Donation Points system now live for mod authors on Nexus Mods

[Thandal]

The unique downloads start counting for donation points as of now? does previous downloads before to this count too?

"Yes" to the first question.

"No" to the second.

[Ashes2Asherz]

Where's the page with the ladders to see who is earning points?

[Ashes2Asherz]

In response to post #60519602. #60542232, #60553337, #60555852, #60573257, #60588362, #60659242 are all replies on the same post.

bilago wrote: I'm assuming this change isn't retroactive. My main mod has over 400,000 unique downloads, if only this existed then!

NMC wrote: If it was, I'd be planning my retirement :D
I don't like the word 'prospective', smells of hard work...

Kriemen wrote: I absolutely love hard work. I can just sit and watch it for hours... :D

NMC wrote: Haha, I enjoyed that!

But on a serious note, a concern of mine is the licensing for the photo reference I use in my texture mods- they typically indicate that they are only for use in non-profit, non-commercial personal projects. So I have a nagging concern that this may automatically preclude me from opting in, as this may breach those terms... although I'm not sure opting into this DP system and releasing work would or could ever be viewed as 'making a profit' or a 'commercial venture' as these are indirect voluntary donations, not direct payments... but that said, Nexus would provide payment in a way.... the more downloads, the greater the share, and some of it from their own funds....

So I wouldn't want to just take a chance and hope for the best without a second opinion. Having no legal knowledge to speak of, it's a point of uncertainty that would be good to have cleared up and at least give me the option, as those t&c's can be worrisome to the uninitiated and uninformed like myself... I do suspect it depends on the person/website applying those original terms on how strictly they are upheld and applied though, and I doubt anyone would be hunted down over the price of a sandwich, ethical considerations aside for the moment.

Kriemen wrote: Writing this whilst waiting for the first coffee of the day to kick in. Hope it makes sense. For me, the main considerations are...

Is opting into the DP system actually considered as commercial income? Is accepting a donation from a mod user considered as commercial income? To me they are quite similar. Except that some could consider the Nexus as being a commercial entity. If so, does that have any impact on things?

If the answer to any of the above is yes, then does any of this contravene the original Game usage agreements? I'm sure the Nexus team and their legal people have looked into all of that. Personally, I feel that that the odd small donation or “cashing in” a few DPs here and there does not constitute a commercial quantity.

These are permissions from a random mod.

“Asset use permission in mods/files that are being sold You are not allowed to use assets from this file in any mods/files that are being sold, for money, on Steam Workshop or other platforms”

“Asset use permission in mods/files that earn donation points You are allowed to earn Donation Points for your mods if they use my assets”

I read this as “DO NOT sell my hard work”, but “Earning a few DPs” my my hard work is quite OK. I feel the same about my work. So, one can infer from this that the DP system is not considered as commercial income. Admittedly, the DP permission has been enabled by default. Perhaps it should have been set to an “undecided” state and mod authors encouraged to review their permissions. But, that's already been discussed and is being looked into.

As for resource usage, that's another consideration. I'd encourage people to double check usage permissions for everything their mods use and also encourage fellow mod authors to review their own mod permissions. Keep in mind that some permissions may change as authors make a final decision. Permissions for my mods may do the same, depending on others resource permissions. (Managed to get the word permissions into this paragraph 6 times... :) )

Do the same for any external resources. I've got quite a few resources from other sites that I need to check up on. My resource library is over 1.5GB and growing. So that's a lot of mods yet to be checked. Will authors from other sites agree to their work earning us DPs? Are we all worrying about nothing? Who knows?

Personally, I'm rewarded enough just to see people enjoying my work, sharing their pics and giving feedback. It encourages me to try to become a better modder. Been modding since the early 80's and am still learning... (At least I don't have to do everything via a Hex Editor any more...) I've only opted in 2 mods that use vanilla resources. At this stage, I just don't feel right opting in any others. In the meantime, I'll just wait, watch and see how it all works out.

NMC wrote: You made some very good points, thanks for the new perspective and insight... and I too am likely to sit back and wait to see how things pan out all things considered. That's more pragmatism than pessimism, as I use too many external resources to take a risk. But the optimist in me would hope the following is true:
*The 'Donation' itself could be seen solely as reward for the 'hard work' the modder themselves applied in making the mod, and NOT payment for the content of that mod.
* So, the donation is simply an appreciation shown to the modder, who did not make it a mandatory financial agreement- ie., pay me or no mod.
* The modder used those assets with the mod itself viewed and considered as a personal project.
* And in making that mod, there was no certainty or expectation of gaining any financial return whatsoever, it was released as a personal project.
But all that said, I'm not sure I want to volunteer to be the first canary down the mine and so I'll err on the side of caution for now. As you said, I also find reward in positive feedback and the sense of achievement and self development in itself, or I would have quit long ago.
PS., I too was there in the 80's, tinkering with Z80 assembly language, and making homemade adventure games in Basic with a few graphics thrown in- (my first ever graphics!) It never really leaves you ;)

Kriemen wrote: I'm a bit like my cat. I too, tend to sit quietly and observe before pouncing. Hope it all works out well.

"tinkering with Z80 assembly language"
That would be an interesting topic for the forums, if it doesn't already exist. For me it was a TRS-80 running CP/M and extended color basic on a Zilog Z80 cpu. We could only dream of doing what we do now... :)

delete it or set it to hidden and release it as a new mod.. problem solved..

[steve40]

 

In response to post #60519602. #60542232, #60553337, #60555852, #60573257, #60588362, #60659242 are all replies on the same post.

 

 

 

bilago wrote: I'm assuming this change isn't retroactive. My main mod has over 400,000 unique downloads, if only this existed then!

NMC wrote: If it was, I'd be planning my retirement :D

I don't like the word 'prospective', smells of hard work...

Kriemen wrote: I absolutely love hard work. I can just sit and watch it for hours... :D

NMC wrote: Haha, I enjoyed that!

 

But on a serious note, a concern of mine is the licensing for the photo reference I use in my texture mods- they typically indicate that they are only for use in non-profit, non-commercial personal projects. So I have a nagging concern that this may automatically preclude me from opting in, as this may breach those terms... although I'm not sure opting into this DP system and releasing work would or could ever be viewed as 'making a profit' or a 'commercial venture' as these are indirect voluntary donations, not direct payments... but that said, Nexus would provide payment in a way.... the more downloads, the greater the share, and some of it from their own funds....

 

So I wouldn't want to just take a chance and hope for the best without a second opinion. Having no legal knowledge to speak of, it's a point of uncertainty that would be good to have cleared up and at least give me the option, as those t&c's can be worrisome to the uninitiated and uninformed like myself... I do suspect it depends on the person/website applying those original terms on how strictly they are upheld and applied though, and I doubt anyone would be hunted down over the price of a sandwich, ethical considerations aside for the moment.

Kriemen wrote: Writing this whilst waiting for the first coffee of the day to kick in. Hope it makes sense. For me, the main considerations are...

 

Is opting into the DP system actually considered as commercial income? Is accepting a donation from a mod user considered as commercial income? To me they are quite similar. Except that some could consider the Nexus as being a commercial entity. If so, does that have any impact on things?

 

If the answer to any of the above is yes, then does any of this contravene the original Game usage agreements? I'm sure the Nexus team and their legal people have looked into all of that. Personally, I feel that that the odd small donation or “cashing in” a few DPs here and there does not constitute a commercial quantity.

 

These are permissions from a random mod.

 

“Asset use permission in mods/files that are being sold You are not allowed to use assets from this file in any mods/files that are being sold, for money, on Steam Workshop or other platforms”

 

“Asset use permission in mods/files that earn donation points You are allowed to earn Donation Points for your mods if they use my assets”

 

I read this as “DO NOT sell my hard work”, but “Earning a few DPs” my my hard work is quite OK. I feel the same about my work. So, one can infer from this that the DP system is not considered as commercial income. Admittedly, the DP permission has been enabled by default. Perhaps it should have been set to an “undecided” state and mod authors encouraged to review their permissions. But, that's already been discussed and is being looked into.

 

As for resource usage, that's another consideration. I'd encourage people to double check usage permissions for everything their mods use and also encourage fellow mod authors to review their own mod permissions. Keep in mind that some permissions may change as authors make a final decision. Permissions for my mods may do the same, depending on others resource permissions. (Managed to get the word permissions into this paragraph 6 times... :smile: )

 

Do the same for any external resources. I've got quite a few resources from other sites that I need to check up on. My resource library is over 1.5GB and growing. So that's a lot of mods yet to be checked. Will authors from other sites agree to their work earning us DPs? Are we all worrying about nothing? Who knows?

 

Personally, I'm rewarded enough just to see people enjoying my work, sharing their pics and giving feedback. It encourages me to try to become a better modder. Been modding since the early 80's and am still learning... (At least I don't have to do everything via a Hex Editor any more...) I've only opted in 2 mods that use vanilla resources. At this stage, I just don't feel right opting in any others. In the meantime, I'll just wait, watch and see how it all works out.

NMC wrote: You made some very good points, thanks for the new perspective and insight... and I too am likely to sit back and wait to see how things pan out all things considered. That's more pragmatism than pessimism, as I use too many external resources to take a risk. But the optimist in me would hope the following is true:

*The 'Donation' itself could be seen solely as reward for the 'hard work' the modder themselves applied in making the mod, and NOT payment for the content of that mod.

* So, the donation is simply an appreciation shown to the modder, who did not make it a mandatory financial agreement- ie., pay me or no mod.

* The modder used those assets with the mod itself viewed and considered as a personal project.

* And in making that mod, there was no certainty or expectation of gaining any financial return whatsoever, it was released as a personal project.

But all that said, I'm not sure I want to volunteer to be the first canary down the mine and so I'll err on the side of caution for now. As you said, I also find reward in positive feedback and the sense of achievement and self development in itself, or I would have quit long ago.

PS., I too was there in the 80's, tinkering with Z80 assembly language, and making homemade adventure games in Basic with a few graphics thrown in- (my first ever graphics!) It never really leaves you :wink:

Kriemen wrote: I'm a bit like my cat. I too, tend to sit quietly and observe before pouncing. Hope it all works out well.

 

"tinkering with Z80 assembly language"

That would be an interesting topic for the forums, if it doesn't already exist. For me it was a TRS-80 running CP/M and extended color basic on a Zilog Z80 cpu. We could only dream of doing what we do now... :smile:

delete it or set it to hidden and release it as a new mod.. problem solved..

 

 

That would constitute abusing the system, and as has already been pointed out clearly in this thread, would be dealt with accordingly by admin.

[RickLaviolette]

I am in favor of such a donation program. However I personally would like to make annual donations once or twice per year. (I have an illness so I want the billing to end when I do.) Also the "like or dislike" system for mods is difficult for me. Not being a hacker, I seem to have trouble resolving mod conflicts or even understanding which conflicts are which. A no vote by me would be very unfair to any mod creator when it might simply be a fix unknown to me. I impulsively try mods without saving games correctly. A recommended, prepackaged and known compatible mod list would be a bible to wannabe mod users like me.

 

Can I donate annually toward this fund and donate separately to individuals whose mods I have used the most?

 

Here's what I want: $12 per month for an annual payment of $144/year. My most used, top 10 modder picks for a hit of $10 each annually. The Sum therefore would be $244 US annually. (Equivalent to approximately a $25 per month fee at an annual $250.)

 

Or, I could just send you $12/per month and figure out the individual patrons. Later.

 

 

[bearhiderug]

I am simply imaging a larger newer category at the bottom titled xxx. This would be the category with the largest amount of uploads and trying to make the biggest tit. The tightest girl spot. The perkiest nipple. All the while the kids download these until they cream in-game. Since they get money on x downloads and game porn is the new top mod type it seems sometimes. Sorry I am ashamed the modding community, not nexus but mods in general have become more(cant spell worth s#*! do not judge) centered around skimpy or nude things. Then again I am a stickler for lore and "word where your in the game wth its called". That being said I think the creation club was the starting point of monetizing mods. It will happen full scale, the world revolves around money. Modding simply being an unopened urn so to speak. However I am aware the time above average mods take to form. I think donating to mod authors is a great and wonderfull idea that more people should do. I do hope nexus can find that balance that large developers never would as it would benefit all partys involved. My thoughts drift quick and I can not spell half the damned time. Grammer nazis and etiquite wierdoe pounce

[piotrmil]

In response to post #60434912. #60435157, #60439167, #60487932, #60495767, #60568452, #60581147 are all replies on the same post.

JinKanzaki wrote: I wonder how many of the people complaining here have spent more than 10 bucks on mod donations in the past 10 years...

User_23213994 wrote: I don't donate and never will. Modding is a hobby and doesn't require money for compensation. Feedback is perfectly fine.

FLipdeezy wrote: Lol no offense but who made you the authority?

User_23213994 wrote: Okay, I'm going outside to the beach and making a sand castle every day. Why? because I like doing it. it's a hobby. If you don't throw cash at me, you are an inconsiderate individual because you can't understand how much effort, hard work and hours I've put into it just so people can look at it.

Pay me. Now.

MPDStudios wrote: Ikr

FLipdeezy wrote: That was incoherent and emotional

User_23213994 wrote: Emotional? I fail to see how it was emotional. Incoherent? No, you fail to see the picture.

>Modding is a hobby and doesn't require money for compensation.

As a very humble mod author, I completely agree. Edited August 26, 2018 by piotrmil

[piotrmil]

In response to post #60450772. #60469072, #60495697 are all replies on the same post.

CaedesAposis wrote:

So this is how modding finally dies and becomes monetized. With thunderous applause from its last bastion of freedom. Shame really.

dikr wrote: "User files: 0"

I shouldn't worry too much about that. Nexus will first and foremost be a free platform; free to download a metric ton of awesome user made content and free to share your own mods with others, that is. The donations come from the platform itself rather than directly from users (which few ever opt to do anyway), that's a notable difference compared to say, Creation Club. If anything, it's an added incentive for people to create and share mods and that's never a bad thing. As most of us modders are used to the fact that we don't earn anything with it and do it for fun and contribution anyhow.

MPDStudios wrote: I don't think it's the sort of monetization you're envisioning at the moment. Modders are not selling their mods, nor are they selling it to a distributor, i.e. giving the rights to their content to Nexus to sell as they like, but are being given a certain amount of money based on the popularity of their creations, which is a direct contributor to the popularity of the site.
I'm open to suggestion here, but I don't see how this limits freedom in terms of what can be popularized, uploaded, or created. Sure, it encourages creators to make larger, more refined mods/content in order to meet the requirements of the Donation Points system and generate some revenue, as big mods really don't make much off donations anyway, but it doesn't make small creations, niche mods, or simple fixes less important/harder to upload. It doesn't change the uploading/hosting system of Nexus at all, in reality.

So think of it less as Creation Club, in which users sell their mods, and more of say, youtube's monetization system, in which creators are paid by the site to have popular content.

I do fear the same thing, Cades. As soon as I learned about this program, I opted out of it. I do not want any form of financial compensation for my hobby.

Also, @dikr, number of files one has uploaded has nothing to do with this person's perfectly valid opinion.

[newman55]

Hi. What are the criteria for choosing the authors. I have 5000 unique downloads every month, but I haven't got any dp.

[Reneer]

Hi. What are the criteria for choosing the authors. I have 5000 unique downloads every month, but I haven't got any dp.

It's on a NET10-style system, so you only receive the DP that you earned from 3 months ago. So if you earned 5,000 DP in June, you'll get that DP in your Nexus DP wallet in September.

 

Edit: But more importantly, it doesn't look like you've signed up any of your mods for the donation points system.

 

I do fear the same thing, Cades. As soon as I learned about this program, I opted out of it. I do not want any form of financial compensation for my hobby.

 

Also, @dikr, number of files one has uploaded has nothing to do with this person's perfectly valid opinion.

Except no one has the authority, not you, not me, not Dark0ne, and not Todd Howard, to dictate what is and what is not "true" modding.

Edited August 28, 2018 by Reneer