CyrusAmell Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 (edited) Survival mode would not be quite as much of a pain for me if it were not for the odd crash in VATS or out of nowhere as I am making my way across the map. I had to try no less than three times to make it from Somerville Place to the Castle due to such. Word of advice, take a lot of 1 hour naps and avoid the Boston Commons and City areas like the plague. And don't forget to make sure you have Vertibird Grenades, if you have access, before going back to Sanctuary Hills because it is a long walk back to freaking anywhere from the starting zone. But yes, while I can appreciate the added gamble of losing an hour of playtime by dying as opposed to a minute with the old save system it does make the game slightly more stressful due to technical difficulties. Below: Small Spoiler on Institute So, who else is going to stick with the Institute after this? I know my second character will because I gotta get me some teleportation. Edited April 30, 2016 by CyrusAmell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zanity Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 Beth isn't the 'sharpest knife in the drawer' so 'survival mode' has been linked to 'achievements' (PUKE) rather than RPG- hence the stupid restriction on saving the game. But now Beth is all about the dumbed-down console biz, whose worst fans worship at the altar of online achievement tables, expect things to only get worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoliteRaider Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 I know someone will eventually fix this but what really disappoints me is why this happened in the first place. The mistake I continuously see from a lot of people talking about this feature, whether yourself or Gopher, is describing the system as unimmersive because they imagine themselves as some sort of narcoleptic running around sleeping every five minutes in order to save the game. The immersive method is that you don't run around sleeping every five minutes, you save once per in-game day. It's like a slightly less harsh iron-person playthrough, where you only lose a day instead of the entire character. If you don't like this, it's completely fine. There's nothing wrong with not enjoying repeating hours of gameplay because your character didn't spot a landmine in time. As mentioned earlier in this thread there are all sorts of mods and options to get around this. However a lot of the most vigorous complaints I see about this are I think based on a misunderstanding of how to use this feature in an immersive fashion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeamBacon Posted April 30, 2016 Share Posted April 30, 2016 If you don't like this, it's completely fine. There's nothing wrong with not enjoying repeating hours of gameplay because your character didn't spot a landmine in time. As mentioned earlier in this thread there are all sorts of mods and options to get around this. However a lot of the most vigorous complaints I see about this are I think based on a misunderstanding of how to use this feature in an immersive fashion. Doesn't mean that it isn't very, very, very poor game design though. As a fan of Fallout I just don't play survival mode. But as a fan of good game design in general I just shake my head at this... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaffTheSweetling Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 I would add that being forced to sleep to save introduces negative consequences you'd otherwise not have experienced. I.e. If you sleep too often you get parasites, lethargy etc. Survival mode is a lot of fun, but technically being denied a means to save is not a feasible element of surviving, but rather a gimmick, and a cheap stunt by the devs to make it harder to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minngarm Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 You have every choice, play it on another difficulty setting. This right here is the biggest bulls*** excuse I see people in favor of sleep-to-save use. "Play on another difficulty setting, or then perhaps this mode isn't for you." Like they are some kind of internet gatekeeper about how people should play their -own- game. So, I love the fact that sleep/food/water needs, added difficulty with diseases and other environment hazards exist. Lowered carry weight and heightened damages, all of those things make sense for the -CHARACTER- to be concerned about, if trying to survive in a post apocalypse world. Saving your game state is a product that Fallout 4 is a GAME, the character is completely unaware that a "save" has taken place, to them their death and reload is not recognized by the character. You as a "godlike player" have basically altered time for the character, and thus the character never "knows" they died back there. There have been plenty of arguments that make the reasoning that sleep-to-save just makes the character of Nate/Nora into a narcoleptic more interested in the next bed, then exploring and surviving. Just like the internet "gatekeepers" that demand something others like that they don't be changed because they don't like it. Hypocrite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minngarm Posted May 1, 2016 Share Posted May 1, 2016 If you don't like this, it's completely fine. There's nothing wrong with not enjoying repeating hours of gameplay because your character didn't spot a landmine in time. As mentioned earlier in this thread there are all sorts of mods and options to get around this. However a lot of the most vigorous complaints I see about this are I think based on a misunderstanding of how to use this feature in an immersive fashion. Doesn't mean that it isn't very, very, very poor game design though. As a fan of Fallout I just don't play survival mode. But as a fan of good game design in general I just shake my head at this... Would call it clever game design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TeamBacon Posted May 2, 2016 Share Posted May 2, 2016 If you don't like this, it's completely fine. There's nothing wrong with not enjoying repeating hours of gameplay because your character didn't spot a landmine in time. As mentioned earlier in this thread there are all sorts of mods and options to get around this. However a lot of the most vigorous complaints I see about this are I think based on a misunderstanding of how to use this feature in an immersive fashion. Doesn't mean that it isn't very, very, very poor game design though. As a fan of Fallout I just don't play survival mode. But as a fan of good game design in general I just shake my head at this... Would call it clever game design. I can call bullet sponges clever boss design, but that doesn't make it true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dainsgames Posted May 6, 2016 Share Posted May 6, 2016 Thank you. i am watching both of these. There was also a holotape one but it sound tricky to find in-game and is a one-of use. Plus again for me personally i feel like the bed, it would become an object in-game that effects my immersion. Just a MOD that re-enables the save options in the main menu will be perfect, even better to re-enable the F5 quick save. I understand many will be quite happy having to find beds or holotapes or any object to use, drink, maybe even a flare they launch into the sky to save on survival mode and i am happy for them but its not for me. I dont think i am alone in feeling that saving has nothing at all to do with immersion or survival difficulty. Its a mechanic, not a challenge, it just bugs me that this mechanic has been broken and until a mod re-enables the save options in my main menu and or the F5 quick save i have to find another game to play. I appreciate the link and will carefully decide which to use. I am nervous about adjusting my ini files to be able to save but i guess if this is the only way to do it i will consider it. I have no idea why the auto-save feature isn't a thing. Why force manual saves? This isn't the 1980s. If I die, set me back one minute and give me the option to go back three minutes or to the last zone change / fast travel. If I want to load a previous save, save 20 three-minute saves so i can go back an hour and add in zone changes / ft saves. Done. Totally, done. No more need for saving for me and you can guarantee the size of your save file directory won't explode. (My last was 500 megs 'cause deleting them is a pain). There is a case for people to want to save games at certain points, so keeping manual saves is fine, but I will probably never use that feature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urielseptim Posted May 10, 2016 Share Posted May 10, 2016 Ok, one opinion now:Imo most important and most crucial mechanics of any higher difficulty fallout revamp is to make game saving not as trivial as vanilla. If I can just press F9 every time I like there is no true risk and where you have no risk you have little reward. Game takes whole new perspective when something is really in stake. Otherwise all those other changes make little impact. However having multiple difficulty settings with this feature enabled might have sense thou. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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