Donation Points system now live for mod authors on Nexus Mods

[Dark0ne]

In response to post #72504348.

NMC wrote:

 

In response to post #60434912. #60435157, #60439167, #60487932, #60495767, #60568452, #60581147, #63075281, #64229301 are all replies on the same post.

JinKanzaki wrote: I wonder how many of the people complaining here have spent more than 10 bucks on mod donations in the past 10 years...

User_23213994 wrote: I don't donate and never will. Modding is a hobby and doesn't require money for compensation. Feedback is perfectly fine.

FLipdeezy wrote: Lol no offense but who made you the authority?

User_23213994 wrote: Okay, I'm going outside to the beach and making a sand castle every day. Why? because I like doing it. it's a hobby. If you don't throw cash at me, you are an inconsiderate individual because you can't understand how much effort, hard work and hours I've put into it just so people can look at it.

Pay me. Now.

MPDStudios wrote: Ikr

FLipdeezy wrote: That was incoherent and emotional

User_23213994 wrote: Emotional? I fail to see how it was emotional. Incoherent? No, you fail to see the picture.

piotrmil wrote: >Modding is a hobby and doesn't require money for compensation.

As a very humble mod author, I completely agree.

Corrodias wrote: Neither do individuals like any of you get to decide what, for other people, may be "required", but also having the option to give someone money doesn't somehow make it a requirement.

I know this is an old thread but someone has to define the difference between a hobby and releasing mods for other people to use.

If you're fixing up a car as a hobby, you're using your time and money to get new parts and installing them into the car, and making modifications to it. Once you're done, it benefits nobody except you. You have a sweet new ride and you're not going to let just anyone drive it.

Making mods is a hobby too, sure. You're spending your time making modifications to a game, or adding new content to it. But the moment you release it for others to use, it becomes work, and i'll explain why:

When making mods for yourself, you don't have to care about how it's presented and if there's any potential bugs. I've made a scroll enchanting mod for Skyrim that I install every time I play the game, but I never released it because it has a few minor bugs that I personally know how to work around while I play (but could take me weeks of work to research and find fixes for), and the mod requires you to understand the concept of scroll enchanting which for me would require adding these instructions in some form (lore books, loading screen tips, etc). So in the case of this mod, it has 100% been a hobby, and as a result you don't get to play it.

But the moment you decide to release a mod, it adds work to your hobby. You have to fix every bug, worry about compatibility with other mods, make sure people understand it, write descriptions, instructions, changelogs, and take screenshots and make videos to present it well on the mod website.
On top of that, you're signing up to act as life-time customer support by responding to questions and getting requests for changes or fixes, and performing updates to the mod in case the game has an update which breaks your mod. (or people will complain and call you a bad mod creator).

Just today I had a comment on a Garry's Mod map I made 7 years ago, claiming there was a bug. As a result, I had to install the game, launch it, and perform tests until I could determine there was no bug and that it was caused by another addon that the user had installed, and then write a response to the comment explaining why it wasn't a bug and what they could do to troubleshoot.
If I had not done all this, other people would see the comment made by the user, and assume there was a bug and that the author no longer cared.

As a final note, going back to the car hobby example:
The moment you start dedicating your time to fixing someone else's car, it becomes work.

 

@ Mornedil,

 

I agree. Just recently I had a comment regarding a 'bug' in one of my mods that is about 8 years old, and the poster remarked that ...'it was unlikely to be 'fixed' as development has ended'. I felt the arm-twist in that false remark so to avoid anyone believing their claim, I now felt obliged to address it. Turned out there was no error at all, but it required me to re-download 3 versions of my mod, install each version and test and view the files in Photoshop to prove this, then reply back with my findings. Took me about an hour or so to do this. No response back....

 

But I had to do all this, as the accusation was that I had released a broken file and that comment would maybe put people off downloading the mod. Or my 'work' is shoddy. So it is "work" maintaining a mod, and replying to questions often for years on end is work too. A lot of time is spent that you don't want to spend, but feel obliged as you have a little pride in your work, and to fullfil community expectations of you. A lot of mods are better maintained than the games themselves, bugs fixed, questions answered- unlike a lot of the broken releases we all actually paid for. Try and get a developer to fix a bug or reply and you'll know what I mean. So, to ask for a little appreciation for your efforts is not a lot to ask. For those saying they won't donate, hey that's fine, we don't ask for a payment for each download. But it would be great if we could. And it makes it a nice gesture when someone actually takes the time and trouble to send a donation to you. You feel like it was genuinely appreciated- and guess what? It actually encourages you to maybe release another mod when you feel appreciated. If it wasn't for modders, Nexus woudn't exist and nor would your bespoke games. You would be left with the default release, replete with bugs, faults and standard features. Maybe we deserve a little credit, appreciation and *gasp* 'reward'? At least to cover costs like software, electricity etc. Let's be clear- there is a world of difference between being paid to do something, and a donation. We don't demand to be 'paid', but we do appreciate receiving a 'donation'. It's voluntary. Using analogies like 'building sandcastles' insinuates that it's all just a childish pursuit and not to be appreciated. Fair enough, some people are just like that I suppose. But in real life you don't often get strangers walking over and complaining about your sandcastle, asking you to fix it, change it, build it bigger and better, or kicking it apart because they don't like it. Unless it really does have a personal value to them of course...

 

That said, I am not a fan of the pooled points donation approach at all. I saw no issue with the direct donation via paypal situation, as it felt personal to you, a direct thank-you for your efforts from someone who downloaded your mod and liked it. Why there is now a middle man between you and direct donations and a storefront to negotiate and to spend your tokens in, says more about what modding really means to those who really control it. Is it a hobby to them?

That said, I am not a fan of the pooled points donation approach at all. I saw no issue with the direct donation via paypal situation, as it felt personal to you, a direct thank-you for your efforts from someone who downloaded your mod and liked it. Why there is now a middle man between you and direct donations and a storefront to negotiate and to spend your tokens in, says more about what modding really means to those who really control it. Is it a hobby to them?

Could you clarify what you mean here, please?

There are still direct donations to authors, the two systems are completely separate. It's not a choice between one or the other - mod authors can choose to have no donations, direct donations but no DP, or direct donations AND DP (on top of whatever other donation platforms they use, such as Patreon, provided it remains without our ToS). The result is that the DP system provides a significant injection of donation money into mod author's pockets than was originally possible simply with direct donations - but direct donations still exist and are still used by users.

As such, there is not a "middle man between you and direct donations". There is a middle man between you and DP, because Nexus Mods is the majority contributor towards the DP pool, but DP and direct donations are two completely separate entities on the site that do not touch each other in any way. Edited August 12, 2019 by Dark0ne

[NMC]

 

In response to post #72504348.

 

 

 

NMC wrote:

@ Mornedil,

In response to post #60434912. #60435157, #60439167, #60487932, #60495767, #60568452, #60581147, #63075281, #64229301 are all replies on the same post.

 

 

 

FLipdeezy wrote: That was incoherent and emotionalMPDStudios wrote: IkrUser_23213994 wrote: Okay, I'm going outside to the beach and making a sand castle every day. Why? because I like doing it. it's a hobby. If you don't throw cash at me, you are an inconsiderate individual because you can't understand how much effort, hard work and hours I've put into it just so people can look at it.

 

Pay me. Now.FLipdeezy wrote: Lol no offense but who made you the authority? User_23213994 wrote: I don't donate and never will. Modding is a hobby and doesn't require money for compensation. Feedback is perfectly fine.JinKanzaki wrote: I wonder how many of the people complaining here have spent more than 10 bucks on mod donations in the past 10 years...

User_23213994 wrote: Emotional? I fail to see how it was emotional. Incoherent? No, you fail to see the picture.

piotrmil wrote: >Modding is a hobby and doesn't require money for compensation.

 

As a very humble mod author, I completely agree.

Corrodias wrote: Neither do individuals like any of you get to decide what, for other people, may be "required", but also having the option to give someone money doesn't somehow make it a requirement.

I know this is an old thread but someone has to define the difference between a hobby and releasing mods for other people to use.

 

If you're fixing up a car as a hobby, you're using your time and money to get new parts and installing them into the car, and making modifications to it. Once you're done, it benefits nobody except you. You have a sweet new ride and you're not going to let just anyone drive it.

 

Making mods is a hobby too, sure. You're spending your time making modifications to a game, or adding new content to it. But the moment you release it for others to use, it becomes work, and i'll explain why:

 

When making mods for yourself, you don't have to care about how it's presented and if there's any potential bugs. I've made a scroll enchanting mod for Skyrim that I install every time I play the game, but I never released it because it has a few minor bugs that I personally know how to work around while I play (but could take me weeks of work to research and find fixes for), and the mod requires you to understand the concept of scroll enchanting which for me would require adding these instructions in some form (lore books, loading screen tips, etc). So in the case of this mod, it has 100% been a hobby, and as a result you don't get to play it.

 

But the moment you decide to release a mod, it adds work to your hobby. You have to fix every bug, worry about compatibility with other mods, make sure people understand it, write descriptions, instructions, changelogs, and take screenshots and make videos to present it well on the mod website.

On top of that, you're signing up to act as life-time customer support by responding to questions and getting requests for changes or fixes, and performing updates to the mod in case the game has an update which breaks your mod. (or people will complain and call you a bad mod creator).

 

Just today I had a comment on a Garry's Mod map I made 7 years ago, claiming there was a bug. As a result, I had to install the game, launch it, and perform tests until I could determine there was no bug and that it was caused by another addon that the user had installed, and then write a response to the comment explaining why it wasn't a bug and what they could do to troubleshoot.

If I had not done all this, other people would see the comment made by the user, and assume there was a bug and that the author no longer cared.

 

As a final note, going back to the car hobby example:

The moment you start dedicating your time to fixing someone else's car, it becomes work.

I agree. Just recently I had a comment regarding a 'bug' in one of my mods that is about 8 years old, and the poster remarked that ...'it was unlikely to be 'fixed' as development has ended'. I felt the arm-twist in that false remark so to avoid anyone believing their claim, I now felt obliged to address it. Turned out there was no error at all, but it required me to re-download 3 versions of my mod, install each version and test and view the files in Photoshop to prove this, then reply back with my findings. Took me about an hour or so to do this. No response back....

But I had to do all this, as the accusation was that I had released a broken file and that comment would maybe put people off downloading the mod. Or my 'work' is shoddy. So it is "work" maintaining a mod, and replying to questions often for years on end is work too. A lot of time is spent that you don't want to spend, but feel obliged as you have a little pride in your work, and to fullfil community expectations of you. A lot of mods are better maintained than the games themselves, bugs fixed, questions answered- unlike a lot of the broken releases we all actually paid for. Try and get a developer to fix a bug or reply and you'll know what I mean. So, to ask for a little appreciation for your efforts is not a lot to ask. For those saying they won't donate, hey that's fine, we don't ask for a payment for each download. But it would be great if we could. And it makes it a nice gesture when someone actually takes the time and trouble to send a donation to you. You feel like it was genuinely appreciated- and guess what? It actually encourages you to maybe release another mod when you feel appreciated. If it wasn't for modders, Nexus woudn't exist and nor would your bespoke games. You would be left with the default release, replete with bugs, faults and standard features. Maybe we deserve a little credit, appreciation and *gasp* 'reward'? At least to cover costs like software, electricity etc. Let's be clear- there is a world of difference between being paid to do something, and a donation. We don't demand to be 'paid', but we do appreciate receiving a 'donation'. It's voluntary. Using analogies like 'building sandcastles' insinuates that it's all just a childish pursuit and not to be appreciated. Fair enough, some people are just like that I suppose. But in real life you don't often get strangers walking over and complaining about your sandcastle, asking you to fix it, change it, build it bigger and better, or kicking it apart because they don't like it. Unless it really does have a personal value to them of course...

That said, I am not a fan of the pooled points donation approach at all. I saw no issue with the direct donation via paypal situation, as it felt personal to you, a direct thank-you for your efforts from someone who downloaded your mod and liked it. Why there is now a middle man between you and direct donations and a storefront to negotiate and to spend your tokens in, says more about what modding really means to those who really control it. Is it a hobby to them?

That said, I am not a fan of the pooled points donation approach at all. I saw no issue with the direct donation via paypal situation, as it felt personal to you, a direct thank-you for your efforts from someone who downloaded your mod and liked it. Why there is now a middle man between you and direct donations and a storefront to negotiate and to spend your tokens in, says more about what modding really means to those who really control it. Is it a hobby to them?

Could you clarify what you mean here, please?

 

There are still direct donations to authors, the two systems are completely separate. It's not a choice between one or the other - mod authors can choose to have no donations, direct donations but no DP, or direct donations AND DP (on top of whatever other donation platforms they use, such as Patreon, provided it remains without our ToS). The result is that the DP system provides a significant injection of donation money into mod author's pockets than was originally possible simply with direct donations - but direct donations still exist and are still used by users.

 

As such, there is not a "middle man between you and direct donations". There is a middle man between you and DP, because Nexus Mods is the majority contributor towards the DP pool, but DP and direct donations are two completely separate entities on the site that do not touch each other in any way.

 

Ah, thanks for the clarification of the system, it seems I had completely misunderstood it. I was under the wrong impression that the direct donation system had been removed altogether in place of a pooled donation scheme. Somehow I got that stuck in my head during the early inception of the idea, and I heard a fair bit of speculation at that time from various sources and I decided to remove all donations from my mods back then. I did not see it's final implementation as it stands. I apologise for the wrong statement I made there.

 

It currently seems a lot better than I realised in that case, allowing tailoring to mod authors preferences. As I now understand it, it seems like an improvement even over the original donation system. I will read over the system in place fully again to see the options available.

 

For the record, I do recognise that is was Nexus who first created a donations scheme at all for modders to benefit from, so I appreciate the very fact it exists at all as I'm sure all modders here do too.

[tekmage]

NMC You really should be opted in. Even if it is to donate the points to charity.

[NMC]

NMC You really should be opted in. Even if it is to donate the points to charity.

Thanks Tekmage, I've altered a few settings on my pages today but to be honest I'm not 100% sure exactly what I've opted into yet :huh: - be it direct donations, donation points or memberships donations, or all three! I'll read the system properly later to get a fuller understanding of it all and tweak my settings accordingly then when I have more time. There may even be an option to pass a points on to other users- there's a few people who have helped out on my mod pages so it would be good to say thanks.

[Maidenfan724]

The opt-in page is reporting less unique downloads than are listed on my mod page. Is this an issue?

[Maidenfan724]

In response to post #78162568.

Maidenfan724 wrote: The opt-in page is reporting less unique downloads than are listed on my mod page. Is this an issue?

It would also appear that this is the metric the site used to determine that I am officially a mod author, as I only received official mod author status after reaching 1,000 unique downloads on that page, despite having been at over 1,000 unique downloads for a while according to the number on the mod page.

[steve40]

In response to post #78162568. #78239643 is also a reply to the same post.

Maidenfan724 wrote: The opt-in page is reporting less unique downloads than are listed on my mod page. Is this an issue?

Maidenfan724 wrote: It would also appear that this is the metric the site used to determine that I am officially a mod author, as I only received official mod author status after reaching 1,000 unique downloads on that page, despite having been at over 1,000 unique downloads for a while according to the number on the mod page.

It's your monthly unique download tally only, not your total tally.

[Maidenfan724]

In response to post #78162568. #78239643, #78253613 are all replies on the same post.

Maidenfan724 wrote: The opt-in page is reporting less unique downloads than are listed on my mod page. Is this an issue?

Maidenfan724 wrote: It would also appear that this is the metric the site used to determine that I am officially a mod author, as I only received official mod author status after reaching 1,000 unique downloads on that page, despite having been at over 1,000 unique downloads for a while according to the number on the mod page.

steve40 wrote: It's your monthly unique download tally only, not your total tally.

I am aware that it is unique downloads only. It has been less than half a month since I released the mod though.
Edit: I submitted a bug report and apparently it is a known issue, and a fix is in the pipeline. The amount used to determine donation points is still accurate according to staff. It just isn't displayed correctly on the opt-in page. The number displayed on the opt-in page doesn't account for downloads made via mod managers. Edited March 15, 2020 by Maidenfan724

[Smadol99]

hi, I have almost 30k dp pending and 0 in my wallet I don't know how to trasfer them, can anyone help me?