An independent New Vegas mod.

[devinpatterson]

Legion version of this mod

Hi PleaseHelpMeWithThis, thanks for contributing, I/we appreciate it.

 

You find an alien device as a side quest (Play wild wasteland theme) that can teleport you back in time/sending you to a alternative universe.....Please tell me what you guys think. (Horrible fanfiction lol?)

I'm afraid something like that would involve changing a *lot* of quest/script/glob vars and would be a real mess, especially since I need them to track what a player has done. So from a logistics POV resetting the Mojave isn't something that would be very practical for us.

 

Honest Hearts DLC: Needs to be modified to be able to help the White Legs (Get quest from Vulpes, go with Happy Trails, they die, the white legs recognize you, talk with Salt-Upon-Wounds/his second in command, get quests to help WL to wipe out Joshua/Daniel/Dead Horses/Sorrows. After doing this, talking to Vulpes, he will say that after Hoover Dam Caesar will reward the player for his/her service (See idea above).

.

While that's an interesting idea, and should have been in teh mod from the beginning I'm a little hesitant to commit to something like that. Our philosophy in the mod has been to implement consequences/evolution of past choices, not to go back into the past to add/change content itself. Lets consider it a possibility, but put it on the back burner as it sounds like it might make a better mod on it's own.

 

Dead Money DLC: WotansGlory made this excellent mod which lets you play after siding with Elijah, id like to expand on this concept.

It's possible since the author has given permission to use it, and I already can see several ways to fix some of the problems he was having. But we also need to weigh the amount of work vs how many would benefit from that ending. I suspect very few players went in that direction. So while I woudln't rule it out completely I think it would have a very small payoff for a fair amount of work (because it would alter the Mojave significantly).

 

Also about the post-hoover legion victory mod that you are currently making, imo i think you should scrap that version. Make the House/NCR/Independent version. Then maybe a legion mod in a new world space, then expand on the dlcs.

The Legion mod isn't my favorite, in fact it's a distant fourth to all the other mods, but I'm examining it because of requests to implement it. And even if it was done, it wouldn't be like the other three. It would be sans any quests, a fast hack job on top of the base mod that would simply remove most of the pop and add legion to many areas.

[devinpatterson]

Also the mod makers themself said that they would rather make a new world space for post legion ending than alter Mojave, so thats why i requested a new world space.

I wanted to clear up a point, Devilman1975 *is* a developer of the mod. He's been with us from very early discussions in the thread and has been instrumental in re: to research and ideas.

 

In addition, yes I would rather make a new worldspace rather than sinking a huge amount of time into the legion ending and trashing the Mojave. *If* those were my only two choices, but thankfully they aren't. If I go with a Legion ending it will be the jury rigging on top of the base mod that I described in my post above.

 

1: Alien technology, what lore is there to say this is "breaking" anything? It is a "Deus ex machina"

Every new mod will have new lore, but the challenge (and hte payoff) is telling that story within a framework consistent with lore, or as close as you can while still keeping your plot line. You don't want to go with the argument of saying "prove that lore precludes idea X" because you could make the same argument for any idea no matter how outlandish. Borg, star wars, cybernetic dinosaurs, supernatural creatures etc. Nothing says they can't exist (ie proving a negative) but I don't think many people will consider them consistent with lore.

 

In addition you *don't* want Deus ex machina. It's usually a complete cop out, where hte author has written himself into a corner and just sort of dumps the whole plot line for an easy way out of a problem.

[devinpatterson]

The NCR has a law that bans all prostitution.

Interesting. I can definitely see involuntary proposition where hte girls are forced by someone else to turn tricks being banned. I'm a little surprised voluntary position is banned as well, for some young (and not so young) ladies that may be the only way they can earn a living. SgtKraigO could you link me to where you read that, I want to see if they give any additional info. Was it an end slide?

 

In the NCR ending Dazzle

All of the personalities and where they settle sound good to me. Actually I don't really remember most of them, just a bit from the Garrets quest. But yeah all of that sounds like the way to go, I'll put them on the to do list.

 

For the Ind ending the player could be approached by Yes Man about prostitution and asked if they would like to get rid of it (Good Karma), keep it (neutral), or strip them of their rights (Bad).

Yep that sounds good as well, although I wonder if teh good karma one should allow prostitution, but on the prostitutes terms, just like say Las Vegas of our world.

[devinpatterson]

Cut content says that the training simulators in hidden valley are to training them against enclave forces, which leads to the question will we be able to repopulate areas that are cleared? (hidden valley, goodsprings, the prison, etc.)

Sure, repopulating areas (and how each would differ with the three outcomes) is pretty much what we're discussing here, big part of the mod.

We now officially have permission to use the "Ulysses Companion Mod" (http://newvegas.nexusmods.com/mods/48600/?) by Cirosan along with any other of his mods if we wish to integrate them into this mod and expand upon them in any way.

Good deal, every bit of work we can leverage from other authors saves us time.

[Devilman1975]

 

I wanted to clear up a point, Devilman1975 *is* a developer of the mod. He's been with us from very early discussions in the thread and has been instrumental in re: to research and ideas.

 

I wasn't even aware that I was part of the development team, but it is an honor and thank you. I'll try not to let you guys down. :smile:

 

That being said I've got some more ideas to throw in but don't worry it won't be long as my Honest Hearts post. I know that the Independence NCR war choice would be the least likely option for players to follow but I thought it could use some more meat. If Hardin becomes the Brotherhood elder then I figured that it may be possible to have the Brotherhood as an ally in the war against the NCR. HELIOS One will be back in their control as depicted in one of the endings and the Van Graffs should be removed from the game considering that Hardin's first act as elder is to order the player to kill them in the main game.

 

An alliance with Hardin should have some significant consequences for the player later on such as Hardin demanding access to Hoover Dam. The player can choose to accept Hardin's request which would see an increased Brotherhood presence at Hoover Dam or refuse him which would turn the Brotherhood against the player. If McNamara remains as Elder and a ceasefire was arranged with the NCR then I can see him wishing to remain neutral in the war against NCR.

 

Still on the subject of the Brotherhood I envisioned a possible scenario for the NCR and other Independent versions. If McNamara is still in charge then I can imagine an envoy from Lost Hills visiting the Mojave chapter and demanding to know why the Mojave chapter agreed to a ceasefire with the NCR, not retaken HELIOS One and made no efforts to claim Hoover Dam. The player can choose to convince the envoy that working with Vegas can help the Brotherhood in achieving their goals and the ceasefire with the NCR would put the Mojave chapter in a good position in any possible peace talks. Another scenario would be Hardin trying to create a schism in the Brotherhood similar to Lyon's chapter and the Outcasts. Not wanting to lose more members I can imagine McNamara being convinced by the player that Hardin has to be removed. And to be completely honest I would relish the opportunity to take out Hardin. :ninja:

 

Finally my thoughts on the Dead Money dlc. While I think you've got a great storyline in regards to Christine and Veronica, I would also appreciate the opportunity for a restoration of the Sierra Madre. There is a mod on the Nexus that removes the toxic cloud and adds some gamblers http://newvegas.nexusmods.com/mods/40585//? , my only complaint with it is that the non hostile ghost people makes it look a little silly.

 

Considering that most of the tech and the cloud was developed at Big MT I can see it being tied in with Old World Blues and maybe order the Think Tank to develop a way to remove the cloud. The Ghost People will have to be removed and the security holograms will need to be disabled as the first step of the restoration effort which can be done through a quest. Securing Nelson and Camp Forlorn Hope will also be important since access to the Sierra Madre is through the abandoned Brotherhood bunker.

[Devilman1975]

Re: Prostitution

 

I had a look at the NCR entry on the Fallout wiki and true enough prostitution is considered illegal in the NCR. However saying that the NCR military police seemed to turn a blind eye whenever off duty troops visited Gommorah. Banning prostitution may not be well received by a number of soldiers, civilians and probably some NCR senators and pastors similar to Jimmy Swaggart. With Kimball being a former soldier I think that he may decide to make an exception for Vegas.

 

As for the Independent version, I don't think banning prostitution would be considered a good karma choice since it would most likely force it underground. This would probably leave the ladies in a disease ridden environment (sewers) and at the mercy of various cutthroats. This is why I believe letting Cachino and Joanne take over Gommorah would be in the prostitutes best interests.

[devinpatterson]

So really we have a couple of questions, 1 being is this something we want to do and 2. being how we go about it.

 

Why not a nifty Viewmaster-esque VR headset, that, when equipped before you sleep, takes you to the VR session upon wake up?

I think it would be much more lore friendly if we wen't with the standard VR pods. The VR's are not simple tech, they take a full fledged super computer to run them. Remember tranquility lane? That's a relatively small simulation but some massive hardware to pull it off. If you use a little headset you end up minimizing that technological marvel.

 

...Then, if we wish to expand upon that, you could use various compatible holodisks that you could pop in which take you to a new sim(miniquest) that will buff a certain skill up with a perk

Yes different scenarios can be loaded up, just like Braun did (he had a tropical paradise and a ski resort before tranquility lane).

 

Much better than using a cheat console mod, and more lore friendly, as well as more balanced.

Unless I'v misunderstood what your trying to convey, I don't think that would be more balanced. We have a perk being gained every two levels, adding them more often is more likely to *unbalance* the game.

 

The Brotherhood collects information and knowledge, but why? So they can toss 100 caps to a soda chugging vault dweller for a book on how to properly trim one's beard? This would give reason/immersion to perks, unique quest experiences, explain more why the Brotherhood collects knowledge and build upon the vr concept, all while being lore friendly.

I'm not sure I'm following you. The BOS has a quasi religious worship of tech, it's a big part of the reason they seek it out, but also because they believe high tech is dangerous in a wastelanders hands. And of course we know that technoliical knowledge can aid them in everything from the simplest chemistry to the most advanced weaponry. I'm not too sure how that would tie into the argument your making for the reason of acquiring directly relating to VR.

 

a cowboy defending his homestead from marauding bandits (explosives or weapons skills) (and I'd definitely throw my hat in to voice any of those), (reference to the cowboy from Zeta?)

​a kung fu/samurai themed vr for those martial combat lovers

A Star Trek themed Mothership Zeta throwback where the aliens attack the crew and captain that shows up in the wastes on billboards (can't remember his name for the life of me) for energy

Yep VR can be fun because it allows the possibility for a great many environments. But that being said we should still keep lore in mind. Programs developed both pre and post war would still abide by the fallout world. So historical programs like a cowboy and samurai are things FO inhabitants would have knowledge off, but for a star trek theme, they may or may not (or it might be an alternate version of star trek)

 

We also have to keep in mind that these are probably very advanced programs (if the the FO3 example is taken), something akin to a big video game release of our time. Currently we have budgets in the 10's of millions and dev teams of 20 to over a 100. So it's more likely that the pre war programs are going to be dealing with war examples funded by the DOD, like operation anchorage. Post war programs might be hard to justify, since we don't know how much of the BOS's resources would be used to program something like that, when they could (before the lockdown) just take initiates out in the real world for training. They might have put a lot more effort into it after the lockdown or none at all.

 

 

 

These would all be very minuscule areas (think a tiny version of Tranquility Lane). No larger than a room or two. The sessions would also be restricted to first person play (no need to change the PC right?) Sort of like the Dreamstride quest in Skyrim.

I probably woudln't restrict it to first person play per se, since making your player appear to be a specific individual isn't really the tough part. Its more of all the detail work. Stripping all items, including some perks, while in the sim, and making sure to restore them all when you exit is most of the work.

 

 

To tie into the various endings Legion/NCR would like to learn how to wear Power Armor, Legate/Commander sends you on a quest. For House, he already has a boner for tech,so any reason really. And for independent, the militia would need better armored guards.

You do have to strip the Legion from the above scenarios. They are very serious about not relying on technology and no legion member wears functional power armor (although they may wear pieces of it as a trophy/badge of honor).

 

For the House ending it is possible to kill them, it's not a requirement that you blow them up so some armor can be gained that way, but House isn't particularly interested in them per se. They can't be used by his securitron army and he doesn't field a standing human army (why would you when you have a completely loyal, very tough division of bots to do your bidding). So those suits would probably just go to the courier.

 

For the Ind, sure a militia or what have you is certainly a possibility.

Edited August 18, 2013 by devinpatterson

[kingwilfre16]

On the star trek equivalent http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Captain_Cosmos can be our answer, but don't forget jangles

[sgtKraigO]

 

The NCR has a law that bans all prostitution.

Interesting. I can definitely see involuntary proposition where hte girls are forced by someone else to turn tricks being banned. I'm a little surprised voluntary position is banned as well, for some young (and not so young) ladies that may be the only way they can earn a living. SgtKraigO could you link me to where you read that, I want to see if they give any additional info. Was it an end slide?

 

 

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/New_California_Republic

Second paragraph in the Society topic

 

Re: Prostitution

 

I had a look at the NCR entry on the Fallout wiki and true enough prostitution is considered illegal in the NCR. However saying that the NCR military police seemed to turn a blind eye whenever off duty troops visited Gommorah. Banning prostitution may not be well received by a number of soldiers, civilians and probably some NCR senators and pastors similar to Jimmy Swaggart. With Kimball being a former soldier I think that he may decide to make an exception for Vegas.

 

I believe this is because the strip isn't apart of the NCR at the time so they can't control their troops who are on R&R as well as if they were in NCR territory.

 

 

Also http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Fallout_2_endings 4th ending under New Reno. I think it would be interesting if you were approached by a member of the Omerta's asking if you would like too support them in trying to legalize prostitution, if you say no he will then try to bribe you, if you decline the bribe the Omertas will try to legalize it without your support. If you support them prostitution will be legalized in a year, without your support it will remain illegal

 

This would allow the player to become more involved with the politics in the NCR.

[sgtKraigO]

Going back too the Vertibirds are a limited resource in the NCR, have some engineers, troopers on guard duty, 1-2 scientist, and 2-3 trucks at the crashed Vertibird site. Maybe even have the robots protecting it disabled beside one of the trucks with the NCR logo painted on them, if asked one of the engineers will say a few will probably go to Hoover Dam, Helios One, Hidden Valley (If the NCR takes over this place please give it a better name, like Camp India, Charlie, Quebec, or something), Camp Callville, Camp Cottonwood, or other bases around the Mojave, while the salvaged Vertibird parts will go to maintain their fleet of Vertibirds.

Edited August 18, 2013 by sgtKraigO