If Germany had won the first world war.

[kvnchrist]

I've often wondered what the world would have been like if Kaiser Wilhelm would have won the first world war. Would the world be a safer place, or would we have developed Atomic energy into a bomb, or would it have been a scientific breakthrough with an international ban on weaponizing it. Would Israel even exist? Would superpowers even exist and would Russia have become a communist country?

[thumbincubation]

The Chartreuse Baron would be flying a Fokker DR6000-C into battle, in the ionosphere.

[WastelandAssassin]

the amount of videos you can find on the subject , you would have hours of material to watch

and alternate history is something that many people are interested in

 

the problem I have with the question , it doesn't state how the timeline change , just the outcome

does Germany win because America never joined WWI? Is this because unrestricted submarine warfare actually managed to knock Britain out of the war rather early on?

with the sheer amount of events leading to the eventual defeat of Germany , it really does depend on what exactly happen

 

as for the specific questions , I'll give you my thoughts , though they are just that

I would suppose that without the events of WWII , the idea of Israel , although suggested , wouldn't get the world wide attention as it did . thus I would suppose that there would be no Israel in such a scenario

as for Russia , if you consider the fact that communism occurred there well before the end of the war , and with the whole inner turmoil of the country , I would suppose Russia would still be a communist state (assuming Germany never conquered it , which is rather unlikely anyhow , as history has repeatedly shown)

on the subject of superpowers , that truly depends on the whole circumstances of how the war turned out . perhaps the USA never joined the war , and instead lent the money for the new losing parties , and thus still became the financial giant that it is today . perhaps with no WWII , these countries would actually be weaker (at least compared to other countries) , so that there are no superpowers , and instead you just have a bunch of very strong countries , with proper finances and a decent peace keeping military

again , really depends on how you change the timeline , but this is obviously all hypothetical , with so many different possibilities , you can't possibly know

 

but do share your thoughts , if you have any

and see what you can find on Youtube , though from what I've seen , most videos fail to explain how they change the timeline , just stating that now Germany won , rather than what was changed to cause this outcome

but maybe that's just what you are looking for , only you can really tell

[kvnchrist]

The Chartreuse Baron would be flying a Fokker DR6000-C into battle, in the ionosphere.

Seeing the present situation in North Korea, I would think a sea change like Germany winning the first world war would be fairly profound, since I hardly think Nazi Germany would have even existed and the Manhattan project would have had, in my opinion no reason to exist. Thank you for your input just the same.

[kvnchrist]

the amount of videos you can find on the subject , you would have hours of material to watch

and alternate history is something that many people are interested in

 

the problem I have with the question , it doesn't state how the timeline change , just the outcome

does Germany win because America never joined WWI? Is this because unrestricted submarine warfare actually managed to knock Britain out of the war rather early on?

with the sheer amount of events leading to the eventual defeat of Germany , it really does depend on what exactly happen

 

as for the specific questions , I'll give you my thoughts , though they are just that

I would suppose that without the events of WWII , the idea of Israel , although suggested , wouldn't get the world wide attention as it did . thus I would suppose that there would be no Israel in such a scenario

as for Russia , if you consider the fact that communism occurred there well before the end of the war , and with the whole inner turmoil of the country , I would suppose Russia would still be a communist state (assuming Germany never conquered it , which is rather unlikely anyhow , as history has repeatedly shown)

on the subject of superpowers , that truly depends on the whole circumstances of how the war turned out . perhaps the USA never joined the war , and instead lent the money for the new losing parties , and thus still became the financial giant that it is today . perhaps with no WWII , these countries would actually be weaker (at least compared to other countries) , so that there are no superpowers , and instead you just have a bunch of very strong countries , with proper finances and a decent peace keeping military

again , really depends on how you change the timeline , but this is obviously all hypothetical , with so many different possibilities , you can't possibly know

 

but do share your thoughts , if you have any

and see what you can find on Youtube , though from what I've seen , most videos fail to explain how they change the timeline , just stating that now Germany won , rather than what was changed to cause this outcome

but maybe that's just what you are looking for , only you can really tell

I'm really not interested in how the victory would have come about. I would suggest that maybe if the original plan was implemented and the German Armies mad it to Paris, before the English came in and knocked France out of the war. Then turning West towards Russia, would there have been any need to allow Lenin safe passage through Germany in that train heading into Russia. I mean the German politicians should have known would would happen id the bolsheviks took charge of a country that large. Would England still have entered the war after France was knocked out and if not the Lusitania would surly not have been torpedoed.

 

The reason I brought this up is because I thik what happened during WWI pretty much set the world up for WWII and that set us all up for what is going on today. Sorry, I'm trying to find and alternate really than one where two loadmouths are shacking their fists at each other across the expanse of the UN assembly room and both of them are holding nukes in those hands. What a mad, mad, mad world we live in. My friend.

[WastelandAssassin]

 

the amount of videos you can find on the subject , you would have hours of material to watch

and alternate history is something that many people are interested in

 

the problem I have with the question , it doesn't state how the timeline change , just the outcome

does Germany win because America never joined WWI? Is this because unrestricted submarine warfare actually managed to knock Britain out of the war rather early on?

with the sheer amount of events leading to the eventual defeat of Germany , it really does depend on what exactly happen

 

as for the specific questions , I'll give you my thoughts , though they are just that

I would suppose that without the events of WWII , the idea of Israel , although suggested , wouldn't get the world wide attention as it did . thus I would suppose that there would be no Israel in such a scenario

as for Russia , if you consider the fact that communism occurred there well before the end of the war , and with the whole inner turmoil of the country , I would suppose Russia would still be a communist state (assuming Germany never conquered it , which is rather unlikely anyhow , as history has repeatedly shown)

on the subject of superpowers , that truly depends on the whole circumstances of how the war turned out . perhaps the USA never joined the war , and instead lent the money for the new losing parties , and thus still became the financial giant that it is today . perhaps with no WWII , these countries would actually be weaker (at least compared to other countries) , so that there are no superpowers , and instead you just have a bunch of very strong countries , with proper finances and a decent peace keeping military

again , really depends on how you change the timeline , but this is obviously all hypothetical , with so many different possibilities , you can't possibly know

 

but do share your thoughts , if you have any

and see what you can find on Youtube , though from what I've seen , most videos fail to explain how they change the timeline , just stating that now Germany won , rather than what was changed to cause this outcome

but maybe that's just what you are looking for , only you can really tell

I'm really not interested in how the victory would have come about. I would suggest that maybe if the original plan was implemented and the German Armies mad it to Paris, before the English came in and knocked France out of the war. Then turning West towards Russia, would there have been any need to allow Lenin safe passage through Germany in that train heading into Russia. I mean the German politicians should have known would would happen id the bolsheviks took charge of a country that large. Would England still have entered the war after France was knocked out and if not the Lusitania would surly not have been torpedoed.

 

The reason I brought this up is because I thik what happened during WWI pretty much set the world up for WWII and that set us all up for what is going on today. Sorry, I'm trying to find and alternate really than one where two loadmouths are shacking their fists at each other across the expanse of the UN assembly room and both of them are holding nukes in those hands. What a mad, mad, mad world we live in. My friend.

 

 

I wholeheartedly agree with you on the fact that the results of WWI directly led the world towards WWII , and some of the effects of that war are still felt today (mainly the threat of atomic weapons , as clearly seen with North Korea and Iran)

and I do understand just how you feel about the state of affairs today , we do indeed live in a messy world , in a rather horrible state

 

I haven't actually considered a situation where the German schlieffen plan was actually successful . it's usually regarded as something rather far fetched , though had it been successful , it may have led to a vastly different world , though it's really hard to tell how it would have turned out

this is especially hard with the rather strange motives of the warring nations of WWI , and the goals they've set up

would Germany truly stop after crushing France and stopping hostilities with Russia? if so , than perhaps the world could have seen much much less bloodshed over the past century

 

whatever the case , It's a rare discussion to see , and one I do enjoy

keep up some hope , maybe there still is some sanity in today's world , although it may not lie with the major leaders of today

[RGMage2]

If Germany wins WW1 then Hitler probably serves out his time in the army and then fades away as old soldiers do, never rising to a position of prominence. No WW2 and no NATO and no Warsaw Pact.

 

USA probably still rises to Superpower status, and Russia still goes communist. Slower technological advancement by both nations as so much came out of WW2. The two nations with their very different ideologically driven systems probably still become mortal enemies. Development of nuclear weapons hypothetically delayed by 70 years, and with no nukes dropped on Japan the world never comes to a true understanding of the catastrophic consequences of the use of these weapons, until heir eventual use in 2015 in an all out exchange between USA and Russia. And now we are living in nuclear winter or the Fallout world wasteland. Could of happened, we'll never know.

 

On the positive side of the ledger, maybe the parents of the Doctor who discovered a cure for cancer weren't killed in Dachau.

[TheMastersSon]

The two nations with their very different ideologically driven systems probably still become mortal enemies.

The simple truth is that the US and USSR fought together in WWII, and our supposed "mortal enemy" status was entirely fabricated after the war ended.

 

Also try watching the 1950's/60's Soviet's PSAs for civilian nuclear attack (ours were "Duck and Cover" etc) during this period and tell us they weren't produced by the same group of people. This supposed conflict was almost entirely a colluded effort, just as U.S. involvement in and support of WWI (and anti-German public sentiment) had to be fabricated literally from thin air, not only in our country but in most of the world. We have Britain to thank for that global catastrophe, but historians and everyone else noted how well the UK's propaganda campaign worked. In fact it's been used as a model for generating war from nothing ever since.

 

Here's another bottom line imo: the Pentagon's primary requirement is not to defend our country or our Constitution, it's to justify its own existence -- and this cannot be done without the perpetual existence of mortal enemies. It's been true from the "Red Menace" to flipping Islamic terrorists and Somalian war lords. Review the history and see how these boogeymen have appeared magically and out of thin air, just in time to accomodate Pentagon budgets for the last 70 years, and how every one of these claimed mortal threats to our existence disappeared just as instantly and magically -- when the Pentagon's money ran out. The Russian people learned the great lesson in 1992: it's all a scam to justify public teetsucking. Virtually all of it. The difference with the current fake war is that the Pentagon finally landed the Holy Grail of obscene spending: a perpetual war that is fundamentally unwinnable because the list of defined enemies changes on a daily and sometimes hourly basis. So welcome to bankruptcy and collapse, America, but don't fret. It's just natural selection and losing their federal government didn't kill anyone in Russia.

Edited September 24, 2017 by TheMastersSon

[Skagens]

One could wonder how France would have looked if Ludendorff's offensive on Paris had succeeded. Germany would probably have shaped all of France and considering Erich was influential and also one of the leaders of the german war efforts, a lot if not all of France would most likely be very militaristic. Either way, had Germany won the war and imposed peace on the allies, Germany would not have suffered the reparations imposed by the treaty of Versailles. And the treaty was without a doubt one of the leading causes to Hitler rising to power and initiating the devastating World War II. This in turn would have prevented the holocaust and a second war. It's likely a german victory would also have prevented the cold war. The question is, would history had repeated itself from the other side? Would Germany force the french to sign a treaty of their own, causing France's economy to collapse and give rise to fascism? Would we later on see a french Hitler?

 

Speculating about 'What if' is often very interesting no matter the topic. Europe would certainly have looked very differently under Wilhelm II's regime. Since America's involvement in the war would have been avoided with a german victory, would it still be the enforcer of international order as we see it today, or would Germany take it's place? Would Germany still invade the Soviet Union like they did in the second world war or would the Soviets invade Germany in fear of having such a powerful neighbor? Would Japan ever partner with Germany and would they ever initiate war with America? So many questions and one can only speculate on what the answers to these would be.

 

No one can say exactly how the world would look today had Germany won the first war. Would the world be a better place? If you take into account how it was like in Germany before the war, the world might've looked more repressed and grim than it does today. Before World War I, Germany was ruled by Wilhelm II. He was the son of the previous ruler, Frederick III. Wilhelm II was brash, ambitious and full of grand designs for building German prestige and expanding it's empire and foreign influence. He believed in force, and the 'survival of the fittest' in domestic as well as foreign politics. He was also not so much concerned with gaining specific objectives, as he was to asserting his will. With these qualities in mind, one could argue that he was not a good or wise ruler. Had Wilhelm II stayed in power after a german victory, World War II might not have been avoided after all, only delayed.

 

To answer one of your questions, I don't believe Israel would exist, at least not as it does today. Had the Holocaust never happened, Zionism might not have had the international moral force that it rightly claimed after Hitler's defeat, thus limiting it's influence. This is at least how I see it. Topics like these are very interesting to me and I look forward to reading your thoughts on the matter.

[kvnchrist]

One could wonder how France would have looked if Ludendorff's offensive on Paris had succeeded. Germany would probably have shaped all of France and considering Erich was influential and also one of the leaders of the german war efforts, a lot if not all of France would most likely be very militaristic. Either way, had Germany won the war and imposed peace on the allies, Germany would not have suffered the reparations imposed by the treaty of Versailles. And the treaty was without a doubt one of the leading causes to Hitler rising to power and initiating the devastating World War II. This in turn would have prevented the holocaust and a second war. It's likely a german victory would also have prevented the cold war. The question is, would history had repeated itself from the other side? Would Germany force the french to sign a treaty of their own, causing France's economy to collapse and give rise to fascism? Would we later on see a french Hitler?

 

Speculating about 'What if' is often very interesting no matter the topic. Europe would certainly have looked very differently under Wilhelm II's regime. Since America's involvement in the war would have been avoided with a german victory, would it still be the enforcer of international order as we see it today, or would Germany take it's place? Would Germany still invade the Soviet Union like they did in the second world war or would the Soviets invade Germany in fear of having such a powerful neighbor? Would Japan ever partner with Germany and would they ever initiate war with America? So many questions and one can only speculate on what the answers to these would be.

 

No one can say exactly how the world would look today had Germany won the first war. Would the world be a better place? If you take into account how it was like in Germany before the war, the world might've looked more repressed and grim than it does today. Before World War I, Germany was ruled by Wilhelm II. He was the son of the previous ruler, Frederick III. Wilhelm II was brash, ambitious and full of grand designs for building German prestige and expanding it's empire and foreign influence. He believed in force, and the 'survival of the fittest' in domestic as well as foreign politics. He was also not so much concerned with gaining specific objectives, as he was to asserting his will. With these qualities in mind, one could argue that he was not a good or wise ruler. Had Wilhelm II stayed in power after a german victory, World War II might not have been avoided after all, only delayed.

 

To answer one of your questions, I don't believe Israel would exist, at least not as it does today. Had the Holocaust never happened, Zionism might not have had the international moral force that it rightly claimed after Hitler's defeat, thus limiting it's influence. This is at least how I see it. Topics like these are very interesting to me and I look forward to reading your thoughts on the matter.

I thank you very much for the information of the Germany ruler. I was not aware of this. It makes me rethink my attitude on this. It's hard to believe that these European leaders were all related to each other, seeing how some were so eager to prove themselves to each other

 

I never thought about the rising of a French Hitler, I would supose that anyone, with the right mind could come up with a convincing argument of internal betrayl of country. It seems, all it takes is scarcity and those unwilling to keep things in perspective will convinces themselves of just about any diabolic conspiracy All we have to do is look at the Japanese interment camps of WWII to see that. . I would suggest though that Hitler was a highly apt charismatic political showman. Even at that, I don't think he could have rose to power and more than Donald Trump could have risen to power at any other time than they both did.

 

I would ask if you think that a European union of some sort would have come out in the 1920, since the German King was so overbearing and would that have become an economic powerhouse that would have rivaled America.

 

I would also like to hear about peoples thoughts about The Ottoman Empire. Would it have collapsed and if the Western powers could not have swooped in and organized the Middle East, would the West be even a shadow of what it is today without the cheep oil it extracted from the puppet states they created to serve their interests? Would there have ever been a need to them to look to terrorism as a way to have a voice in this world.?