Donation Points system now live for mod authors on Nexus Mods

[LupusHegemonia]

I don't care too much for rewards, donations, etc.

Skyrim is my "heroin", I can't live a singe day without it (I even making textures during my vacations), so... it will be probably another way to see how impact our work has on the users.

[BigBizkit]

In response to post #60332276.

Lollia wrote:

I have a question: How do we divvy the points fairly amongst the creators whose assets we have utilized? Is there some sort of ratio of how many points are deemed proper for a mod author to request in return for some of their creations being used?

 

Example: A mod focused on new settlements with lively NPCs with active schedules and dialog might use some custom hair and eyes from a great many creators.

 

How does this work if, say, Hair Modder #1 requests 20 dp, Hair Modder #2 only wants 5 dp and Hair Modder #3 says they don't care for any points at all. And that's not even touching on the custom eye creators.

What happens if you think that Hair Modder #1 is being a bit exorbitant? Do you go to Hair Modder #1 and attempt to get them to lower their point price, in short, resort to haggling? And if you wish to be fair to Hair Modders #2 and #3, what then?

 

If such a scenario would take place, it would seem like the joy of mod creation is going to be sucked dry by all the back-and-forth between various mod authors trying to ensure that everyone gets a fair deal.

 

I think we need some ground rules on the point system. How much is too much? How much is too little? And what if a mod author thinks that their assets are worth more points than some other creator's whose assets are being used in the exact same manner? Will we need a Nexus court system?

There are two parts to this.

1. How many DPs you choose to distribute to authors whose work you are using (with permission, and permission to opt into the DP system) voluntarily is entirely up to you.

2. If Modder A grants you permission on the basis of, let's say, 10% of the DP your mod will generate, then, again, it is up to you to decide whether you want to meet that request, or, not use Modder A's assets because you do not agree with their conditions for permission.

It is really not any different from how it is now. If I gave you permission to use my assets in your mods but under the provision that you would have to put my name in big, bold letters in the mod name and file page, it would be up to you to either comply and use my assets on those grounds, or don't use them at all.

I understand what you are trying to say though and we will keep an eye out for these kinds of developments.

[Dark0ne]

In response to post #60307046. #60308276, #60308836 are all replies on the same post.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: So every 10k of DP is worth 10 dollars through paypal.. Be honest what's the chance of a modder getting 10k of DP? 1% maybe.. less than 1%?

Xander9009 wrote: The idea was never to make it so modders can rely on this as a source of income. It's just a small way of saying thank you. Also, there's the option to donate the money to charities, who will happily accept and appreciate even relatively small amounts. Also, they'll be worth more if the community actively puts into the system, too. (Well, they'll be worth the same amount, but you'll get more of them...)

Ashes2Asherz wrote: that's not what I asked but thanks for your answer

Based on the current opt-in figures, if this had been working in March (as an example, as we have full figures for that month right now), the top 1000 most popular mods would have earnt a minimum of $6.88 (per mod). Or rather, that's what the 1000th most popular file would have earnt, and anything more popular than that would have earnt more progressively up to the number 1 spot. To be in the top 1000 your file needed to have 2,772 or more Unique Downloads in that month.
Edited May 23, 2018 by Dark0ne

[mrjack900]

In response to post #60323101. #60323591, #60323716, #60325346, #60329741, #60332106, #60333001 are all replies on the same post.

mrjack900 wrote: So the onus is on mod authors (or in my case, former mod author) who have generously allowed their work to be used in other mods, to search the site to find out which ones have opted into the DP system and then report the mods making money from our work.

I wish I never gave open permission for my work with the caveats of credit given and no money made because the one time I had to report another modder for using my assets without credit, I was ignored repeatedly by Nexus staff and specifically your community manager. The whole ordeal was a nightmare for me and I ended up taking my mods off the Nexus because of it. Obviously 300 000 downloads is chump change to you guys.

And NOW I have to go looking for more modders making money off my art work and go through the whole stressful and ineffectual process again?

Will we even be able to see if a mod author has opted the mod into the DP system or will it be up to us to contact every author? Because that worked out so well for me last time... Jesus.

axonis wrote: I think I have found a better solution than deleting my mods. A year ago I've started developing (and switching my mods) under this license:

You are free to include this work, modified or not, in your work as long as you offer others the same freedom by including this paragraph in your work’s license without any modifications or restrictions.

That means anyone can use my mod to profit, but they'll also need to allow everyone else the same freedom. This will keep all gold diggers away because gold diggers don't want to allow anyone else access to their gold ;)

On the other hand, I have no problem with the Nexus giving money to some authors, especially those who are in really dire financial straights.

Lordkabal26 wrote: Hopefully Nexus realizes that they may need to introduce a percentage split option for mods that make use of other mods.

Besides if you yourself don't want to earn money, you can choose instead to donate the DP to three charities that are listed on the store page.

Zaldiir wrote: Such a split option is already present.

SirSalami wrote: @mrjack900. I'm unsure why you feel this way as there was discussion and administration based on our previous conversation. I'll be PMing you soon in case you wish to discuss. Thanks.

dikr wrote: So how's that tumblr page and the 21 likes working for you?
I prefer an open & free, dedicated platform like the Nexus where I get to download tons of mods for free and get a ton of exposure on my own which I mainly upload to contribute to the community, while not worrying too much about missing out on appropriate "credit" here and there or a couple of cents lost through 'stolen' DP.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: there ain't nobody going to make money from your assets.. or anyone's assets.. there would only be a few people that receive money from this and those that support this DP system have Stockholm syndrome. The Nexus has always been about parlor modders and this donation system is only going to cause more fighting within the community.. But I guess the Nexus believes in divide and conquer so they can keep all the control for themselves and own financial gains. .

@dikr - I don't even think I have 21 likes on a single tumblr post and I don't give a sh-t. If you think I was looking to become Internet "famous" through modding, you don't know me at all. I started sharing because I wanted to give back. I'm still doing that. So what exactly is your damage? Actually don't answer. I don't care. Edited May 23, 2018 by mrjack900

[mrjack900]

In response to post #60323101. #60323591, #60323716, #60325346, #60329741, #60332106, #60333001, #60340401 are all replies on the same post.

mrjack900 wrote: So the onus is on mod authors (or in my case, former mod author) who have generously allowed their work to be used in other mods, to search the site to find out which ones have opted into the DP system and then report the mods making money from our work.

I wish I never gave open permission for my work with the caveats of credit given and no money made because the one time I had to report another modder for using my assets without credit, I was ignored repeatedly by Nexus staff and specifically your community manager. The whole ordeal was a nightmare for me and I ended up taking my mods off the Nexus because of it. Obviously 300 000 downloads is chump change to you guys.

And NOW I have to go looking for more modders making money off my art work and go through the whole stressful and ineffectual process again?

Will we even be able to see if a mod author has opted the mod into the DP system or will it be up to us to contact every author? Because that worked out so well for me last time... Jesus.

axonis wrote: I think I have found a better solution than deleting my mods. A year ago I've started developing (and switching my mods) under this license:

You are free to include this work, modified or not, in your work as long as you offer others the same freedom by including this paragraph in your work’s license without any modifications or restrictions.

That means anyone can use my mod to profit, but they'll also need to allow everyone else the same freedom. This will keep all gold diggers away because gold diggers don't want to allow anyone else access to their gold ;)

On the other hand, I have no problem with the Nexus giving money to some authors, especially those who are in really dire financial straights.

Lordkabal26 wrote: Hopefully Nexus realizes that they may need to introduce a percentage split option for mods that make use of other mods.

Besides if you yourself don't want to earn money, you can choose instead to donate the DP to three charities that are listed on the store page.

Zaldiir wrote: Such a split option is already present.

SirSalami wrote: @mrjack900. I'm unsure why you feel this way as there was discussion and administration based on our previous conversation. I'll be PMing you soon in case you wish to discuss. Thanks.

dikr wrote: So how's that tumblr page and the 21 likes working for you?
I prefer an open & free, dedicated platform like the Nexus where I get to download tons of mods for free and get a ton of exposure on my own which I mainly upload to contribute to the community, while not worrying too much about missing out on appropriate "credit" here and there or a couple of cents lost through 'stolen' DP.

Ashes2Asherz wrote: there ain't nobody going to make money from your assets.. or anyone's assets.. there would only be a few people that receive money from this and those that support this DP system have Stockholm syndrome. The Nexus has always been about parlor modders and this donation system is only going to cause more fighting within the community.. But I guess the Nexus believes in divide and conquer so they can keep all the control for themselves and own financial gains. .

mrjack900 wrote: @dikr - I don't even think I have 21 likes on a single tumblr post and I don't give a sh-t. If you think I was looking to become Internet "famous" through modding, you don't know me at all. I started sharing because I wanted to give back. I'm still doing that. So what exactly is your damage? Actually don't answer. I don't care.

@SirSalami - I'm not going to discuss everything here in the open forum but I'm also not going to leave it at "there was discussion and administration" as if your ignoring my PMs for weeks or months at a time didn't happen.

[nerdofprey]

I saw this today and thought "oh, that's nice" and set all my stuff to opt-in. I've made some relatively popular mods and I thought hey, maybe between all of them this could pay for a premium subscription to the site...

 

Then I thought about it a bit and... some of my best and most well-liked mods borrow little elements here and there from other modders who have kindly given permission. I certainly wouldn't see this arrangement as "profiting off of someone else's work," - not when I take into account the tremendous amount of work I have personally put into my mods, and the insignificant "profit" I might see - but there very well might be somebody out there who DOES see it that way, absolutely flips their fricken lid, and starts causing huge problems for me. I don't really need the money that bad, and I don't need that kind of drama in my life. I've been turning off donations on my mod pages for a while, and I'll go ahead and turn this off too.

 

Really nice idea. It's just a shame about... people.

[steve40]

 

In response to post #60332276.

 

 

 

Lollia wrote:

I have a question: How do we divvy the points fairly amongst the creators whose assets we have utilized? Is there some sort of ratio of how many points are deemed proper for a mod author to request in return for some of their creations being used?

Example: A mod focused on new settlements with lively NPCs with active schedules and dialog might use some custom hair and eyes from a great many creators.

How does this work if, say, Hair Modder #1 requests 20 dp, Hair Modder #2 only wants 5 dp and Hair Modder #3 says they don't care for any points at all. And that's not even touching on the custom eye creators.

What happens if you think that Hair Modder #1 is being a bit exorbitant? Do you go to Hair Modder #1 and attempt to get them to lower their point price, in short, resort to haggling? And if you wish to be fair to Hair Modders #2 and #3, what then?

If such a scenario would take place, it would seem like the joy of mod creation is going to be sucked dry by all the back-and-forth between various mod authors trying to ensure that everyone gets a fair deal.

I think we need some ground rules on the point system. How much is too much? How much is too little? And what if a mod author thinks that their assets are worth more points than some other creator's whose assets are being used in the exact same manner? Will we need a Nexus court system?

There are two parts to this.

 

1. How many DPs you choose to distribute to authors whose work you are using (with permission, and permission to opt into the DP system) voluntarily is entirely up to you.

 

2. If Modder A grants you permission on the basis of, let's say, 10% of the DP your mod will generate, then, again, it is up to you to decide whether you want to meet that request, or, not use Modder A's assets because you do not agree with their conditions for permission.

 

It is really not any different from how it is now. If I gave you permission to use my assets in your mods but under the provision that you would have to put my name in big, bold letters in the mod name and file page, it would be up to you to either comply and use my assets on those grounds, or don't use them at all.

 

I understand what you are trying to say though and we will keep an eye out for these kinds of developments.

 

 

Asking for a specific percentage of DP for using your work doesn't really make sense. What if you have permission from 20 modders to use their assets as long as you give each of them 10% of all DP earned? It can all add up to more than 100% :smile: My approach is to share DP equally with any mod co-authors who want to participate. The actual percentage will vary, of course, depending on the number of participants.

Edited May 24, 2018 by steve40

[nerdofprey]

In response to post #60345712.

nerdofprey wrote: I saw this today and thought "oh, that's nice" and set all my stuff to opt-in. I've made some relatively popular mods and I thought hey, maybe between all of them this could pay for a premium subscription to the site...

Then I thought about it a bit and... some of my best and most well-liked mods borrow little elements here and there from other modders who have kindly given permission. I certainly wouldn't see this arrangement as "profiting off of someone else's work," - not when I take into account the tremendous amount of work I have personally put into my mods, and the insignificant "profit" I might see - but there very well might be somebody out there who DOES see it that way, absolutely flips their fricken lid, and starts causing huge problems for me. I don't really need the money that bad, and I don't need that kind of drama in my life. I've been turning off donations on my mod pages for a while, and I'll go ahead and turn this off too.

Really nice idea. It's just a shame about... people.

Modders are like, "sure you can borrow my bike... but I better not catch you working a f___ing paper route!" Edited May 24, 2018 by nerdofprey

[steve40]

I saw this today and thought "oh, that's nice" and set all my stuff to opt-in. I've made some relatively popular mods and I thought hey, maybe between all of them this could pay for a premium subscription to the site...

 

Then I thought about it a bit and... some of my best and most well-liked mods borrow little elements here and there from other modders who have kindly given permission. I certainly wouldn't see this arrangement as "profiting off of someone else's work," - not when I take into account the tremendous amount of work I have personally put into my mods, and the insignificant "profit" I might see - but there very well might be somebody out there who DOES see it that way, absolutely flips their fricken lid, and starts causing huge problems for me. I don't really need the money that bad, and I don't need that kind of drama in my life. I've been turning off donations on my mod pages for a while, and I'll go ahead and turn this off too.

 

Really nice idea. It's just a shame about... people.

 

Why not simply share your DP equally with all active contributors rather than not opt-in at all? No need to over-complicate things.

[steve40]

My opinion on others "profiting from my art work" through Donation Points:

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have 126 mod pages, don't feel like updating the permissions on all of them.

Here's mine, it shares quite a few similarities: