The Death Penalty

[Balagor]

>snip< what made him so godly that he was able to choose who lives or dies? he chose to kill someone because he thought he had that right, and i choose to have him killed from the death penalty. >snip<

What makes you so godly then?

[hoofhearted4]

never said i was godly but if every man is equal, then if he has the god given right to kill someone, then we have the god given right to kill him back right?

 

anyone can kill anyone. nothing is stopping anyone from doing that. usually ones conscience is enough to stop someone. whether its because we think its wrong to kill someone or we are afraid to get in trouble or what have u, most ppl dont do it, even though they can. some ppl however can skip these things that stop most other ppl, and they kill someone. since the beginning of civilized humans, its been wrong to kill someone. and if you do, the penalty has always been death and there wasnt always 10 year waiting lists either. its not the ppl who were wronged (ie family and friends) killing him. that would still be against the law. in essence it society killing that man. and again, because thats how its always been because we as humans, always have thought that that is the only way to deal with such a corrupted person. and it is.

 

throughout history, your punishment was equal to the crime you have commited. for example, you steal something, you lose your hands, or some fingers. kill and be killed.

 

but what do u who are against the death penalty think should be that mans punishment? a slap on the wrist and jail? hardly seems an equal punishment for killing another human...but u tell me.

[kvnchrist]

. There's a saying that begs forgiveness, and those who act on revenge only become monsters themselves.

 

 

Ideals seem always to come from those with the least amount of experience in the matter discussed. That's why they are called ideals and why so many of them are found in bathrooms, where they belong.

 

Try telling that to a father that just lost his entire family so two degenerates can get their dicks wet.

 

Are you more experienced? Has ideals something to do with experience? Ideals comes from an open mind, no matter the experience.

As mentioned previous eye for an eye makes the world blind, and we will soon run out of people to execute. What good is it. No matter the cruelty he/she has comitted, a death penalty is not gonna bring the victims back. It is, and will always will be revenge. Revenge is born out of hatred, so I can see only more hatred as a result of death penalty.

 

 

Ideals don't come from an open mind. Just try debating some of these idealist on their sacred cows and you'll see what I mean. These people run to the end of their idealistic little chain and you'll hear some of the most foul mouthed little children you will ever hear. Once they've run out of talking points to throw at you, they start calling you every name in the book, for daring to question their sanctimonious rear ends.

 

Most ideals are instilled into people by those that use them for control. The idea that of open mindedness is a talking point to these people. They throw it out to make themselves feel good. The whole thing is a total fallacy in it's own right.

 

Please don't run to the edge of Pluto with this, eye for and eye thing. People continually overuse it and run it into the ground. They don't even know whole idea behind that is to give back what was taken. If they would read up on such things, instead of throwing them out as talking points, they would find that out. They find that too inconvenient, so they use it as a talking point.

 

It is only those that don't support justice that try to redefine it as revenge. They think their version of justice is the only one, therefore they redefine others interpretation. They try to redefine the wheel because they think such things have to be deeper than they are. So-called civilized society has ignored the fact that some of us are not civil and don't really give a flip what others think, do or own. If they see something they want, they'll take it. If they see a women or little girl they want, they will rape her and if they are afraid of getting caught, or someone steps in their way, they will kill them.

 

Wringing your hands and saying society is wrong in taking a life, for a life taken, doesn't resolve the situation, or saying nothing will return a murdered loved one, only shows how callus and disconnected those who have lost nothing can be. They have all the room to treat such things as a sociology experiment.

[McclaudEagle]

I believe the death penalty should be illegal. There are many reasons for this, which include the fact that many innocent lives have been taken because of mistakes. It's bad enough that a lot of innocent people are condemned to prison for things they never committed, but to accidentally put them on death row is just obscenely cruel. It's makes the state no better than the person they're condemning.

 

The other key point is, what does the death penalty do exactly?

 

All the death penalty does is create an easy way out for criminals. I personally would find it much better to know the criminal is rotting in his cell for the rest of his now miserable life, than endure a few minutes of injections and die.

 

But the most important point is my first one. Many innocent people have been killed because they've been sentenced for crimes they never committed. Sure, today's forensic examination methods are much better than they used to be, but they're not perfect, and innocent people are still condemned for things they've not done.

 

The biggest question here is...

 

How would you feel if you were innocent, yet were put on death row and were due for death by lethal injection tomorrow, simply because of a few mistakes?

Edited September 25, 2011 by McclaudEagle

[kvnchrist]

I believe the death penalty should be illegal. There are many reasons for this, which include the fact that many innocent lives have been taken because of mistakes. It's bad enough that a lot of innocent people are condemned to prison for things they never committed, but to accidentally put them on death row is just obscenely cruel. It's makes the state no better than the person they're condemning.

 

The other key point is, what does the death penalty do exactly?

 

All the death penalty does is create an easy way out for criminals. I personally would find it much better to know the criminal is rotting in his cell for the rest of his now miserable life, than endure a few minutes of injections and die.

 

But the most important point is my first one. Many innocent people have been killed because they've been sentenced for crimes they never committed. Sure, today's forensic examination methods are much better than they used to be, but they're not perfect, and innocent people are still condemned for things they've not done.

 

The biggest question here is...

 

How would you feel if you were innocent, yet were put on death row and were due for death by lethal injection tomorrow, simply because of a few mistakes?

 

I love it when people seem to think everybody else has a conscious, because they do. They visualize these people rotting in jail, lamenting every thing they've ever done wrong. Did you see any emotional response in Timothy McVeigh, when he was on trial or even when he was sentenced. No Nothing. Criminals are criminals because of their value system. They are not like others so don't grant them the sentiments that they don't have.

 

I'm still waiting for the proof you guys have refereed to that all these people are innocent. That's just another talking point. Talking points are red herrings that people toss out, when they don't have a valid argument. They are nothing more than a possible assumption of an affirmed maybe, Which makes it nothing

[McclaudEagle]

Are you seriously expecting me to believe that you don't think that innocent people have been killed through the death penalty? It's happened for thousands of years, and is still happening today all over the world, even in the United States. So far, they estimate that over the past 35 years, 130 people in the U.S. have been wrongfully sentenced to death. So what if the criminal doesn't show any remorse for the person they killed, are you really willing to let innocent people die because you want to see that guy die too?

 

Funny thing is, most people who like having the death penalty around have NEVER become a victim of it. Here's a scenario for you then...

 

You're driving home from your wife's funeral, who was brutally murdered. You have your kids in the back and a friend in the front. Next thing you know, the police are arresting you for a crime you never committed because they have "indisputable proof" that you murdered your wife. You know full well that you are innocent, but the court is not convinced by your pleas, so you're sentenced to death. You now know that because of this, your children are going to be orphaned, they have no mother, and soon no father...

 

The day comes for you to be executed, and despite your pleas of innocence, they continue to take you to your death. As you sit on the gurney, you think to yourself. The guy that really killed your wife is now walking free and happy, while you, and innocent man, are condemned to death. Images of your children's futures keep running through your mind, what kind of life they'll have. In a few moments, all the happiness in your life, and their's will be wiped out.

 

Now, to ask you how you would feel in this situation would be pointless, you'd be both angry and upset. Are you still happy the death penalty exists now?

 

Because believe me, the above scenario is a very real possibility, and people have been put through that fate before.

 

Perhaps you'd like to read this: Executed but possibly innocent

Edited September 25, 2011 by McclaudEagle

[kvnchrist]

Are you seriously expecting me to believe that you don't think that innocent people have been killed through the death penalty? It's happened for thousands of years, and is still happening today all over the world, even in the United States. So far, they estimate that over the past 35 years, 130 people in the U.S. have been wrongfully sentenced to death. So what if the criminal doesn't show any remorse for the person they killed, are you really willing to let innocent people die because you want to see that guy die too?

 

Funny thing is, most people who like having the death penalty around have NEVER become a victim of it. Here's a scenario for you then...

 

You're driving home from your wife's funeral, who was brutally murdered. You have your kids in the back and a friend in the front. Next thing you know, the police are arresting you for a crime you never committed because they have "indisputable proof" that you murdered your wife. You know full well that you are innocent, but the court is not convinced by your pleas, so you're sentenced to death. You now know that because of this, your children are going to be orphaned, they have no mother, and soon no father...

 

The day comes for you to be executed, and despite your pleas of innocence, they continue to take you to your death. As you sit on the gurney, you think to yourself. The guy that really killed your wife is now walking free and happy, while you, and innocent man, are condemned to death. Images of your children's futures keep running through your mind, what kind of life they'll have. In a few moments, all the happiness in your life, and their's will be wiped out.

 

Now, to ask you how you would feel in this situation would be pointless, you'd be both angry and upset. Are you still happy the death penalty exists now?

 

Because believe me, the above scenario is a very real possibility, and people have been put through that fate before.

 

Perhaps you'd like to read this: Executed but possibly innocent

First you say it is happening everyday all throughout the world then you give me an estimate of something possibly happening, but on who's judgment are these people innocent?

 

I like how people who are in the opposition are portrayed by certain people. If you don't think the way I do, then you are heartless or uncaring. Idealist on both sides of the political spectrum have used this for decades to discredit the other side. The right thinks the left is immoral degenerates that are trying to give the world away and the left thinks the right is a bunch of ignorant Cro-Magnon inbreeds that care only for the rich. NO ONE WANTS TO SEE ANOTHER PUT TO DEATH.. so you can take that talking point and put it back in your quiver of fallacies.

 

You can do this scenario thing all you want to, I've dealt with hundreds of these trying to bring sympathy for people neither of us know, and nether of us are certain they've done what they are accused of. I simply have more faith in the judicial system than you.

 

I really don't want to place these people, for the rest of their lives on the public dole for the rest of their lives. These people get more services than your grand ma, and don't pay a cent for their food, clothing, entertainment, medical, dental, death benefits. Your grandma has to take a back seat to these people when funding issues come to the table and that isn't right.

 

Did your grand ma rob or kill anyone? no but as far as services goes, she has out of pocket expenses, while these people don't. You want a scenario, well I have facts that I can bring to bear. The fact is that these people get more chances than any of us do, anytime of the week, and to warehouse them all so a few people can be satisfied is lunacy.

[marharth]

Are you seriously saying everyone we arrest and put on trial is without question a criminal?

[Balagor]

 

>snip<

 

I'm still waiting for the proof you guys have refereed to that all these people are innocent. That's just another talking point. Talking points are red herrings that people toss out, when they don't have a valid argument. They are nothing more than a possible assumption of an affirmed maybe, Which makes it nothing

 

So every criminal must be guilty per default. Why not shut down the trial system then? Must be billions. New procedure could be that every murdere/raptist is shot on site by the police. :thumbsup:

[sendo75]

I'm still waiting for the proof you guys have refereed to that all these people are innocent. That's just another talking point. Talking points are red herrings that people toss out, when they don't have a valid argument. They are nothing more than a possible assumption of an affirmed maybe, Which makes it nothing

...I simply have more faith in the judicial system than you.

 

Did your grand ma rob or kill anyone? no but as far as services goes, she has out of pocket expenses, while these people don't. You want a scenario, well I have facts that I can bring to bear. The fact is that these people get more chances than any of us do, anytime of the week, and to warehouse them all so a few people can be satisfied is lunacy.

 

Don't hold back on the proofs. I am keen to read up on the benefits of criminals versus senior citizens. However this logistic issue should be dealt with separately rather than be used to justify the death penalty.

 

I do not have that much faith in a human judicial system to pass a death sentence.