An independent New Vegas mod.

[Mktavish]

 

My addon to umatts is about placing structures next to the cars after parking ... to simulate a retail market place and other things. That the player can control inputs ... which then the AI gives back render based on that. Sort of a Sims thing :geek: which a lot of it's functionality and render is still very much in flux till I get to the testing phase.

Can you give/describe a specific example, I think it would help me to envision what your proposing.

 

For example the pickup truck. Once parked , the player can enable a flea market , repair shop , barbecue ...etc . As a module set left or right of the vehicle . About the size of this object "RCStando1" (offset on the x axis by 324 looks good) which I probably will use that object quite a bit , adding various other small objects to it , for the different kind of commerce. And after some game play , other addon modules will come available. Starting with 1 module per vehicle up to 8 for the largest vehicles maybe ?

And npc's start coming around running sandbox packages interacting with furniture/idle markers.

Not really much to it other than making money / buying more cars and addon modules.

 

Part of the reason I brought up the wagons is partially because of the convoy topic, but also because I'd like to give the option for greater commerce in NV, and varied pack animals, wagaons and vehicles would add some visual spice to new, unique vendors.

 

I guess I better clarify this about his mod. It's not available to chop up and use assets of his for integration into another mod. And mine will just be an addon that uses his as a base . Albeit my concepts can be applied to a few places in your mod , I'll get to explaining later.

Any player can add his mod to their load order , which is very universally usable from what I can see.

Thereby , they could then add my market place also ... atleast in theory till I get to the test phase.

 

My thought is if the player is particularly friendly to merchants and really courts vendors we could have some unique npcs. Say a sort of medicine/witch doctor that has some honest hearts stuff, poultices/herbs/poisions, totems/medicine pouch etc. Well maybe that's not a good example (as a vendor), but graphically it'd be fun to make.

Maybe a beast master that sells pets (aka animal companions). Some bizarre or frivilous vendors like brahimin cheese and ice cream. Just things to really add some interesting npcs to the street. And vendors can be quest givers, even if the quest is just "collect 100 of X".

Tech prospectors selling their wares can be great info for undiscovered pre war caches.

 

I'd be curious to know what types of vendors or wares peeps might be interested in.

 

Well following your idea stated on page one ... about setting up the basic concept to be downloadable.

Which then we continue to flesh out and add content. For the commerce portion ... I would say setting it up in a terminal for player input ... changing variables in a quest(s) that keeps track of what happens behind the scenes , would be the way to go for starters. (hence the concept from my market place addon)

But later then trying to put it into a council room render with leaders through dialogue. At least that's what comes to mind from what ElrazielMoon suggested.

 

The render of trade routes in the game for the player to see on screen , could just be added later as need be with some trickery , that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the math behind the scenes.

Also eventually I think rail lines would be pretty easy to render. Since we could keep their movement on a straight line. But anyways , the grand scheme of it is all we need focus on at the moment , then look into the details of minutia for render later imo. Plus working on a detail like that at this juncture , may prove to be a waste of time down the road ?

 

 

This is what I am most interested in trying to achieve . Think StarCraft , the single player campaigns.

But wouldn't move along as fast , and the player can interject as a hero type unit on the ground.

Where as commanding/building units is the main functionality.

I think a very talented scripter with a lot of time could probably pull something like that off. It would be challenging because what your describing has aspects of FO4's game mechanics of base building, but we don't have the same tools that FO4 has (like I'm pretty sure we don't have anything similar to snap nodes).

I'm not the aforementioned talented scripter, or even a basic level scripter, so my resource management is more along the line of enabling/disabling various assets via dialoge or quest results. I think what your describing is a much, much, grander scale.

 

Nope my idea for it , isn't much different than what you stated , at least the buildings portion.

Although I think Fo4's feature of building things , was inspired by the "Real Time Settler" mod.

That uses the "Feng shui" mechanics , or something similar. So it is possible in this engine to simulate what they are doing in Fo4"

But no I don't think the player needs that kind of input capability for true sandbox playability.

Just pre build the base ... and enable it through player choices ... which the sandbox render will be through what & how many combat units , then upgrades for them. Although the concept of bringing structures in and orienting them around something the player placed (like defensive positions) could be done. Which is what I am doing with the cars/market place.

 

The opposing force controlled by AI will also be pre built then enabled as the battle goes on. Some of it dependent on what the player does.

 

Once the first battle arena is set up , a lot of it can act as a template for future skirmishes .... but I want to base their premise and starting points according to your story. So for starters , figure out where the first battle of this type will be ... then I'll start building the small world cells ... unless we can find some good spaces in the WastelandNV to do it ? Assuming you would like to go this route for feature additions ?

 

[devinpatterson]

Any player can add his mod to their load order , which is very universally usable from what I can see.

Thereby , they could then add my market place also ... atleast in theory till I get to the test phase.

 

That seems like a really gray area, especially if you reference any asset in his mod in geck....your mod now has a dependency. Have you tried just PM'ing for permission. That's the way I'd definitely go before putting any time in.

If you don't get an answer I'd definitely check with a moderator for clarification.

 

Nope my idea for it , isn't much different than what you stated , at least the buildings portion.

On a related(ish) subject, a mini game could present some fun tactical eye candy. Mostly this would just deal with scale and symbolic representation, to make a simplified holo game. Use one of those big round enclave lighted tables with the graphs with securitrons and legion actors scaled down to 1/100th their size (with the holo shader). Simple button scripts on the securitrons so you can click on them to tell them to attack (sub menu, who to attack), defend, move (which square), etc. Have them immobilized and play out attacks via script functions (like useWeapon) so it's turn based. It would be a real time representation of data coming down the sucuritrons wireless network, where each scuritron/legion actor could represent a squad, or a battalion for larger battles.

 

Realistically it's probably beyond my scripting abilities, but at least it's something in the realm of possibility for my skill set.

 

 

[Mktavish]

You mean something in the XML ? Ya that's out of my scripting realm too .

But could actually build a scale model for the player in game to view.

Could be an interesting feature ... if really needed ?

 

But like I said ... start with the grand scheme simplified ... go from there ???

 

Sorry if the discussion using umatts cars derailed stuff. Thought I clarified not to use it after saying the commerce decision scale didn't make sense.

I was just trying to answer your specific questions about it.

[devinpatterson]

You mean something in the XML ? Ya that's out of my scripting realm too .

I don't think any xml would be needed, standard functions, maybe some nvse functions.

 

Now for remote controlling a a securitron on the battlefield (1st or 3rd person) "through" it's own "eyes", xml gui/hud changes would be useful (aka fo4s power armor gui/hud). Little bit of shades of the Mechanist's and your robot army.

 

But could actually build a scale model for the player in game to view.

I don't think you'd need any new models, just scaling them down to a few inches and applying the holo shader should do the trick.

 

Could be an interesting feature ... if really needed ?

I wouldn't say it's in any way necessary, mostly just a mini game and some shiny eye candy. But if you have a technomancer type player that would rather direct your robot army from afar, rather than join in the fray it could be an optional way to complete the quest.

 

But like I said ... start with the grand scheme simplified ... go from there ???

This thread is also kind brainstorming/blue sky thinking for the whole subject. If your asking or wondering, (practically speaking) what is going to be implemented in the immediate future, then I'd say it's as per my posts a day or two ago; control and interactions of the securitrons in teh strip/lucky 38 via dialog options and new packages.

 

Sorry if the discussion using umatts cars derailed stuff. Thought I clarified not to use it after saying the commerce decision scale didn't make sense.

I was just trying to answer your specific questions about it.

Yeah I was curious, and not a problem if you don't want to discuss it or feel it's out of place in the thread.

[Mktavish]

Good points all ... but the big picture from here to solidify. Otherwise it will just disapear into minutia detail ideas with no way to know where to start. A common problem in all modding .

[Mktavish]

But like I said ... start with the grand scheme simplified ... go from there ???

 

This thread is also kind brainstorming/blue sky thinking for the whole subject. If your asking or wondering, (practically speaking) what is going to be implemented in the immediate future, then I'd say it's as per my posts a day or two ago; control and interactions of the securitrons in teh strip/lucky 38 via dialog options and new packages.

So like you said with that suite addition ... the player starts there ... then just for starters a terminal inside the suite. To apprise the player of stuff , and they can make decisions ... a virtual world ... inside the terminal / inside the game.

The council room with npc dialogue going on ... could have all sorts of interesting stuff.

Player instigates an assassination , or heads it off ... through dialogue choices ???

The political intrigue of course going on ... but some small potatoes render happening there.

IDk ... but not done untill the story on larger scale is decided.

Need it written down ... in a text document I guess. So we can consistently follow it.

[Mktavish]

Ah wait I think I see your dilemma.

How to transition the end of the vanilla game to yours ?

 

Find the ending spot you want ... and place an activator to reset the player for your starting position. Player walks up clicks and bamm ... they have started your mod.

Which I say transport them to the suite with a terminal for making decisions.

A council room with npc dialogue / conversations would be good too.

I think yall can think it together ... ill just be waitin for after that ... and we go from there.

 

Who would first attack after that ? Or who would the player first attack ?

[Mktavish]

Should we get a modding room ... so the community doesn't have to listen to us?

[Mktavish]

Keep your end game saves pristine ... so we can see what the variables are set at with console commands.

[devinpatterson]

So like you said with that suite addition ... the player starts there ... then just for starters a terminal inside the suite. To apprise the player of stuff , and they can make decisions ... a virtual world ... inside the terminal / inside the game.

You can use a new terminal, but if we're talking the presidential suite it does have one setup already. If you talking about the penthouse suite then I prefer to do those kind of interactions through Yesman on the big screen terminal. I like the idea of players interacting with Yesman, it seems more immersive than a list of options, but I can understand that it could be slower to access one's commands.

You probably could have Yesman on the terminal in the presidential suite too if the player prefers that level of immersion. I think I can do texture swap to get his happy mug on screen.

 

Probably what would be best is to have an option to switch back and forth between the two (yesman & terminal). I suspect that most players will initially want Yesman on the terminal for managing options, but over time they will want to switch to the standard terminal interface (ie Robco UOS) because it's quicker. When you've heard Yesman's dialog 10s or 100s of times for an option, most players will end up want to bypass it.

It's no problem to switch from a talking activator to terminal and vice versa. I mean twice as much work, but no problem to implement in game.

 

 

Need it written down ... in a text document I guess. So we can consistently follow it.

I can gather and distill pertinent info. It's been a long time, so I'll have to browse through the thread....which make take a while. I can write something up and I can also put some spoiler headings in the first page of the thread for a more organized layout/outline.

 

For the independent NV thread, there are some important points to the foundation/framework I just wanted to touch on. I have proposed variations in this thread on the indpendent NV ending that allow for a 1. Completely independent NV, 2. Independent NV with alliance with a major faction (NCR), 3. Independent NV with alliance with a minor faction (BOS)

 

1. There is the wholly independent NV, this takes a page from the official house ending, just swapping house with the player. The Legion are removed from the arena. The NCR military vacate the dam, McCarran, the strip etc. The NCR will also have to pay for both water and juice from Hoover.

 

2. The NCR friendly variation continues to honor the treaty of New Vegas brokered between House and the NCR (much like leaders can change, but policies and treaties between nations remain in force). Legion are removed from the arena. Re: the NCR, the working relationship continues as it has prior to the end game (joint jurisdiction of the strip, no mega fortunes of caps coming in from Hoover etc). This could probably be broken up to address specific points with speech/intimidation/barter skills to micro manage some aspects via renegotiation of the treaty (ie, no ncr active duty military on the strip, or Hoover etc), or alternately the treaty could continue in effect exactly as it has in the past, word for word.

 

3. This is a BOS friendly variation, wherein the player allies with the Mojave brotherhood of steel. I have a more comprehensive thread here, with greater detail. Legion are removed from the arena, NCR are treated as in the wholly independent NV #1 above (The NCR military vacate the dam, McCarran, the strip etc. The NCR will also have to pay for both water and juice from Hoover). With an alliance of technological powerhouses in the area, the synergy of science could be a powerful bulwark against hostile outside forces.

 

I think those three options all have legs for the campaign. #1 is simple to implement in lore and has cannon behind it (just co-opt the house lore). #2 allows a much more granular approach to an independent NV, allowing the player the most options to tweak/achieve. #3 Is an interesting twist that brings back a newish/different BOS to power after a long decline and has a lot of potential quests and adventures arising naturally from teh story line (see the thread).