Tutorial: 3ds Max Skinned Meshes Into Game

[jojjo]

Sorry, double one. I was just checking the posts. Edited February 24, 2012 by jojjo

[Edmond Dantes]

add an edit normal modifier and match the normal vectors of that bottom edge loop to the normals on the the body's neck edge loop, In theory they should match, but in practice they won't. If they do match then the seams at those joins that you always see, including vanilla, should be reduced, it's a compound issue, there are texture seams and what not as well. you can safely update tspace in nifskope and it will not affect the normals direction it will only redo tangents and binormals.

 

Speaking of these the normal map and vertex normals are codependent, meaning you shouldn't mess with the normals after you baked out the normal map.. I think even object space as that gets baked into the map itself, so if those maps were baked with those vanilla normals, then changing them like I suggest would only cause errors to show up in how the normal map renders on the meshes surface.

 

It all has to be done right together or it won't work perfectly and you'll forever have those neck seams people moan about all the time.

 

On and any blck random splots people talk about, I think mentioned it from using skin wrap, I dunno if it does that, but those random dark patches always sounds like weird normal vectors to me. once I am done with both the high and low poly models, in 3ds max there is a bug that can only be solved by converting to editble mesh, or adding edit normals and unifying. I always, always. reset xform, convert to edible mesh, then back to poly, edit normals and collapse before making the final pass checking all my face smoothing is sorted before making cages and baking.

 

I also learnt some cool s*** with tools>channel info. (was needing to totally remover vcol channel or export to CE2 would screw up) but I found out you can make geomerty changes AND paste the vertex number list back together and keep the numbering for morphs working. Google if you want to check wth I am on about. I didn't even know about that until recently.

 

Awesome, thanks a bunch for the tutorial. Some of the things you talked about are definitely beyond my comprehension, but it's good to know for future references :)

Edited February 24, 2012 by Edmond Dantes

[Ghogiel]

actually think about the normals on the head.. you should leave them alone in this case. Because they don't HAVE normals, they use object space, So any seams in this regard would come from the normal map. If they baked the mesh with unified normals at the seams that in my mind would be the right way to do this. maybe that is one of the reasons why the did object space on characters this time.

[elmanouche]

Hello fellow modders,

 

I am running into a weird issue with 3ds max.

I have a _0 and a _1 mesh with exactly the same vertices count before export :

http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/3105/1728vertices.png

 

But after export I get this in NifScope (RC1)

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/4937/diffvertices.png

 

On both pics _0 is left and _1 is right... And it is a 1stpersonfemalebody mesh.

 

Here are my export settings :

http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/2104/exportk.png

 

Am I doing something wrong ?

 

Thanks for your help.

And for info I'm using max for 1st person view as Blender mess up the BSDismemberSkinInstance on export(export as fallout 3 .nif, since no updated nifscript for Blender), while 3ds Max seems more capable, I'm just a noob on Max... >.<

 

Elmanouche

[galy3]

This a problem with polyedit modifier on export. Use meshedit.

[elmanouche]

Oh, I should add, it is a mesh I did with Blender, then exported it, made it skyrim "workable" but missing a skin partition.

So I open it in 3ds Max, modify the BSDismember modifier to recreate the partitions as it should be, then export. I don't apply any "Edit poly" modifier.

 

My mesh show is skyrim, but is mainly black as it misses a skin partition. The weight works too, so my _0 and _1 mesh have exactly the same vertex number, etc, etc...

 

 

EDIT : well, I found my own solution with Blender. Played with Vertex groups and got my result. Thanks for fast answer though.

Edited March 8, 2012 by elmanouche

[iceburg]

I have a question that I'm hoping someone can answer for me. I'm using blender so I realize that this is a bit off topic, but I can't find an answer anywhere.

I'm working on an underwear replacer that removes the loincloth of a character (and then I'm going to use that to make a spandex superhero costume).

The two meshes look perfect in blender and in nifskope, but in game there are seams between the new underwear and the body/legs. The seams don't grow or shrink, so I'm sure its not a rigging problem. (Note that the edge meshes of the underwear have the exact same position and weight as their body counterparts, as I built the underwear model off of the body and then seperated it for export (so I can make a fat version of it without haveing to totally remake a fat body...)

http://i1133.photobucket.com/albums/m588/iceburg333/Skyrim%20Pics/Mesh-Grey-White.png?t=1331515196 http://i1133.photobucket.com/albums/m588/iceburg333/Skyrim%20Pics/seams.jpg

I'm wondering if the problem has something to do with the above picture. When I delete the shader properties and/or dismemberment data and look at just the trishape data, you can see that the underwear are white while the body is grey.

I've followed the tutorial here: http://wiki.tesnexus.com/index.php/Creating_an_armour_for_Fallout._Part_1, and my num UV Sets on both are 4097, Normals = yes, has vertex colors= no, and my object shows up fine in game (minus the seams). There is a slight difference in shading, from some angles between the two meshes.

Again, I'm sure the seams are not present in blender or nifskope, so my vertexes are lining up outside game, just not inside.

I've been trying to figure this out for a month, so if anyone can help me, I'd be extremely grateful.

And If this is a noob question or in the wrong thread, I apologize, if you could slap my wrist and then point me in the right direction, I'd be grateful then too.

Thanks!

-Iceburg

Edited March 13, 2012 by iceburg

[CanisRex84]

:wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash: :wallbash:

 

Hello......

 

I spent 16 !!!! hours solid consecutively yesterday making the _0 & _1 variations for a set of armour, mixed from Witcher 2 resources... (as Max crashed)

 

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j398/ActusReus/NewArmour.jpg

 

After I made the skinny_0 I used the exact same mesh and expanded by using edit poly with soft selection and painstakingly ensuring it matched up to an imported (frozen) malebody_1..

 

I didnt add a Edit Poly modifier I just clicked on each mesh and chose edit poly from the selection.

 

added a new BSDismemberSkinInstance once done..

 

I did what was required in Nifskope, i.e. Block copy branch, block paste branch for the BSLightingProperty for each NiTriShape for both armours skinny_0 and big_1..

 

This is what I got in 3rd person:

 

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j398/ActusReus/2012-03-16_00001.jpg

 

WTF is that... I have had the moprh states go wrong before but it never involved crazy light shows..

 

Also @ Ghogiel or anyone else that uses the following method:

 

"option 5: and my personal fav idea , using textools UV XYZ swap on both versions, flatten them out align the other version to your clone... and then skin wrap to the other shape, send it back to xyz. And BAM! you have flawless conformed mesh"

 

Please could you explain in dumb, dumb terms how to do this? I have textools installed but except from Unwrapping the UV I'm lost..

 

I have done a couple of custom armours (mostly successful, besides some of the mesh moving with the head when it shouldn't)...

 

http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1357993-iv-empire-wip/

 

That was using SoMuchMorpher... until this happened.... :facepalm:

 

http://i1083.photobucket.com/albums/j398/ActusReus/UhhOhh.jpg

 

That!! happens everytime I click the 1st step "MergeMorpher" which used to display the skeleton.. now it just spazblows up everywhere..

 

Even deleted and re-downloaded the script and uninstalled/installed Max 2012..

 

I just need a bit of guidance for the best most accurate workflow, and I know that its been over in previous posts, believe me I read them all from page one.. (well until page 20 something)

 

So if anyone can help me out with Ghogiels preferred method Number 5 that would be amazing..

[Ghogiel]

that method using textools is only useful when you are not making custom models, but when dealing with vanilla outfits that already have a morph.. but the morph is now broken and you wanted to salvage the mesh edits you made without starting over using a workflow that would keep morph intact from the beginning. secondly, that is more or less superceeded by the somuchmorpher script, which basically tries to do the same thing, but will also work with custom outfits you created that do not have a morph at all.

 

I wouldn't find myself in a position to have to use that, it's only useful when trying to did yourself out of a hole so to speak. you shouldn't need to use it.

 

 

no idea wtf is going with your stuff though :confused:

[CanisRex84]

So do you have any suggestions for creating morph states for custom armours (discounting SoMuchMorpher)?

 

Ghogiel I can see (or have read enough to see) that you have quite a depth of knowledge and more than sufficient intelligence to accomplish what I am working towards..

 

(flattery, why yes it is, but sincere)

 

So would you mind helping me out, maybe PM'ing me some guidelines or something, like a general summary in laymans (stupid talk) of what I need to do..

 

I will then promise to do anything you want even the lives of my unborn children... I am that DESPERATE...

 

My whole WIP is pretty much on hold until I have this matter resolved..

 

And I will articulate to the best of my intelligence exactly what steps you told me to follow for anyone else reading this thread..

 

Thanks