LE Reposition axes & hammers right side up on the back

[Mookeylama]

Trying different rotation values and ingame testing.

 

yeah that's how i was rotating the bone. just trying different values and looking ingame. but how did you actually Move the bone? like it looks like you moved it to the lower left. do those same values (Translation, Euler) actually move the bone too? if so which ones?

 

and i succeeded in making a 2nd bone that mounts the other 2 hander correctly, but drawing that weapon doesn't work right. i draw it and it stays on the back and doesn't appear in the hands. any ideas on that? thanks again so much!

[ghosu]

As i highlighted on the screenshot...translation = position, change this value to move the position (the translation of the NiNode with empty value line, not the weaponback NiNode that is stored within)

Regarding your bone duplication, there is one thing 'bout the explanation you got from this other guy that i'm not completely understanding.

 

This is how the game's system work:

 

A bone determines the position of armor/skin/weapons whatever on the character's body.

When you equip a weapon you don't pick up the weapon itself, in fact you pick up the weapon's bone - the weapon is attached to the bone so you swing the bone.

 

The animation system, as far as my actual understanding goes, works like this: There are animation files (.hkx) for all ingame actions. Lets take the animation for equipping a 2h weapon:

The animation data is using the WEAPONBACK value - so when you draw a weapon, the character picks up the WEAPONBACK bone - the original weapon is attached to the WEAPONBACK bone - therefor it works.

 

Lets say you use a skeleton.nif with the new positioned WEAPONBACK bone for the 2h axe and a duplicated bone for the 2h sword, lets name it WEAPONBACKSWORD.

In the 2h sword's .nif you can change the the bone from WEAPONBACK to WEAPONBACKSWORD - now it's positioned on the WEAPONBACKSWORD bone on the back.

 

When you now equip and draw an 2h axe, it will work properly since the 2h animation recognizes the WEAPONBACK bone (you just changed the position).

When you equip a 2h sword it will show up on the original position on the back (since we changed the sword's bone, it's on the WEAPONBACKSWORD position) BUT when you draw the weapon the original animation will tell the game to equip the WEAPONBACK bone. But this bone is empty, you equip and swing an empty bone - the sword stays on the back because it's WEAPONBACKSWORD bone, the animation don't know this bone.

 

And i see no quick/easy way to fix that - it might be possible to add this bone to the animation, so the character picks up both bones from your back -

though this is much more complicated and quite hard to explain. If i find a quick solution i will update, haven't thought 'bout it yet - this is just a rough statement to explain how the game's system works.

Edited January 16, 2013 by ghosu

[Mookeylama]

thank you again Ghosu! i'm talking w/ a few other people here and at other forums and yeah, that seems to be the exact consensus. that the 2nd bone needs to be recognized by the animation somehow. getting the 2nd bone added does sound like the best way. just a matter of how lol. Rocket over here mentions something...

http://forums.bethsoft.com/topic/1436253-req-reposition-axes-hammers-right-side-up-on-the-back/page__p__22066394#entry22066394

 

but i'm not sure if he's talking about getting a 2nd bone to work or not. damn shame! sooo close. i saw that you made some sweet Dwalin axes from The Hobbit, and i was dying to have them equipped the correct way like Dwalin does in the movie, axe heads upward. i'm using that DSPSOB mod and having 2 staffs / staves crossed on the back in that X fashion looks great, so i was getting an idea of how those Dwalin axes would look heh. but of course, i'd settle for just 1 axe or hammer w/ the head up.

 

i wonder if XP32 might have any ideas. he seems to know a lot about skeletons AND animation

[Kalten1979]

If you have all tools to create new skeleton.nifs and animations like in Oblivion and Fallout it is no Problem to do that.

I did it a severel times in that games.

[Mookeylama]

well what tools might be of help with this? Blender perhaps? and looking in PCEA, assuming that most vanilla anims are in that, i see some "equip.hkx"s like bowequip, shieldequip. but no sword, hammer or axe equip.hkx so maybe the new added bone could be tied to like bowequip. as Ghosu suggested, it might be best to try and tie the 2nb bone to the original default bone. and then when the toon draws off the back, whichever weapon is equipped at the time would show, regardless of which bone it's on. that's assuming you're not using that ini edit bgearedupdisabled=0 or whatever, that lets all favorited weapons show on the body

[Kalten1979]

Blender is a good way, if you want to do that for Oblivion or Fallout.

But there are no working exporters for Skyrim.

 

What you need is a HKX converter into KF, Blender to animate and import/export it and Nifskope to change the import/export files from Fallout to Skyrim or Skyrim to Fallout.

 

It is a lot of handwork, but it should be possible.

Not sure if there is a HKX converter out there.

 

that's assuming you're not using that ini edit bgearedupdisabled=0

I use first person, it makes no sense to see what i am wearing on the back.

[youngloft]

ho to i open up a skyrim race editor????

[Mookeylama]

 

Blender is a good way, if you want to do that for Oblivion or Fallout.

But there are no working exporters for Skyrim.

 

What you need is a HKX converter into KF, Blender to animate and import/export it and Nifskope to change the import/export files from Fallout to Skyrim or Skyrim to Fallout.

 

It is a lot of handwork, but it should be possible.

Not sure if there is a HKX converter out there.

 

that's assuming you're not using that ini edit bgearedupdisabled=0

I use first person, it makes no sense to see what i am wearing on the back.

yeah i play mostly 1st person too, but it's not my back that irks me. it's every time i see an NPC w/ the goofy weapon upside down and a long damn handle sticking 3 feet over his head that would make him bend down to go thru a door lol

[Mookeylama]

ho to i open up a skyrim race editor????

i'm not sure. would a race editor help with this objective?

[ZorquanX]

I just skimmed this forum section by curiosity since I would love to see those damned weapons at the right place too :confused:, but I was wondering how hard it would be to make a different bone for each type of 2h (sword/axe/hammer) and link the animations to each of those type accordingly ?

I think I remember seeing a mod that added lots of bones (including bones for wings etc..) if I find it again I'll add it to the post !

EDIT:
Might be this one... not sure !
XP32 Maximum Skeleton

Edited March 5, 2013 by ZorquanX