Beth messed up our elves!

[BarefootWarrior]

I have come to the conclusion (and after much reading) that if you have seen one Elf...Ya seen them all !

 

 

RUNS.... :tongue:

 

 

You do like living dangerously, don't you? :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

 

Yep...yep, bring it on... :dance:

[JimboUK]

 

Most are but some are arguing that Oblivions were wrong and Skyrims are right, a silly argument about a fictional race.

 

This, for me at least, is less about it being a fictional species and more about consistancy within the story. If you're fine with the story changing every game, and a total lack of sense or consistancy, fine. WoW should be right up your alley.

 

But to some of us, maintaining a consistant world is important to the story telling experience, and Oblivion just flat out got it wrong.

 

Theres a point where too much customization compromises the integrity of the races, and Oblivion took a nose-dive off that ledge.Skyrim has climbed back up, but seems to be holding possition a good ways back from the ledge.

 

Consistent with what? they were too ill defined in Arena and Daggerfall to be used as a reference so we're left Morrowind and Oblivion. Morrowind was restrained by the technology of the day, every race had angular heads, Oblivions looked the way they did because the developers didn't make any effort with the NPCs. Not that any of it matters because it's a fictional race in a fantasy game.

 

As I said a decent character generator would have left everyone happy, the Mr Potato Head thing that shipped with Skyrim is nowhere near as good as the character generators that shipped with Oblivion and FO3. They made a big deal of the character generation prior to release and failed to deliver.

 

As for "WoW should be right up your alley" if you can't discuss things without insulting people maybe you stop, personal insults are what those incapable of a coherent argument have to resort to.

[Thoreai]

 

Most are but some are arguing that Oblivions were wrong and Skyrims are right, a silly argument about a fictional race.

 

This, for me at least, is less about it being a fictional species and more about consistancy within the story. If you're fine with the story changing every game, and a total lack of sense or consistancy, fine. WoW should be right up your alley.

 

But to some of us, maintaining a consistant world is important to the story telling experience, and Oblivion just flat out got it wrong.

 

Theres a point where too much customization compromises the integrity of the races, and Oblivion took a nose-dive off that ledge.Skyrim has climbed back up, but seems to be holding possition a good ways back from the ledge.

 

Consistent with what? they were two ill defined in Arena and Daggerfall to be used as a reference so we're left Morrowind and Oblivion. Morrowind was restrained by the technology of the day, every race had angular heads, Oblivions looked the way they did because the developers didn't make any effort with the NPCs. Not that any of it matters because it's a fictional race in a fantasy game.

 

As I said a decent character generator would have left everyone happy, the Mr Potato Head thing that shipped with Skyrim is nowhere near as good as the Character generators that shipped with Oblivion and FO3. They made a big deal of the character generation prior to release and failed to deliver.

 

As for "WoW should be right up your alley" if you can't discuss things without insulting people maybe you stop, personal insults are what those incapable of a coherent argument have to resort to.

Dang i wish i knew english so great like you jim...you pretty much nailed it...kudos :thumbsup:

[Goliath978]

What happened to elves being elves? Like LOTR had elves the way they're meant to be. TES kinda...ruins elves...gotta say it. Skyrim was better.

[alkaloid27]

What happened to elves being elves? Like LOTR had elves the way they're meant to be. TES kinda...ruins elves...gotta say it. Skyrim was better.

 

??? Was better, or IS better? I don't understand this paradoxical comment... LOTR had elves the way they're meant to be, but Skyrim (which is TES) does them better, even though TES 'kinda ruins elves'? o_O

[Goliath978]

What happened to elves being elves? Like LOTR had elves the way they're meant to be. TES kinda...ruins elves...gotta say it. Skyrim was better.

 

??? Was better, or IS better? I don't understand this paradoxical comment... LOTR had elves the way they're meant to be, but Skyrim (which is TES) does them better, even though TES 'kinda ruins elves'? o_O

Yeah, elves the way they're meant is in LOTR...you look at Morrowind or Oblivion, with their cats called "elves" just shames elves. The elves in Skyrim vaguely resemble how they're intended. In TES3-4 they couldn't be rightly called elves.

[Lachdonin]

Consistent with what? they were too ill defined in Arena and Daggerfall to be used as a reference so we're left Morrowind and Oblivion. Morrowind was restrained by the technology of the day, every race had angular heads, Oblivions looked the way they did because the developers didn't make any effort with the NPCs. Not that any of it matters because it's a fictional race in a fantasy game.

 

....

 

As for "WoW should be right up your alley" if you can't discuss things without insulting people maybe you stop, personal insults are what those incapable of a coherent argument have to resort to.

 

Consistant with the artwork. The TES artwork has ALWAYS portrayed Mer in a particular way, whether it was through concepts or published material. Morrowind was the first game that had the ability to represent the artwork, and it did so to the best of its ability. Oblivion, on the other hand, failed to represent, artistically, even its own concept art. Skyrim is a return to the original, and consistantly portrayed artworkd.

 

And if you're going to pull the 'Its all fictional, so they can do whatever they want whenever they want' card, you shouldn't even be here. That mentality implies a complete lack of regard for thematic, story and artistic cohesion which is part of a franchise universe. If thats not important to you, fine, but it is important to the universe, and my entire arguement is based on maintaining the universe.

 

As for the WoW thing, i have made one comment, one which is based on the fact that WoW constantly changes its imagery and background to suit the will of the community rather than maintaining internal consistancy, in almost 30 pages of discussion, which CAN be construed as insulting but lacks anything of the intent, while at the same time having made at least a dozen statements, based in literay philosophy, biology, artistic philosophy, as well as citing changes in the videogame market and design schemes, and you claim that i am incapable of a coherent arguement?

 

Yeah, elves the way they're meant is in LOTR...you look at Morrowind or Oblivion, with their cats called "elves" just shames elves. The elves in Skyrim vaguely resemble how they're intended. In TES3-4 they couldn't be rightly called elves.

 

This is an utterly falacious statement, both within the context of literature & Myth, and within the context of TES. The LOTR Elves, first off, don't represent what you see in the movies. Second, they are one of a particular 'type' of Elf which can be found in human mythic cycles, dating primarily to germanic traditions. Other historic representations to elves include those you see in the Harry Potter movies, as well as winged pixies, to barbaric, green skinned forest savages, and in the oldest depictions there are indistinguishable for humans. Within literature there are even more depictions, ranging from the WoW Night Elf to the Hellboy's haunting almost albino creatures. The term 'elf' is a catch all representation of any of literally hundreds of different types of creatures, the only unifying component of which is their non-human nature.

 

Within the TES, it should also be noted that these are NOT 'Elves' in the proper sense. They are Mer. In the same way that the Dwemer are called Dwarves, the common name of 'elf' is an almost derogatory name given to them by the Humans. It represents more of a human outlook regarding them and less of an absolute description of what they are and how they look.

Edited November 27, 2011 by Lachdonin

[Thandal]

[color-orange]People. Real, living human beings.

 

As my father used to say, "Don't make me come up there."

 

Please stop accusing each other of being "right" or "wrong" about other people's fiction.

 

Whether it's BethSoft, or BioWare, or Tolkien, or all the players and readers who have never heard of any of those, we all may have our opinions of the Fair Folk.

 

Since there is no objective standard of Elvenhood against which to measure any of them, they are all equally correct. And it really doesn't matter, since even if they weren't, there's no way to "prove" it.

 

One can say, "I prefer the way the Elves were depicted in this work. This is why..."

 

One cannot say, "The way the Elves were depicted in that work is wrong."

 

At least, here on the Nexus that's the way it is. In Faërie, it's another story...[/color] :biggrin:

[csgators]

If you read Tolkien elves are taller than men and he never mentions pointy ears. Just sayin. :tongue: Edited November 27, 2011 by csgators

[Naikado2]

In a sex appeal fashion, the current elves are MUCH worse. Otherwise, though, they offer a lot of differentiation from the regular races of men, which I think is something of an improvement.