushing those neighbors buttons until they see the correct way to change so they all change together. Start with the next kindergarteners, before they reach 1st grade and plant the new system in their classroom and you'll have a new system in time for your funerals, but at least it will be established and working for the new generation. Get busy pushing the buttons so the house and senate tabled bills you want to get passed, are, and get busy rallying all your family and friends to make your state senator or representative do as you say, so they do not continue to do as you think they do and get them to doing what you want them to. There will be pain, but the hurt will come, time will heal all, when all things considered is done. The new rules the system has chosen to abide by will be easy for those kindergartners to handle who were prepared for them. Get the people to stop rallying around the house, and start putting votes in to impeach their senator's and representative's for not doing what the people want. It doesn't take as many people to remove one person from the house or senate. Most people seem to think they must gather outside in a peaceful rally. Do not rush the grounds, Do not try to fight security guards, and Do NOT rush into the house or senate when all it will take is to vote impeach them one and all to get them out of office. Oh! One last note. UNLESS YOU SEE THAT THE SYSTEM REALLY NEEDS CHANGES AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT NOW, NO CHANGES WILL OCCUR BECAUSE YOU DON'T BELIEVE THEY ARE REALLY NEEDED, YOU WON'T DO ANYTHING BUT SIT BACK WITH YOUR FAMILY, BUSINESS FRIENDS, RELAX, ALONG SIDE AND WITH THOSE OF THE ESTABLISHMENT AND DO NOTHING. The old cliche' still stands, The MOTHER of Change (invention not necessary because you already know we have all the inventions we need) is Necessity. I don't hold very much hope that America will come together politically towards anything other than an, in your face human tragedy. Look at what happened during 9/11. We had togetherness for what 4-5 months, if that long. Then the fingers began to be pointed and the tongues began to wag. We, as a people have the attention span of a Cocker Spaniel puppy. If we aren't hunting for likes on our Facebook account, we are snickering and pointing our fingers at those around us to hopefully distract those who accompany us from pointing and snickering at us. We live in a self important world were instant gratification is the order of the day. We are no more American than a fly climbing a tree in Jamaica, We are Democrats, we are republican or any one of various groups who think the world owes us our own little pathetic patch of ground that is devoid of bother. The politicians have offered that same simple fantasy to each and every one of us and arrogantly labeled it THE AMERICAN DREAM, The entire idea is repugnant to me, not because it isn't a noble cause, but because anything uniquely AMERICAN has to be saturated by money and buried in the same type of hype that gave us the assumption we could lead the free world and police up the rest. We are not going to come together on anything, because that demands we put forth a personal effort. Most of us are allergic to that. The break out in sweet and that takes away from our personal time. The only thing that's going to change the political system in this country is that we become that system and that means removing the importance of all the niceties we've accumulated, grabbing our political leaders by their proverbial necks and shaking the ever loving complacency out of them. If they don't have the fear of us in them, they will find something else to fill up that space and with lobbyists crawling all over the halls of congress, I will give one one guess what they will pick to fill it up with. You want to see America. Go down to the nearest restaurant and see an entire family, setting around a table with their faces planted in their smart phones. They aren't even talking with each other! I've heard people talk about corruption. When people see more value in spending time on line than they do, face to face with a human being then you see corruption. what people call corruption in government is just what happens when we try to hold those we send to Washington to a standard that we only wish we could hold. We send them there and we assume everything else will be fine. When they fall, we condemn them for not being the persons we wish we were.

Was it Trump that got them energized or was it the times they were living through, that brought them to action. Politicians are always promising this and always will. I still think Trump was a protest vote. Maybe those who were apolitical saw President Trump as not being apart of any political establishment and liked how he condemned those within the system.

You are asking me like I was one of those who voted for or against something. Those on the right expected the republicans to stand in the way of what President Obama was trying to do. As for my understanding of President Obama, he didn't go far enough with much of what he was trying to do. It is to them that we owe the present situation, because a lot of what President Trump was saying, particularly against the establishment Republicans was what they wanted to say to them. I've said this before and I'll say it again. President Trump was a protest vote against what the right called wishy washy republicans in office.Just look at who he targeted outside of those he was running against. The first person that cokmes to mind was Senator Mc Cane. For a long time much of the right called him a RINO, because of his stances on things. He was just as much red meat as the Republican darling brother of George Bush. That is a fantasy. Democrats and Independents who didn't vote, voted for a third candidate or voted for Trump are what got him into office. Wisconsin? Michigan? Pennsylvania flipped the script. Republicans hiding in the shadows didn't hand Trump the presidency, Obama voters had to pull the lever for this man to do that. And they did en mass. This is what Democrats by and large do not understand or wish to address. Populism has united many Americans. Sure there is a noisy group of boot lickers who are easily swayed by Neo-Cons to demand business as usual..But truly, most sane people see the corruption and desperately wanted a wrecking ball. And that's what Trump is. He has destroyed 2 political dynasties, the careers of many Neo-Cons (John Bolton being the latest), the legacy of 3 by and large worthless Presidents and has help bring Globalism to a screeching halt....and this is only his first term! I think you are pulling out of my posts something that I did not put into them. I said nothing about Democratic voters. I focused on Republican voters and their attitudes for putting President Trump into office. I don't think that President Trump has destroyed anything other than civility. I think the two parties have pretty much destroyed themselves because of the demagoguery and lack of sincerity. They are emptily shells of what they should be. Scared into inaction by the fear of making those hard decisions they were placed in office to make. They know if they upset enough people they might just loose that coshy little seat in government and have to get a real job they actually have to produce something other than hot air.

I've read so many books that did not get added to the English version of King James Bible I know who the corrupter is. Peoples hate is just a tool he uses to turn the flame toward another so the corrupter himself doesn't get burned. In the story it even backfired on Christ. So; words here are emotionless, but they can find us when we are emotional and turn our failed romance into hatred, and pride that overrates our senses causing us to cease being the way we were when people enjoyed our company. That thoughts have power and spills onto the pages of the Internet, breathing reasons for the angry people to do deeds which lead to harming others, is true. So be careful how you use your words. I will steer away from anything to do with religion, religious books and those who deal in them. I do know that there are authors every day who discard whole chapters of information that one doesn't think is necessary for the completion of a narrative. What I do know is that according for something to be corrupted, it needs to have a specific purpose or standard of being that is somehow altered. That is my understanding of the definition of corruption. I also know that sometimes a relationships exist only in ones head and those that fail, fail because of the expectations one party has that the other party does not.