Porn

[draconix]

I'm opposed to lawes that aim to dictate the behavior of an individual. I am also against governments involvement in the business of dictating morality. Laws are in place to protect an individual from others and vice versa, not to protect one's "immortal soul" from the evils of vice. To that end, I disagree with prohibition of drugs, prostitution, laws regarding seat-belt use under the flag of safety, and so on.

 

Pornography is a luxury, much like a computer is a luxury. We could go without, but would we really want to? Probably not. We live in a society where people are forced to to suppress so much of what hundreds of thousands of years of evolution has trained us to do, I think pornography helps some of us indulge these urges without rampantly fornicating. Not that there is anything wrong with that. I'm looking at you 1960's.

 

As far as the "actors and actresses" involved, most people don't love their job, and there is corruption to go around in any market. I don't think that it would be unexpected for there to be some percentage of people out there scorned by the adult films industry, same as I would expect there to be some people out there scorned by the construction work industry, or by working for the post office. Speaking of which, when was the last time a porn star shot up an office building full of co-workers? I don't mean to belittle the actual, factual exploitation of those within the industry, but the fact of the matter is that exploitation exists in nearly all work environments, but this doesn't mean that all work should be prohibited.

 

Besides, there are already laws against rape. Working in the porn industry does not suddenly make those rules not apply. If enforcement of those laws is an issue, that's not something that creating more laws is going to fix.

[WrathOfDeadguy]

Consent is the only issue which should matter with regards to anything sexual in nature. A child cannot give informed consent, therefore child pornography is wrong. A person under duress (a sex slave, rape victim, etc) cannot give informed consent, hence porn featuring forced sexual acts which are real- as opposed to staged- is also wrong. Animals cannot give informed consent, therefore porn depicting bestiality is wrong. Porn featuring adults participating of their own free will cannot be wrong because all parties involved have consented.

 

Robert Heinlein put it best:

 

"Most moral philosophers consciously or unconsciously assume the essential correctness of our cultural sexual code- family, monogamy, continence, the postulate of privacy that troubled you so, restriction of intercourse to the marriage bed, et cetera. Having stipulated our cultural code as a whole, they fiddle with details- even such piffle as solemnly discussing whether or not the female breast is an 'obscene' sight! But mostly they debate how the human animal can be induced or forced to obey this code, blandly ignoring the high probability that the heartaches and tragedies they see all around them originate in the code itself rather than failure to abide by the code."- Jubal E Harshaw, Stranger in a Strange Land

 

Morality is subjective. Nothing can be inherently wrong except that which infringes on the natural right of a human being to self-determinate. Therefore porn cannot be wrong unless it features one or more individuals who cannot or will not consent- who have in effect been robbed of their liberty and their right of self-determination.

 

Is porn necessary? Not even slightly. It is, however, rather entertaining and pleasurable.

[Keanumoreira]

I don't think it's really wrong, and why would it be? The only reason why it would be is if it is done illegally or immorally, but otherwise, it's just part of human nature. We all have that built in instinct, and it is why we are here today, and depending on your age or experience; why you're children and if you have them; why your grandchildren are here. There's nothing wrong with curiosity, and I admit, I have gone there before as I'm sure many others here have before me. If anyone feels ashamed about it, then you shouldn't. As long as it isn't wrong, then hey...why not? If you're mature enough, and you can take responsibility as an adult, then you'll be okay. But if it were me with my children, and I caught them doing that, then that would be a different story. Fingers would be chopped. ;D

[Vagrant0]

Illuna had things right to a point, but really pornography is something that includes a much broader range of things. Pornography in the broader sense refers to any imagery, physical or mental, that illicits any sort of arousal, sexual or emotional. Even depictions of violence or performances of High Art can be pornographic in nature. Even our own thoughts, dreams, and daily musings can be pornographic... even if you aren't a male ages 12-45.

 

Additionally, men aren't the only ones who use pornography, they are just usually the most overt and outspoken about it due to dozens of social norms. If you count romance novels and other less overt forms, such as personal fantasies, as being pornography, the usage is actually about evenly distributed between the genders. Humanity in general is quite sexually charged, despite some social efforts to suppress this over the centuries.

 

Our negative view of pornography is actually more harmful than the pornography itself. In most cases of mistreatment, it is only allowed to continue because people who are mistreated rarely have legal power to protect themselves without also convicting themselves. Since working in the industry carries with it social shames and complications, people become trapped in the life with few ways out that don't involve having to hide their identity. Since it is an industry with a sorted membership, it also attracts a certain criminal element who see it as a way to make money that doesn't involve breaking any noticeable laws (since people who complain just go missing).

 

From the user standpoint, the negative view of pornography leads to certain obsessions that can often progress to strange and unusual lengths. This sort of thing happens not because a quadriplegic midget in clown makeup getting smothered with excrement is a particularly sexy image in general, but because it carries with it that spark of danger, risk of being found out, and the feeling that it's something that you aren't supposed to be looking at. It progresses like this not only because it's plentiful, but also because it's something that has to be hidden. Granted, there are some people who have unusual interests, but most of these would not take root in adolescence if there wasn't such a thrill in having the secret of it. Among young males, there is also this social acceptance of buying, obtaining, or using pornography, where if you aren't slapping your meat to a playboy, you're seen as strange, weak, or possibly homosexual. This sort of peer pressure is rooted both in the taboo of pornography as well as the tendency for males to seek peer approval.

 

The only thing immoral about pornography are the ways in which it is often made by exploiting, coercing, or enslaving the people featured. And that mostly happens because there are few legal routes and people are generally greedy, exploitative, and dishonest when they can get away with it.

[prolovegirl]

This debate should make a distinction between porn and erotica. The classification "porn" is relative. If it's tasteful, it is really "erotica" or even "art". If it's tasteful, elegant, and refined, "porn" would be an insulting term. But if it's crude, and unattractive, then and only then should it be called "porn".

 

If it conveys a romantic or loving atmosphere, it really should be called erotica. If it makes you feel uplifted, ennobled, inspired, if it beautifies your soul, then it's worthy of the god "Eros".

 

Nudity and sexuality can be conveyed in an ugly way, or in a beautiful way. Even unusual flavors like incest or futanaris can be conveyed in a beautiful, loving, erotic way.

 

Just my two cents,

PLG

[DeadMansFist849]

Well, PLG, incest is about the abuse of power between parent and child or older and younger siblings/other relatives, that's not beautiful and loving, it's actually abhorrent. Futanari is a questionable one because the fetishization of transgender women is completely wrong and people shouldn't be treated like sex toys or reduced to their body parts, but on the other hand you could have beautiful erotic art of trans people if you, well, present them as people.

 

The distinction between "porn"and "erotica" is more of an elderly radfem thing and doesn't make much sense as some of their "erotica" was indeed very patriarchal, but I never saw a radfem complain about romance novels, just porn, sex work, feminine clothing and women not caring about sexual purity.

[Pushkatu]

Well, it's out there and it's quite easy to "acces" it nowadays. Problem is, to many young people have acces to it and some damage their sexual life without even knowing. As far as I'm concerned, I'm ok with it, as long as no inocents have to suffer from other's greed and lust for money.

[marharth]

I think its sad that this even has to be a debate.

[Simpson3k]

As long as the showing of murder, violance, hatred and greed is common and accepted in movies and games, i see no reason why porn should be immoral.

 

Number one in the ten commandments is : you shall not kill..

 

well showing excessive killing never seems to be a problem no matter the media so what makes porn more immoral than murder, that it should be forbidden?

Edited December 1, 2011 by Simpson3k

[hoofhearted4]

ive always thought that if a guy can walk down the street without a shirt, why cant a girl?