Ghogiel Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Bethesda DID get it wrong because by their crippled and dumbed down chargen they imposed THEIR idea of what the elves should look like without any possibility of changing that.What is exactly wrong with BGS actually saying this is what OUR mer look like. :psyduck: Saying they, the masters of the universe, got it wrong is seriously inflating the value of their opinion. If you think that, it's you who have it wrong in this case, not THEM. They don't look like what you want them too... That's not a problem with Skyrim or their aesthetic and choices, it's on you and your opinion of what you want. It's not a design flaw, a mistake, comical blunder. No, this is what Skyrim Mer look like because the art gods said so. end of. Sure, you can not like them.. but your opinion of what elves are supposed to look like or not look like is irrelevant. Someone is going to mod that every which way. Cake. Eat. STFU. :biggrin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoreai Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) Bethesda DID get it wrong because by their crippled and dumbed down chargen they imposed THEIR idea of what the elves should look like without any possibility of changing that.What is exactly wrong with BGS actually saying this is what OUR mer look like. :psyduck: Saying they, the masters of the universe, got it wrong is seriously inflating the value of their opinion. If you think that, it's you who have it wrong in this case, not THEM. They don't look like what you want them too... That's not a problem with Skyrim or their aesthetic and choices, it's on you and your opinion of what you want. It's not a design flaw, a mistake, comical blunder. No, this is what Skyrim Mer look like because the art gods said so. end of. Sure, you can not like them.. but your opinion of what elves are supposed to look like or not look like is irrelevant. Someone is going to mod that every which way. Cake. Eat. STFU. :biggrin: Then they shouldnt have made a character creator in the first place...why make one if you cant change a face to your liking...They tell you "be whoever you want to be and do whatever you want" and dont let you edit your character to your liking...meh. Edited November 25, 2011 by pavy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginnyfizz Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Bethesda DID get it wrong because by their crippled and dumbed down chargen they imposed THEIR idea of what the elves should look like without any possibility of changing that.What is exactly wrong with BGS actually saying this is what OUR mer look like. :psyduck: Saying they, the masters of the universe, got it wrong is seriously inflating the value of their opinion. If you think that, it's you who have it wrong in this case, not THEM. They don't look like what you want them too... That's not a problem with Skyrim or their aesthetic and choices, it's on you and your opinion of what you want. It's not a design flaw, a mistake, comical blunder. No, this is what Skyrim Mer look like because the art gods said so. end of. Sure, you can not like them.. but your opinion of what elves are supposed to look like or not look like is irrelevant. Someone is going to mod that every which way. Cake. Eat. STFU. :biggrin: WOW, STFU, that's really constructive comment. Since you put it so nicely, then no, I won't. I and the others who do think the mer look hideous and don't fit in with our "aesthetic and choices" are as entitled to our opinions as those of you who think they look wonderful. Unfortunately, those who do think the changes in the mer are for the better are inclined, with one or two exceptions, to be abusive and dismissive in the way they express their opinions. Now here's the rub, those of us who dislike what the mer look like do not ask or expect everyone who does like them to make elves in their own games look the way we like them. All we are saying is that the current chargen prevents us from easily doing something about it, which is a step backwards from Oblivion. Yes the OB elves were fugly, but the sliders were far more advanced and enabled you to change that. Bethesda have crippled the chargen, everyone knows that there are less sliders and that you have less freedom to make more individual faces. So in fact all the mer look cookie cutter samey.Pavy puts it excellently;- "Then they shouldnt have made a character creator in the first place...why make one if you cant change a face to your liking...They tell you "be whoever you want to be and do whatever you want" and dont let you edit your character to your liking...meh." As I have referred to before, I am concerned that Bethesda, with their increasing catering to the console market, are heading down the road of other games where you get limited or no character customization. Wouldn't surprise me if they chopped it out altogether in the next Elder Scrolls, if there is one. Good job I have a little time on my hands at the moment, because from what others have said about the meshes, sounds like there's going to be a lot of need for Blender, Nifskope and the CK to be got out and hammered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Claiming that Bethesda was wrong to impose their view on what Mer should look like is falacious in the extreme, and as much as i hate to make personal attacks, an arrogant perspective. If i were to write a story, and create a universe which included elves, but those Elves were industrial, evil, and prone to clockwork augmentations, i am fully within my rights as an author to impose that image within the universe i created. In a similar vien, Bethesda is fully within their rights to impose the TES image of Mer within the TES universe, and its much better that they try to remain consistant on what their Elves look like than to flipflop every game. That said, there is always a degree of variation within a population, and there just isn't enough in the way of options to represent that. I think if the options alowed for, say, the creation of D&D elves, they would have taken it too far and broken the design of their elves. However, there is a happy medium involved, and i don't think they've reached that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DyingAtheist Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 I'd just like to add to the general rambling, that I think Dark Elves look amazing in this game and the others aren't half bad.People have issues with them because, and I quote, they aren't "Beautiful". This isn't some manga-cutesy Japanese RPG, this is Skyrim, it's set in the toughest and roughest area around. This is the thing, people *censored* about immersion all the time, about how this and that ruins immersion, but you know what one of the worst offenders is? Clean, shiny, beautiful people and elves. That isn't how the real world works and that isn't how Skyrim would work if it was real, go out on to the streets and have a look, is everyone you see a model? I simply don't get why every elf has to look like Orlando Bloom and frankly I applaud Bethesda for daring to make them as un-human like as possible. The rest of you, well, you can wait until the creation kit comes out and go back to having overly-shiny and "pretty" elves that don't suit the game in the slightest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmig Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) I share the original poster feeling... whatever were the reason why... those elves are really ugly... I played a human race in skyrim because of that. :D I am just hoping the savior of the elven races will come with its sets of well design meshes and textures and publish it here Edited November 25, 2011 by dmig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thoreai Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 (edited) Gosh you people just dont get it, you go on and on about your "this isnt beuty elves" "this isnt manga-anime character" without even thinking what we are writting here...i wonder how many of you actually read this thread...especially the "amg this isnt manga" people. For the whole time the pro side is acusing us of wanting some animeish elves even though it was clearly said several times this isnt about it..exactly as ginnyfizz said, for a few exceptions all the pro people use all posibilities to ridicule of what we are talking about here without even reading what this is about...or more like dont want to read it :) If i were to write a story, and create a universe which included elves, but those Elves were industrial, evil, and prone to clockwork augmentations, i am fully within my rights as an author to impose that image within the universe i created." Fine for you, are you going to make a character creation in that game aswell ?...i would like to edit my character so i like what i see, or are you going to prevent me from doing that even though im being given a large explorable world where i can do whatever i want...well almost since i wont be able to change the characters face form to my liking...what are the options you are going to give me with that?...oh right cheek,chin,nose forehead color...that should be enough costumization right? Edited November 25, 2011 by pavy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisnpuppy Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 The point is not that Bethesda was wrong to "impose" their idea of how elves should look....it is that they did not heed the past 5 years of mods and the consumer wanting to be able to customize their characters in more ways. They made races and faces that one is unable to change very much. So they got it wrong in that way. They not only didn't listen to what people wanted..to make their characters more varied...but even lessened the ability to customize from their past game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Fine for you, are you going to make a character creation in that game aswell ?...i would like to edit my character so i like what i see, or are you going to prevent me from doing that even though im being given a large explorable world where i can do whatever i want...well almost since i wont be able to change the characters face form to my liking...what are the options you are going to give me with that?...oh right cheek,chin,nose forehead color...that should be enough costumization right? Ok, you seem to be missing the point... Let me make it a little more general, and move away from the Elf example. Say i create a fictional world. In it are Humans, Orcs, Trolls and Gnomes. Now, if it were made a game similar to Skyrim, with even the range of character design in Oblivion, would it be appropriate to make the game with an option to play a Dwarf? What about anthropomorphic cats? Neither exist within the world, but should they be included in the 'canon' story just because people want to play them? The appearances of the Mer in Skyrim are the 'canon' descriptions. Its diminishing to the story, which is at the core of these continious universes, to offer choices that don't represent the depiction in the universe. If players thing Elves should ahve pixy wings, should Bethesda have included the option, regardless of the fact that their Mer do not? As i've said, i grant that there are too few options within character design as it is. I also grant that some people want more 'attractive' characters and do not like the features of the TES Mer. I also agree that there is a far too limited ability to make attractive representitives of some of the races. What i dispute is the idea that Bethesda somehow faulted by following the design they had created for the Mer, simply because other people may want something different. It does nothing to serve the universe in question, and compromises the story telling element simply for asthetic reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lisnpuppy Posted November 25, 2011 Share Posted November 25, 2011 Should I cut and paste my last post on the off chance someone actually reads it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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