Baffled! I Am Haunted By Invisible Objects At Internal Settlements

[KahvozeinsFang]

Ok maybe fix wasn't the right term lol. But I've tried to regenerate precombs and previs in an interior cell once, on the visibility tab, and the kit did nothing at all. It gave me a message that said "done" when I did precomb geometry under the world tab.

 

I don't know if I did them in the right order or anything. More testing may be required on my end.

 

I have a pretty decent GPU and the cell im working with is a vault 95 clone. Even without any optimization I'm still running 60FPS solid in there on high settings. I know not everyone has a setup like mine so I will be doing something for optimization.

 

Thanks for all your tutorials by the way, ive learned a lot from them!

[MissingMeshTV]

You need to run the generation commands in a specific order. AFAIK previs is generated based on the geometry of precombines, so those need to generated first. Doing previs first won’t work since the system has no precombined references to generate the previs data from.

 

For an interior cell you’ll want to first use World>PreCombine Geometry for Current Cell

 

When that finishes you can do the previs, for which there are two steps:

1. Visibility>Generate Visibility for Current Cell

 

2. Visibility>Generate Precombined Visibility for Current Cell

 

This is what I’ve been doing for interior cells. For exteriors, it's more or less the same process but the menu options you choose will depend on if you've edited multiple cells or not. But generally, when you get to rebuilding the previs you'll want to use the "for all Loaded Cells" options.

 

IIRC, Vault 95 is one of the cells that used both precombines and room bounds. But the room bounds with cells using both seem to be rather shoddily done and have been known to cause issues when precombines are disabled. I also seem to recall issues in Vault 81 regarding the room bounds there when precombines were disabled.

 

Glad you’ve found the videos helpful. I do have one that shows the process of generating precombines and previs, if you haven’t already seen it. It might help get you started. I regenerate for the Vault 75 clone used in Tales from the Commonwealth. That had ZERO optimization and was nearly unplayable in some spots. I also show doing an exterior, so you can see the slight variations of the options you use between interior and exterior.

 

I also highly recommend Trosski’s video on the same subject. His video covers much of the technical aspects that I don’t and he goes into some settlement specific info that might be of interest for your project. Good luck!

[kinggath]

Necroing this thread because I just ran into this issue while experimenting with interior settlements. It's definitely due to Roombounds, and I have a nice simple scripted solution to at least make the items appear after they are placed (the invisible while holding them before building them problem will remain)

Add another script to your custom workbench with this:

Event OnWorkshopObjectPlaced(ObjectReference akReference) 
    akReference.Disable(false) 
    akReference.Enable(false) 
EndEvent

Then, whenever the player builds anything in them, this will quickly disable/enable those items to get past the rendering issue.

[YouDoNotKnowMyName]

Ah yes .....

Optimization, the number one enemy of "at-runtime world editing".

[niston]

I've had this in some interior settlements.

Re-doing (rather than simply ripping out) the Roombounds/Portals properly got rid of the issue each and every time. I run without precombines, so proper roombounds/portals are essential for larger interiors.

[aurreth]

 

 

IIRC, Vault 95 is one of the cells that used both precombines and room bounds. But the room bounds with cells using both seem to be rather shoddily done and have been known to cause issues when precombines are disabled. I also seem to recall issues in Vault 81 regarding the room bounds there when precombines were disabled.

 

Vault 95 is a freakin' nightmare as far as geometry goes. No matter how much you regenerate precom/previs you always end up with issues. What has been suggested to me (haven't had a chance to try it yet):

 

1. Move all walls, floors, steps, etc. to a new layer.

2. Delete all the other layers.

3. Generate precom/vis/previs.

4. Undelete the previously deleted layers.

 

In theory that should divorce internal objects from the actual structural parts, keeping walls from going all white void when you delete a table. When I get back to messing with it I'm also going to try deleting room bounds and portals, see how that affects things.

[KahvozeinsFang]

The roombounds themselves are the issue. I have an interior settlement based off of vault 95 and all I did to get the object to appear was remove the roombounds. They don't play nice with the workshop scripts.

 

Additionally all you have to do is reload the cell and all objects will appear. The only real complaints I get with my clone vault is people want to scrap things that I didnt put into the scrap lists. Of the vault door gets stuck because they didn't read the description properly.

 

As for lower FPS in larger cells without roombounds, I only have a 4GB rx570 and suffer no FPS loss with the vault 95 clone I made.

[aurreth]

The roombounds themselves are the issue. I have an interior settlement based off of vault 95 and all I did to get the object to appear was remove the roombounds. They don't play nice with the workshop scripts.

 

Additionally all you have to do is reload the cell and all objects will appear. The only real complaints I get with my clone vault is people want to scrap things that I didnt put into the scrap lists. Of the vault door gets stuck because they didn't read the description properly.

 

As for lower FPS in larger cells without roombounds, I only have a 4GB rx570 and suffer no FPS loss with the vault 95 clone I made.

 

That would explain the trouble I'm having. I'll trash those, assuming I can decipher the naming scheme for them.

[niston]

I will reiterate once:

 

It's because vanilla roombounds are setup like s***. Beth gave zero f*#@s about doing them properly, because they gloss everything over with that shitty previs system they use.

The issue at hand is, any item/object that's not fully inside roombounds will not be rendered at all by the engine. And because the vanilla roombounds are setup like s***, you're getting weird invisible objects when previs is disabled.

 

If you rip out the roombounds instead of fixing them, large interior cells (like Vault 75) will get the texture smear bug. It'll be worse for people with potato computers, but build enough s*** in an interior cell and it'll eventually become a problem for everybody. Your options are to fix roombounds/portals or be like Bethesda and apply precombs/previs to the interior, which will completely hide the issue and let you get away with sloppy design.

[SKKmods]

I will reiterate once:

 

It's because vanilla roombounds are setup like s***. Beth gave zero f*#@s about doing them properly, because they gloss everything over with that shitty previs system they use.

 

Hey Niston I appreciate your research into roombounds and interior optimisation issues which has helped with a couple of my own products.

But, for balance consider that in commercial product development under time/cost/quality constraints, "good enough" is actually "good enough" for a product designed to run ~50 hours for the average customer and then be disposed of. That design philosophy is "build to last" (aka dummy proof) rather than "build to change".

The fact that bethesda enables us to modify their stuff at zero cost does not mean the product is a "build to change" fail, rather we need to understand the limitations of, and be creative with, the ingredients we are given (for free) to cook with. Frustration is an optional state :wink: