Couldn't resist - Installed CSE

[JustChill]

Yeah, that dll is the culprit.

Yet I still don't bother about making BATs to solve that problem, as I already use Oblivion Reloaded anyways, since it has the possibility to recolor the water for specific occasions.

Which I used in Nehrim for making magically contaminated water look like green acid. ^^

https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com/mods/3312/images/46/46-1611276296-51025886.jpeg

Or cyan at the crater:

https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com/mods/3312/images/46/46-1611276286-85643051.jpeg

 

While ENBoost should still work with OR, I still rather use one or the other. :)

[MercerMeka]

Actually I was just thinking about that water color. I just tested Simple ENB to see what effect it had on water and saw no difference. I tested Oblivion Reloaded Lite not long ago and loved the effect it has on water. It is the only "mod" I've found which makes it so that when you enter water your vision changes instantly rather than the vanila effect where you can slowly walk into the water and while being almost submerged you still have "normal" long range vision while looking under water.

I had some problems with ORL which I can't remember but I wish another mod had that water effect.

[JustChill]

Same here.

Being able to change the water color, just by editing the "Water.ini" and give it an own section for a specific WorldSpace or Cell reference is awesome.

 

Although the only thing that bothers me is that OR breaks the lava appearance:

https://www.tesreloaded.com/t99-would-it-possible-to-make-or-using-an-existing-lava-shader

 

:(

[MercerMeka]

I see.

I've only tested OR Lite a little and even that one I think changes too much.

I wonder if I should install one of the many ENB's on offer now that have installed the prerequisite (ENBoost). Do ENB's reduce FPS?

[JustChill]

Yes. ENB's graphic settings are known to have a performance impact.

According to Alenet the developer of OblivionReloaded, OR is 4 times faster than OBGE and I think that means it might also be faster than ENB graphics.

 

It either comes with some sort of memory manager, which SHOULD NOT be used together with ENBoost.

Even though I am not sure if OR's memory management system is as good as ENBoost.

 

BUT, it's possible to use ENB graphics together with OR as both are highly configureable.

You just have to make sure that you turn off any setting that intervenes with a setting from the other addition.

[MercerMeka]

Thanks, that's helpful.

[Pellape]

Cool. I have been thinking about this yesterday when I played Daggerfall. So I thought that we should take a look at this from another angle or perspective as we have only debated what a bat file is doing but not what those 2 files actually are doing and I think we cant get deeper into the batch subject, right now but deeper into the operation systems instead. :wink:

 

Nonsense and crap

Take a deep breath, as now we deep dive into this crap as deep as possible

 

Libraries

What is a dll? It can be anything as far as I know. It is a complied program that you can't execute, used by other programs, filled with functions that many programs can use instead of implementing that code in every single exe file, you make one damn good dll that will be used instead and if you make a damn good dll, ither programmers might wanna use it as well, who knows? Take all window, buttons and graphic stiff as one example, it is pre compiled by Microsoft, so the programmer that makes a new application, do not need to do it. I went on a C-course ones, learning to built my own way of dealing wit windows, every button, top bar, sliders and I do not remember a bloody thing really but I used those functions later when I made real applications.

 

We can use a similar method in our game scripts, making functions that we call from several different scripts, so we do not need to rewrite that code every damn time we need it. This was invented 1969 I guess.

 

So when did libraries come? I am not sure but I guess they came 1969 with Unix and Ansi C which came before C++. C was invented with one purpose and it was Unix at Barkley University, for a text based game and they also made the first network at the same time to be able to play the first mutliplayer game, so they also implemented TCP/IP at the same time and no one could afford a Unix so 1991 when Linus Torvalds was so damn pissed over the prices, he decided he make his own and made Linux.

 

I do not really know C++ as I use the old Ansi C when I code. I do not really understand the C++ specific types but they are object oriented for sure but if I would ever write C again, I might learn it. Ansi C is of course the base so it is compiled in the same way, with the same compiler. C++ is just the extra fancy crap, nothing else, like Notepad++ is a bit better than Notepad and still they produce textfiles. :wink:

 

Libraries in Unix (Linux) are commonly called LIB's

 

OBSE

So when you run Oblivion or CS, you do not run them at all. You execute OBSE which is built in a way that it searches for all bloody libraries there is and start them all. I do not even think the libraries need to be in Data\OBSE\Plugins as it is a bloody vacuum cleaner. So it includes all the dll's but ignore it if it is named anything else.

 

To be more pedagogic and clear in my batches, I could renamed file.dll to file.useless as when we rename it, it gets useless as OBSE does not search nor include something called a dlx, so x is commonly used to do this as we are lazy. So if I knew I was gonna make this public, which I didn't when I made them I would have renamed them:

file.dll
file.useless

I could renamed it to anything as it doesn't matter but as long it is not dll, OBSE will include it if it is named dll, so we hide them for OBSE.

 

Extensions? The signs behind the dot, like txt, exe, dll and so on doesn't have any meaning in a Unix. It got implemented first after 2000 somewhere but is still useless. So if we used Unix instead of windows, well then we could name a file to arnold.swartsenegger and it would run nicely when you executed it. To make it easier for the Unix users, colors where implemented instead, in the more modern shells (cmd types), so different types of files, will have their filename in a different color and of course, seeing the colors where optional. Folders are grey, executables are blue as so on. Unix use flags on all files which it started with 1969, to make it possible to set rights and types at a file, so all executables are flagged x and that makes them blue. the flags are 4, xrwd as far as I know, Execute, readable, writeable, deletable, for user, group, everyone or noone. MS-DOS was simple and stupid when it came if we could compare them, which we can I suppose. No security, no networking -> no nothing. Just cheaper so anyone would have afford it. A Unix system and computer would cost a fortune, like a car or like 3 cars?? Bying a SUN computer, a Workstation 23 years ago, costed 3 times as much as a PC and Solaris, their OS costed a fortune. But 1998-99, they decided to also make even Solaris free, when they saw how good Linux had become.

 

In windows. What types can we execute then? exe, com, bat. Only a exe can use dll's as far as I know. What is a com file?? Well it is mostly a simple textbased compiled programs that came with DOS. The files in MS-DOS and windows did had flags as well, but more simple ones, made for a single user, not networking. Windows in a network, came with Novell and much later Windows NT 3.54 when the NTFS filesystem came, which made it possible to suddenly set more flags on a file for a group or everyone. The flag system in Windows NT is more complicated the ones we use in Unix, but a Unix do not need to be more complicated then it already was 1969. The computer that runs this forum is a Unix computer I guess as anything else is nuts. The Web was built on Unix after all and came 1975 in a military network with TCP/IP called Arpanet. www came later and was developed in Cern so the web was only textbased until the html was invented.

 

Sum up?

I do hope this crap I just wrote makes more sense about what those 2 simple batches are doing? They make the libraries useless and the game faster. :wink:

 

The forum is about Oblivion after all but it all fits together and in this case specially, we must know and understand what is happening in the background. I do hope I have not created more confusement instead? But this is the way this whole crap fits and works together, the crap called a computer. Libraries and functions are heaven sent to us to do what ever we want them to do.

Edited February 12, 2021 by Pellape

[MercerMeka]

Would read again.

Good stuff Pellape. It added to my limited understanding of these things. I never thought of OBSE starting all dll's as libraries to draw from. Neat.

Thanks for the info. I hope someone else also reads and learns.

[Pellape]

I want to add a question as well. What is C++ and Ansi C and what does it look like and is it easy to learn? What can we use it for.

 

Anyone here that makes scripts, can also make Ansi C and C++ as they do look very the same when you look at the scripts, some functions differs of course, only by their names or rather what they do.

 

How I learned C was that I bought a book called. Ansi C for Dummies around 1994, a funny book really. So I read it from page to page, did the examples and had a good time as I did like to be able to make the fastest programs there is, as C is the fastest program language ever made, except Assembler and making CPU instruction by hand, but who in hell wants to do that? I did though 1997, as I wanted to learn how a chip works. What is happening inside it? Well that's another story. I can explain it though, as I solved it 1997. :D It felt great to finally understand this crap, coming out from the fog, into the light. I guess it is the way those feel that found Jesus... :wink:

 

What we can use C++ for is to make dll's really... I have never tried it and maybe I never will as I only made *.exe files with it. I do not own a compiler for Windows anyway... I had one for DOS and Atari and the thing is with C++ is that you can write code and compile it on anything, no matter what it is, as long as it has a compiler and chips and some electrical power and a crystal and the crystal makes it all possible, to let all chips to cooperate, one tick in a time when it vibrates.

 

OBSE

How is OBSE made? With C++ and examples how to make dll's for OBSE are found here

Edited February 12, 2021 by Pellape

[Pellape]

Just one thing... ENBoost crashes CSE if activated.

Nehrim has an ENB baked into its installation but I always disable ENBoost, when I mod the game to ensure I have no issues opening CSE. :smile:

 

Even though there is a mod available, that should prevent the issues, but I rather switch the boost off than using a fix for.

https://www.nexusmods.com/oblivion/mods/47301/

As it is just a temporary problem. As soon as you stop modding and start playing you simply can turn on the boost again.

That is what this thread is all about in the first place. To allow us to use CSE and ENB. Thats why I made the first bat files, that I did not mention or published as the first one only renamed the d3d9.dll

 

MercerMeka That other enb you did mentioned, the v0.181 is for graphics. Thee v0.256 is for stability and RAM handling.

 

When it comes to textures, I do recommend Qarl's ones as I also did follow that WIP he had 2006 and we all drool like maniacs seeing him develop it. So try it, and delete them if you don't like it, with a mod manager to be sure you can delete all his files. Without Qarl, nothing I do today had been possible. He inspired us all to go a step further in the mod making and he shared everything. Sounds like he is dead?? Well I have not seen him in a while... He inspired me to learn 3D as one example. He solved the bloody invalidation crap introduced with Oblivion for us when we fumbled in the darkness, wtf is going on??? We did this in Morrowind, why doesn't it work in Oblivion?

 

The biggest difference is the caves as the original caves are to flat and boring while others made them to much complicated and dark. Qarl's caves are perfect, not to much, not to flat and no impact to performance.

 

Edited February 12, 2021 by Pellape