Deep Ocean or Deep Space

[grannywils]

Just from my own personal perspective I would choose the ocean. I have always been fascinated with the sea and all of its life forms and resources. As a child I wanted very much to be a marine biologist. Although that never panned out, my fascination remains to this day.

 

For whatever reason, I have never been a "space junkie". While I recognize the vastness of space and all of its potential, I speak, as I said, only from my own personal perspective and interests.

[Nintii]

Don't get me wrong I'm a sci-fi nut and space holds vast amounts of treasures and resources that would definitely benefit us here on earth ... BUT ... I have heard of some

type of law or agreement to NOT spoil or mess with the other planets environments, just like on Antartica.

 

Besides overcoming that obstacle, it would cost the tax payer an absolute fortune, check this quote:

 

"Q. How much does the Space Shuttle cost?

A. The Space Shuttle Endeavour, the orbiter built to replace the Space Shuttle Challenger, cost approximately $1.7 billion. "

 

And again I quote:

 

"How Much Do Satellites Cost?

Satellite launches don't always go well, as shown by this story on failed launches in 1999. There is a great deal at stake. For example, this hurricane-watch satellite

mission cost $290 million. This missile-warning satellite cost $682 million.

 

Another important factor with satellites is the cost of the launch. According to this report, a satellite launch can cost anywhere between $50 million and $400 million.

A shuttle mission pushes toward half a billion dollars (a shuttle mission could easily carry several satellites into orbit). You can see that building a satellite, getting it

into orbit and then maintaining it from the ground control facility is a major financial endeavor!"

 

Yes it's all about money as far as I'm concerned ... rather explore our oceans, and again I quote:

 

"To date, we have explored less than five percent of the ocean

 

Much remains to be learned from exploring the mysteries of the deep.

The ocean is the lifeblood of Earth, covering more than 70 percent of the planet's surface, driving weather, regulating temperature, and ultimately supporting all living organisms. Throughout history, the ocean has been a vital source of sustenance, transport, commerce, growth, and inspiration.

 

Yet for all of our reliance on the ocean, 95 percent of this realm remains unexplored, unseen by human eyes.

 

NOAA’s Office of Ocean Exploration and Research is leading efforts to explore the ocean by supporting expeditions to investigate and document unknown and poorly known areas of the ocean. These expeditions represent a bold and innovative approach by infusing teams of scientist-explorers with a "Lewis and Clark" spirit of discovery and equipping them with the latest exploration tools.

 

From mapping and describing the physical, biological, geological, chemical, and archaeological aspects of the ocean to understanding ocean dynamics, developing new technologies, and helping us all unlock the secrets of the ocean, NOAA is working to increase our understanding of the ocean realm".

 

Furthermore, here is provided an excellent link in favor of exploring the ocean.

 

Click this link

Edited February 14, 2012 by Nintii

[nosisab]

Once man created the system to serve mankind but turned out mankind exiting to serve the system. That's the general version, can be named every particular case. Money was created to serve man, in the end mankind exist to serve money.

 

In nomine money man will do everything and willingly close the eyes for immediate and future consequences. For very long time he had no power to seriously damage his (as in human, genderless) niche, his environment and himself as species. Now this changed drastically and the ability to destroy grows exponentially year after year to the point war is not the greater menace, actually the distorted model makes war the "solution" for the problems mankind creates to itself.

 

Going toward the ocean will only divide mankind yet more, at least the space brings the promise of mankind seeing itself as humanity instead groups. Yet, space is not so at hand and we may (I dare to say will be forced) to resort to ocean even if solely to survive a small time longer (not individual life span for sure but...) before earth is definitely not enough anymore. The sooner we begin seriously preparing to seek another block to suck dry, the better our chances.

 

Well, there are alternatives, maybe, still none I can foresee as "good news" for mankind; maybe some are, maybe being reborn leads the human species through another path.

 

To those pointing difficulties in exploring space, you are right, the challenge is immense but comparatively not too different from the challenges the first ocean sailors faced. We will need start building "boats" to navigate our neighborhood but with time (if we get it) we will once again develop the technology to build caravels and galleons.

Edited February 14, 2012 by nosisab

[marharth]

To those pointing difficulties in exploring space, you are right, the challenge is immense but comparatively not too different from the challenges the first ocean sailors faced. We will need start building "boats" to navigate our neighborhood but with time (if we get it) we will once again develop the technology to build caravels and galleons.

What we have now is comparable to log rafts. You are not going to sail to the new world in a log raft. What we need to be doing is researching a better boat.

[grannywils]

Don't get me wrong I'm a sci-fi nut and space holds vast amounts of treasures and resources that would definitely benefit us here on earth ... BUT ... I have heard of some

type of law or agreement to NOT spoil or mess with the other planets environments, just like on Antartica.

 

Besides overcoming that obstacle, it would cost the tax payer an absolute fortune, check this quote:

 

"Q. How much does the Space Shuttle cost?

A. The Space Shuttle Endeavour, the orbiter built to replace the Space Shuttle Challenger, cost approximately $1.7 billion. "

 

And again I quote:

 

"How Much Do Satellites Cost?

Satellite launches don't always go well, as shown by this story on failed launches in 1999. There is a great deal at stake. For example, this hurricane-watch satellite

mission cost $290 million. This missile-warning satellite cost $682 million.

 

Another important factor with satellites is the cost of the launch. According to this report, a satellite launch can cost anywhere between $50 million and $400 million.

A shuttle mission pushes toward half a billion dollars (a shuttle mission could easily carry several satellites into orbit). You can see that building a satellite, getting it

into orbit and then maintaining it from the ground control facility is a major financial endeavor!"

 

Yes it's all about money as far as I'm concerned ... rather explore our oceans, and again I quote:

 

"To date, we have explored less than five percent of the ocean

 

Much remains to be learned from exploring the mysteries of the deep.

The ocean is the lifeblood of Earth, covering more than 70 percent of the planet's surface, driving weather, regulating temperature, and ultimately supporting all living organisms. Throughout history, the ocean has been a vital source of sustenance, transport, commerce, growth, and inspiration.

 

Yet for all of our reliance on the ocean, 95 percent of this realm remains unexplored, unseen by human eyes.

 

NOAA’s Office of Ocean Exploration and Research is leading efforts to explore the ocean by supporting expeditions to investigate and document unknown and poorly known areas of the ocean. These expeditions represent a bold and innovative approach by infusing teams of scientist-explorers with a "Lewis and Clark" spirit of discovery and equipping them with the latest exploration tools.

 

From mapping and describing the physical, biological, geological, chemical, and archaeological aspects of the ocean to understanding ocean dynamics, developing new technologies, and helping us all unlock the secrets of the ocean, NOAA is working to increase our understanding of the ocean realm".

 

Furthermore, here is provided an excellent link in favor of exploring the ocean.

 

Click this link

 

 

 

Yeah, what Nintii said too!! :whistling:

[HeyYou]

We have the technology NOW to actually do a fair bit of Ocean exploration. it is going to be decades, if not centuries, before we have the ability to even reach the limits of our solar system.

 

An ocean colony could easily be made self-sustaining, not so much a space colony. (be it on a space station, the moon, or mars...) Also, in the event of an emergency, an ocean colony could be evacuated, or, help could be there in a relatively short period of time. Again, not the case with a space-based colony. Not to mention, an ocean colony could be made to be economically self sustaining as well..... just put it someplace where it is relatively easy to drill for oil...... :D

[Sync182]

Space. It must be explored and cultivated if mankind is to survive as a species.

 

You can say "there's so much we haven't explored of our own oceans, yet!" as much as you want, but it all comes down to one thing: mankind is a voracious consumer of resources, and our little ball of rock only has so much.

So you propose we waste resources trying to land on mars to get... what exactly?

 

We are simply not ready to fully explore space. We can't even get a base on the moon.

 

I can imagine similar conversations and trains of thought occurring before they put man on the moon. Were they wrong to go?

 

What if Columbus never returned to the Free World?

 

What if Cook never sailed south of the equator?

 

What if Magellan never sailed around the bottom of South America?

 

What if...? What if...? What if...?

 

We're not ready because there are people who make a living out of (or at least a lot of noise about) holding us back. Would you be one of them?

[Beriallord]

They claim we know more about the surface of Mars, and the Moon than we do about the deepest reaches of Earth's oceans. They just don't have the technology to explore the deepest reaches of the oceans yet. The pressures involved that deep in the ocean pose a very large challenge with current materials. Its easier to land a rover on Mars than to put one 30,000 feet deep in the ocean. Its possible some advances in the future in carbon nano-tubes will allow for making some composite materials that can withstand the massive amounts of pressure deep in the ocean. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_nanotube.

 

But for now, I would definitely say space is more interesting. At most we might discover a few thousand new species of life in the deepest parts of the ocean. But that would pale in comparison to finding one species of life on another planet. There is also the prospect of coming across new elements in the universe that could open up possibilities for things not possible with current known elements. It would be unlikely every element in the universe exists on Earth.

Edited February 16, 2012 by Beriallord

[marharth]

Space. It must be explored and cultivated if mankind is to survive as a species.

 

You can say "there's so much we haven't explored of our own oceans, yet!" as much as you want, but it all comes down to one thing: mankind is a voracious consumer of resources, and our little ball of rock only has so much.

So you propose we waste resources trying to land on mars to get... what exactly?

 

We are simply not ready to fully explore space. We can't even get a base on the moon.

 

I can imagine similar conversations and trains of thought occurring before they put man on the moon. Were they wrong to go?

 

What if Columbus never returned to the Free World?

 

What if Cook never sailed south of the equator?

 

What if Magellan never sailed around the bottom of South America?

 

What if...? What if...? What if...?

 

We're not ready because there are people who make a living out of (or at least a lot of noise about) holding us back. Would you be one of them?

A giant firecracker won't help us explore the universe.

 

We need to be reaching a better method to get us into space before anything else. As I said before, Columbus did not go to the new world in a log raft.

Edited February 16, 2012 by marharth

[Beriallord]

Also there is water on the moon, and it can be extracted from lunar soil.

 

http://science.nasa.gov/science-news/science-at-nasa/2009/07oct_microwave/

 

For there to ever be a moon base, there would have to be water mining facilities, because it would be impractical to ship water in from Earth, and also too expensive. Sewage could be filtered and purified back into water.