DrakeTheDragon Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 Modding has ever been considered a hobby and a passion; not a product to which reviews and ratings are applicable. It is done simply for the enjoyment of the process itself, with no monetary nor practical gain, and shared simply to allow others to enjoy the product of the same. Thus, modders are simply hobbyists, who might listen to feedback on how to improve their work, and never a content creator/ independent developer who must suffer a barrage of complaints and demands. The pivotal aspect that separates the two is in the characterization and attitudes toward the author. When a user responds in the context of a commenter, they treat the author as an equal, and talk without innate judgement or bias. However, when the same person sees a "review form" in front of them, with a rating scale to "judge" the quality of the author's work with every breath, then their role suddenly shifts into an arbiter, and they begin to feel entitled, and thus, begins to dehumanize the author. While I could care less for the nebulous aspects of "reputations", nor "subjective opinion", I care strongly for the global shift that draws ever near, and threatens to wrest both choice and control from the modding community. The free spirit of the modding community has ever thrived on but one core principal: The absolute freedom to pick and choose any mod that catches your fancy for your mod list, and only be constrained by plugin limit/ game stability. While guides and online mod lists do exist, and users do follow them to some extent, the vast majority of people who use mods listen to none other than their own minds and hearts on such matters. Having a mechanized system mired in popularity derived from the unthinking horde is not only madness to those who may follow its whims, it is a downright logical contradiction. Those who use no guides need them not, and thus, will likely never touch Mod Picker. Yet, they still expect the same to write the reviews, and serve as our "guiding light". If you choose to follow the blind, then expect to be led astray, straight into the abyss of endless CTDs! What do the people responsible for the coming demise of our modding community/ Mod Picker have to say about our valid needs and concerns? Nothing! They have turned a deaf ear to our every thought, ignored each piece of feedback, and stubbornly plowed on through author's rights with not even a passing glance. matortheeternal, Thallassa and TerrorFox1234 have not even attempted to compromise, and instead, have stated multiple times that they will go ahead with their plans to mirror a parody of each and every mod page on the Nexus, with the appropriate stats derived from the same, regardless of the wishes and desires of the respective mod authors who put so much blood, sweat and tears into their creations. Why? Simply because it is "within their legal right to do so", and to make a quick buck! After all, they intend to accept donations for doing absolutely nothing, when I, and countless other mod authors refuse to accept the same! Thus, I shall hide all of my mods the moment Mod Picker goes live, including Aurlyn Dawnstone, and they shall remain that way until either they are either blacklisted by the Nexus, or they are taken down through copyright infringement/ lack of donations. I encourage others to make the logical choice, and do the same. I shall also be actively working against Mod Picker, and speaking out against them, and I encourage every voice to join with my own, and mingle into an unstoppable force that can tear down the glacial peaks! Mod Picker is an abomination; a fearsome juggernaut that tramples on the rights of mod authors, and tears the freedom of mod users asunder. Arise as a community, and end this threat once and for all! http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/3927290-wip-mod-picker/ http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php?/topic/4023345-mod-picker-mod-author-discussion/ You are stoned. Folks love this thing already. You are on a witch hunt, which is not productive nor conducive to any *real* conversation. Proof: https://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/4e7jg7/skyrim_mod_picker_progress_report_4/ https://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/43yjm1/skyrim_mod_picker_progress_report_2 https://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/4a6wto/skyrim_mod_picker_progress_report_3 https://www.reddit.com/r/skyrimmods/comments/40lp2b/skyrim_mod_picker_progress_report_1 Reddit is in no way representative, it is a cess pool. While the latter is only my personal opinion and completely irrelevant, the former is a fact. Folks, by now, does not yet include the majority of mod "authors", which in itself is asking for trouble already, as without their Mods there'll be nothing to Pick. It was a huge mistake of the Mod Picker team to start discussion and interest gauging only on the places they did, while leaving the majority of mod "authors" completely in the dark until recently, which by now has massively back-fired as well, as can be seen in a 30+ pages heated discussion, if you're an author. But they realized this mistake, admitted it and apologized, and are now in communication with members of both sides of the argument working out solutions to most of the authors' very valid concerns. And from what I can see the flames are slowly ebbing down at least. Posts like this, and the one this is in response to, are not the least helping but only further fanning the flames, and diminish all the efforts both sides have put into finding solutions to satisfy both sides so far.It is in your own interest to keep it to yourself, until they've come to a solution perhaps even "you" might be fine with in the end. The alarmingly increasing number of authors taking down their mods "now", in reaction to the not-so-successful introduction of Mod Picker to the authors and the less-than-pleasant initial responses of certain team members to the authors' valid concerns, effectively just shrugging them off as "irrelevant" or "crazy", which was not exactly helping nor the right way to start it off either, while Mod Picker isn't even out yet nor was it sneakily released behind their backs, I personally find more than concerning, and also really telling there's something amiss. Acting as if they won't exist is "not" helping. You both are not. Let the folks behind the scenes come to an agreement first, before jumping to conclusions and at each other's throats. Then again... what do I care? It's not like I'm having a horse in this race, being a mod author myself almost exclusively right now and no longer a mod user at all, it's of really no purpose to me, nor is the Skyrim section anything I should be invested in, me not modding or even possessing the game myself, so... have at it your way. I'm done trying to prevent forest fires in this community. Tear yourselves to pieces for all I care. But do "not" mis-present the situation at hand, which is more than dire as we speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUNKdeLUXE Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 (edited) As a user I can't really see what all the fuss is about. To me it sounds like Mod Picker is trying to fulfill the role as a "Dynamic S.T.E.P" guide and should they succeed in their endeavor I will love them for it. Secondly I find it highly bizarre to read some of the allegations against the developers of this platform.. some almost outright accusing them (the Mod Picker squad) for trying to hide the development of this platform. As a user, if you have just a slight interest in following the modding community you would have read about this AGES ago... That Mod Authors are somehow special snowflakes that only read Nexus's special forums only for the invited (shoo, begone filthy users), tell me more about the authors than it does the people behind Mod Picker. Edited April 23, 2016 by JUNKdeLUXE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElioraArin Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 When you first discover mods & want to start using them it is daunting - but all you need is some good guidelines about what to do & what not to do. Personally I did find a list of recommend mods a good starting point to develop an awareness of the kind of things available, begin discovering & building my own preferences from, & then begin searching for mods that suited ME as I gained knowledge & confidence.In an ideal world "Mod Picker" would help people to empower themselves with useful knowledge that would assist them in finding their personally perfect mod set up. But as other threads highlight - people have an extremely wide variance in what they do & don't like & value, & a great many more people simply read the information than those that do voice their opinion. From what I have seen in the forums & mod page posts it seems to me that there are a lot of people who genuinely want to be helpful & constructive with their opinions (ideal world), while there is also a very loudly opinionated number who seem to enjoy the power of having an obnoxious voice hidden from behind a computer screen (real world). At least here on Nexus it is monitored.Besides this how many users already don't take the time to report problems with a mod that the author isn't even aware of, & how much more difficult will it become for authors when people who are actually inclined to speak up can do so on another site instead of on the Nexus mod page itself?I am worried that some really talented authors will lose interest in modding altogether & take down their existing work because they have lost even more control over their own projects - & that is already an issue when so many people don't respect permissions etc & upload other peoples mods on unauthorised sites :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinnytecboy Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 "That Mod Authors are somehow special snowflakes that only read Nexus's special forums only for the invited (shoo, begone filthy users), tell me more about the authors than it does the people behind Mod Picker". Oh what a silly little person. There are details being discussed that you aren't aware of. The vague idea that users will be able to upload assets from mods to the mp site for example. There is more than this, believe me. Plus, authors are invited to those "special" forums by the nexus. I can assure you that it's not a special club... far from it tbh Oh btw.... how many "special snowflakes" assets do you have in your load order right now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshinenbrick Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 If one is not interested in modding as well as using mods then I can see why the problems of such a 'tool' are not fully understood or appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUNKdeLUXE Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 (edited) Oh what a silly little person. There are details being discussed that you aren't aware of. The vague idea that users will be able to upload assets from mods to the mp site for example. There is more than this, believe me. Plus, authors are invited to those "special" forums by the nexus. I can assure you that it's not a special club... far from it tbh Point taken.. What I was (failingly) trying to convey was that it's been no secret AT ALL that Mod Picker was on it's way, and that it somehow seems to be some huge surprise to the vocal group of modders that "HEY!!! Why weren't we informed about this.. You (the Mod Picker squad) should have posted in our own little mod author forum". Edited April 23, 2016 by JUNKdeLUXE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidJCobb Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 That Mod Authors are somehow special snowflakes that only read Nexus's special forums only for the invited (shoo, begone filthy users), tell me more about the authors than it does the people behind Mod Picker.From what I've seen, this is the culture of the Nexus in general. "The mod author is always right and good, no matter the circumstances; and given a conflict between multiple authors, the status quo is god." Something about this site creates and powers that atmosphere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElioraArin Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 I have found that Nexus provides a great site for both users & modders alike.The average user is not so dumb that they need a site such as "Mod Picker" - they simply need a little info to get them started modding a stable game to their own preferences. However the average user also does not appreciate the time, knowledge & effort that goes into the making of mods - so a site such as "Mod Picker" with such uninformed reviewing could end up being damaging.Nexus however provides a great place that is as supportive & secure as possible for both new & experienced mod authors to do what they do - "Mod Picker" could potentially undermine this for the authors, & if they are unhappy & stop sharing their work then everyone loses out.If it aint broke ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunshinenbrick Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 I have found that Nexus provides a great site for both users & modders alike.The average user is not so dumb that they need a site such as "Mod Picker" - they simply need a little info to get them started modding a stable game to their own preferences. However the average user also does not appreciate the time, knowledge & effort that goes into the making of mods - so a site such as "Mod Picker" with such uninformed reviewing could end up being damaging.Nexus however provides a great place that is as supportive & secure as possible for both new & experienced mod authors to do what they do - "Mod Picker" could potentially undermine this for the authors, & if they are unhappy & stop sharing their work then everyone loses out.If it aint broke ... I could not agree with you more. Well said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JUNKdeLUXE Posted April 23, 2016 Share Posted April 23, 2016 Truth be told I don't know much about the Nexus forums and it's users as I usually get my modding advice and troubleshooting from the S.T.E.P forums. But modding is not "easy" when you get over a certain threshold of mods. Just dealing the conflict resolution alone in a 200+ mods behemoth is enough to turn a lot of users/modders away from modding all together, and I'm sad to say that I've encountered my fair share of mod authors who are not willing to help or just say "load my mod last and it will work"... well.. I can't load all my mods last.. that kinda defeats it's purpose. But I understand why the authors don't want to deal with that hassle (although some could learn how to interact with other people). They are making mods because they like to do so.. not because they like to troubleshoot how it works with 934873984753 other mods. This is where I think (and hope) Mod Picker will be a huge boon to the modding community. Will Mod Picker fulfill all my wettest dreams? Well, maybe not ALL of them, but if the platform can live up to their promises then i for one can't wait.... And I just can't see the reason to fight something you have no idea how will impact the future of modding... Is it utopia to believe that Mod Picker will help Authors focus on what they love to do and let Mod Picker help with the troubleshooting and conflict resolutions?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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