[RANT] Growing entitlement of the Modding Community?

[Hyperplexed]

I wasn't sure where this would fit, so I thought the Debates forum was a good place...

 

I really don't understand what's with this growing entitlement that seems to be trending amongst the modding community, being the last case the issues revolving around SKSE64, and this urge that many people feel to demand that mod authors keep providing updates to their mods, as if we modders owed anything at all! Quite frankly, while I missed the uglyness that was rampaging over the SKSE thread, when I was told about it, I can't say I was in the least surprised, since I too, have had to deal with it, about 2 years ago. My Skyrim mods always rely on SkyUI for the MCM alone, and while I would love to have SKSE64, and to be able to provide SSE updates, in no way do I feel that the SKSE Devs owe me or anyone, anything.

 

So what is it with people that feel like we modders have any obligation at all to provide you with updates to our mods?

 

What is it that people claim that we have a responsability to keep our mods updated and functional, or otherwise we should never have released them in the first place?

What is it with people that feel that just because we are providing something for free, our work should automatically fall under "public domain" and copyrights and intelectual property no longer hold any value?

 

It's just disturbing to say the least, and only helps modders to distance themselves from the community, and to be willing to further share anything they do... I started to mod because, what I was looking for, didn't existed... I started to mod more than 15 years ago, when the first Sims game came out, but only decided to start publishing with Skyrim, because I thought... "You know... I've been in their shoes, I've been looking for a mod like this, and was never able to find one, so, why not do a good thing, and share?"

 

Is that the goal of these people to alienate modders, so we actually stop publishing? I mod as a hobby (which quite frankly, due to the complexity of most mods I create, sometimes feel like a job), I mod because I have fun with it, but if publishing my work leads to these kinds of behaviour, and harassment, I start to think... Why do I keep doing it? I rather just mod for myself, and share it with people I trust.

 

Anyway... /rant over, feel free to discuss...

 

PS-Maybe I missed it, but quite frankly, I don't remember these kinds of shenanigans ever happening until recently... maybe because I've had it happen to me, I became more aware to these issues, who knows...

[Harbringe]

Pay it no mind , anything with social media makes any issue seem like a mountain. As far as SKSE goes you can more than make a fantastic Skyrim game as is. Thats not to say it wouldn't be nice if it was upgraded , but am I going to be worried or complain about it , not in the least. As is even if SKSE was upgraded it would likely be another year before you would be able to fully utilize the functionality that you can currently with the old SKSE and the old Skyrim. Simply because there is just so much stuff that has been developed along that line.

 

As far as I'm concerned got no reason to complain (as I dont mod) and whats been done by modders is way beyond any expectation I could of ever had. Sometimes its just outright mindblowing.

[PoorlyAged]

I will rise to defend one point that has been raised.

 

As a mod author, I have a responsibility for every mod I release. That responsibility includes the requirement that I fix or withdraw my mod if it is broken and that I update or withdraw my mod if the underlying game technologies change and my mod stops working.

 

However, am not required to "fix" a mod which has been labeled 'broken' simply because a user doesn't like some aspect of my mod. Buyers remorse does not make my mod broken.

[Aurielius]

As a mod author I mod primarily for myself, then for the community. I feel responsible to update the mod only if the game engine itself is updated and my work no longer functions as it should. However demands that I update something specifically for a particular user's aesthetic tastes fall on deaf ears. Polite requests are far more likely to engender a positive response..meaning I'll consider it, if it's a change that I would want in my own game and it's feasible.

[TexMex477]

I feel its a two way street.

 

Mod authors are not required to do anything they don't want to.

Users are not required to listen to mod authors.

The whole mod thing is suppose to be for fun...

 

If you feel you need money to mod you should be off getting a job.

If you feel you deserve quality mod you should be off buying a new game.

 

I think there is a lot that fuels this notion of modding being something it isn't.

Entitlement of mod authors and people using mod has been pushed.

 

Some websites make this idea worse when they allow echo chambers in private without cleansing of other views.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Echo_chamber_%28media%29

[kvnchrist]

Entitlements are apart of our culture. Getting something for nothing has become the norm. I just wonder if those who have this mindset actual appreciate the work so many have done or even try to understand just what a person goes through to make many of these works of art.

 

For what it's worth, I appreciate the effo0rt.

[TexMex477]

Entitlements are apart of our culture. Getting something for nothing has become the norm. I just wonder if those who have this mindset actual appreciate the work so many have done or even try to understand just what a person goes through to make many of these works of art.

 

For what it's worth, I appreciate the effo0rt.

 

Yes cause there is nothing wrong with 3$ horse armor right?

 

http://www.pcgamer.com/the-fallout-4-creation-club-goes-live-with-3-horse-armor/

 

http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/horse-armor

 

To quote a comments from pc gamer comments section at least the clean ones I can.

 

"At least then we'll be able to sort out the sellout modders from the actual good ones."

 

"Wow, it's like I fell into an alternate Universe sometime in early 2016, and I still haven't escaped, Horse Armor, of all things, are they irony impaired, or am I just living in a crazy new upside down reality."

Edited August 29, 2017 by TexMex477

[Rabbit1251]

Text deleted by authour.

 

 

The Rabbit

[Beriallord]

The new Skyrim doesn't run any better than the original, even on a modern PC. The simple solution is to just play the original game, modded, if you want SKSE. With mods, you can make the original game look just as good.

Edited August 31, 2017 by Beriallord

[vixsyn]

The new Skyrim doesn't run any better than the original, even on a modern PC. The simple solution is to just play the original game, modded, if you want SKSE. With mods, you can make the original game look just as good.

There's a good chance I've been doing it wrong, but I can't really bring myself to agree with this. The new Skyrim, for me at least, has been decidedly less inclined to crash when modded than the old one. Now, a CTD will annoy me but I'll still think "hey, that's weird!" rather than "oh God, not again!"

 

The culture of modding seems to be changing. A few years ago, during the original paid mods debacle, many content creators absolutely refused to take part and any who did take part were largely ridiculed. Some of those same authors are now part of the Creation Club - which, to be fair, is a different beast, but still in the same vein.

 

I've noticed that many content creators seem less willing to engage with their audience - they lock down comments or just don't post, don't update etc. Now of course it's their mod and their time and they're perfectly "entitled" to manage it however they please. However, and this is especially the case with mods that become very popular, it's not completely unreasonable to anticipate some backlash from leaving a project abandoned having previously stated that you are supporting it. When hundreds of users have integrated a mod into their game and a change or patch causes issues of course they'll be upset that the mod they've come to love or has become a core part of their game is no longer working or has problems. In the case of these mods I've often felt that the way we handle "copyright" should be reviewed, giving a broader scope for picking up abandoned projects, or at least some way of making a "legacy" mod that does the same thing as the original but can be supported by a new and active author.

 

I'm not suggesting that an original work, and its creators intellectual copyright, should be circumvented or ignored completely, but with all appropriate credit given why is it such a big issue if someone makes a "redux" or "unofficial continuation" of something that has been left buggy/inoperative for some time? The work is an inspiration, and perhaps encorporating some of the original work just saves time and resources which could otherwise be spent on fixing or improving the mod. To be more specific, I'm not talking about, say, original works of art being copied, but things like fixing a seam in a body mod or tidying up some crash causing code.

 

That being said, some end users are obnoxious and rude. Perhaps it's the sort of mods I use but I can't say I ever really see people "demanding" things from modders - questions, suggestions, requests for changes sure, but not "DO IT NAO!!!"

 

I also find the word entitlement is overused and is starting to become bland and meaningless. It's slapped around in places it doesn't belong and that distorts the meaning. If we were talking about "growing rudeness to content creators" then I'd understand clearly what the issue was. Does anyone really think modders are "obliged" to provide their mods? That seems... well, illogical to say the least. Wanting a mod to function so it does not cause issues (and I mean issues that the author hasn't made clear - if an author has a "known issues" section so people are forewarned, that's great) is not really entitlement. I guess part of the problem is that people "DON'T READ THE DAMNED DESCRIPTION" let alone the sticky(ies). A lot of problems can be avoided by paying attention to the instructions (how true of most things in life, right? )

 

Of course, seeing a mod with 40+ unanswered bug reports can be off putting too. Just ticking them as "known issue" or "not a bug" would offer some reassurance to users that an author is still active. Or even stating "no longer in development" officially would be polite. That's part of the issue isn't it? Manners. If someone is thinking about using a mod in their game - and we all know what removing mods from your game can do to it! - then knowing they're not going to receive support before the fact is a lot better than running into a problem, asking for help and being ignored.