Allannaa

Okay, first of all, sometimes it's better to make a bunch of little mods, than to make one big world-changing mod. Second, as you work on mods, you'll learn more and more about the game and the CK. For instance, there used to be a command to toggle cell borders in the CK, but it was taken out -- except -- as I discovered last month -- it wasn't taken out, it was just changed. It's the B key. And it also works in Skyrim itself, which is trippy. But I've been on the CK since about day 1 and never knew that till lately, so as I say, the more you mod, the more you learn. As for the tutes that tell you how to change stats and perks and abilities, go ahead and work through a couple of those. They will help you learn how Skyrim works, how the scripting works, how the game mechanics work. Once you know that, you can go on from there. Remember, all skills in Skyrim begin with a "Perk".... which is misleading as all heck because of the "Perk Trees" we see in game, which affect our proficiency at something. However, with that in mind -- and keeping sight of the fact that I'm winging this here, without much coffee in me yet -- I'm thinking it should be possible to add a "Tree Perk" that allows you to pick whilst not actually crouched and sneaking -- a little like the lord-form tree-perks that allow you to feed from any NPC who isn't in combat. The NPC doesn't have to be lying down and you don't have to crouch, you just get a message box that says "Feed" or "Talk to RandomGuy". Seems to me that picking pockets could be something along those lines, except of course your box would say "steal him blind" or "talk to him". I've looked around a little and haven't found any tutes for what you're after, thus far. Who knows, maybe you'll be the first to do this, and you'll be the one to write the tute for the rest of us!

Hey, ini tweaks are at least a place to start, so thanks Steve, I'll look into what you linked. As for zooming the mouse in, thanks, Jason, that helped some, I'm "closer to myself" if that makes sense. I just can't help thinking there's a way to "defeat" the forced third person. I mean, after all, you can take it off furniture -- I know because I have. Sooooo why not off horses, and why not off lord-form!

Okay, I've searched the forums here, and elsewhere, and can't find an answer to my question. When I play Skyrim, I play immersed. That is to say, I play from first person camera, and only rarely do things like use the face cam or something. The forced-third of horseback riding and of lord-form (from DG) drives me NUTS!!!! I'm old, and I don't particularly want to learn how to play a game in "chase camera mode". Why do I want to look at my own (admittedly cute!) backside, either riding a horse or marauding the countryside as a mean scary grey skinned lady? The answer is, I don't want to. I've tried the console command S1ST which allows 1st and 3rd person cameras simultaneously -- or so it says. It doesn't actually; I'm still "chasing" myself or my horse, and frankly I can't play that way. I can't aim, I can't manoever, I can't... play. I've sorted through the CK for two days now. (I got DG for yuletide; prior to that I'd just avoided horses... but with DG, how can you have any fun if you avoid lord-form?!) I can't figure out even where to start as far as changing scripts or anything like that. All I want to do is get rid of "third person chase cam" mode. If anyone has any ideas where to start or how to work this, please! speak up! (Edit -- NO, I'm not asking someone else to write this. I'm asking if anyone can figure out where to start. But hey, if someone has written a mod that ditches the butt-chase-3rd-person cam, by all means say so!)

Zennon, what is it you're trying to do, specifically? If we know more, we can point you in the right direction or help you.

Okay first of all, this has been explained several times before in several places, including the tutorials on my own site, and the links from the non-yootoob tutorial thread I started, but I'll go again. 1) You need the following tools to mod: Skyrim Creation Kit An internet connection to check tutorials and to run Steam, although you can mod in offline mode, obviously. 2) When you start the Creation Kit, YES, there are several "warning" poppers that come up. Click "Yes to All" because they have absolutely nothing to do with reality, they're simply CK errors. 3) In order for someone to write you a step by step tutorial on the subject you asked for, the person would basically have to make your mod for you. Not happening. You can learn. 4) Open the CK. In the File > Data menu, click Skyrim.esm and Update.esm, then click OK. This will start a new plugin for you. 5) When the warning poppers come up, click YES TO ALL and then never worry about them again. 6) Once the new blank plugin is loaded, click File > Save, and then save your ESP with a name you'll remember. 7) Now that you have a plugin made (so that you don't inadvertantly screw up Skyrim itself) you can play around. There are script and code snippets you can use, and there are tutorials that teach how to use Papyrus itself to write NEW scripts or snippets, and how to attatch them to objects, how to make them happen, and so on. 8.) Keep in mind, when people are giving instructions, writing or recording tutorials, and so on, they will use generic terms such as "Testmod" or "MyNewScript" and so on. This is because they're giving examples. You name your own stuff with unique names, but the tutorial author can't know what you're going to use, so that's why you see titles and names like that. 9) Modders are not a bunch of meanies. However, after a while of answering the same questions and linking the same threads and so on, they get a little tired of it. Most of the tutorials out there are easy to follow, whether they're official Bethesda tutes or whether they're community produced tutorials. Again, check the stickies for these forums specifically, and you'll find pinned threads that direct you to a wealth of tutorials. 10) The only way to learn to mod TES games, is to mod TES games. Every one of us started the same way, with a blank screen and an idea. Be grateful there's a Construction Kit and a Creation Kit -- because we didn't always have those things at all, you know. None of us knew what we were doing the first time we started. We all had to learn. As we learned, we wrote down what we found out in the form of tutorials, which are posted all over the internet. 11) The best advice any of us can give you, is to dive in and DO something. It may work. It may not work. If it doesn't work, tinker with it. If it does work, great -- remember what you did so you can reproduce it. If you end up with a SPECIFIC question -- then ask it on the forums. But just saying "I can't mod, someone magically stick the knowledge into my head" -- which is what you seem to be doing here -- isn't going to get you much help. 12) Pick a tutorial -- ANY tutorial, from the official Bethesda Creation Kit site or from here -- and follow it, step by step. It may not have anything to do with what you're ultimately trying to make, BUT it will help you become familiar with the tools we have available to use. Once you've done that, you will be in a better position not only to make mods of your own, but to ask for help when you get stuck. Good luck!

Okay, so what can we do about it? Do we have to check out the "other" forum site, perhaps, and mention the issue on there? I notice the dialogue bug didn't get fixed until it was mentioned over there, by some of the more "public figures" of the mod world.

Yeah and the problem seems to be something that Steam force-updated. It can be found in the Steam > Logs file, at the bottom of it. I personally don't understand any of that stuff... and worse, I don't know how to STOP Steam from doing whatever it is. They could at LEAST have a "yes gimme that" or a "no, go away" option for their craptastic updates, ya know?

I've talked to one other modder who noticed the same issue this week. Since Steam's latest update, it's not possible to run two instances of the Creation Kit, even *after* changing the line in the INI file to allow for this. This makes it really difficult to update an older mod, or to compare Mod A with Mod B to see where I went wrong, and so on. It means, basically, you have to load one plug in, find whatever it was you were changing, fixing, or just curious about... Hope like hell you *remember* what you saw.... then load the second plug in, find whatever it was... etc. Is anyone else having this issue? More importantly, does anyone know how to fix it? Unfortunately, "Stay off line on steam" isn't an option, because as Skyrim itself is updated, I need to see the updates to be sure I'm doing things that stay compatible, and, much as I loathe Steam, I have people that I contact through their instant-message chat service. It was suggested this may have something to do with some multiplayer crap that Steam may be doing, and they've restricted it so people can't "two-box" and thereby gain an "unfair" advantage, but if that's the case, why in the name of Talos's left ... male body part ... would they include things like TOOLS in such a restriction? (And to Bethesda... In all seriousness... Could you please NEVER EVER deal with these people again? I much preferred the "stand alone" of games and modding from Oblivion on back.) Here's hoping someone can fix this!

Go under Location Ref Type, where? On the actor? In one of the packages? or what?

I actually use the bare minimum I can get away with, because the more "stuff" you add to a system, the more things can go nutzoid on you and frustrate you. I consider the following to be the basics: Creation Kit (Get it off Steam), which allows you to make and decorate world spaces, fill your own containers, and create your own character actors. You can even write and edit your scripts in the CK (and you have to compile them within the CK anyway, even if you've made them in some other program). BSAOpt (unpacks BSA files so you can look at textures and meshes among other things)which you get here. Photoshop for painting textures, with nVidia's plugin for making Normal maps; however, PS is not a free program, whereas GIMP is. GIMP has the advantage of already having the "normals" option as part of the program instead of a plugin. Poser, 3DSMax and Maya for modelling; however, like PS, Poser, 3DSMax, and Maya are not free programs; Maya has a hefty price tag, in fact. You can try such programs as GMax, and I know some people are rabid supporters of Blender, which I can't stand. There's also Anim8or, which is an absolutely superb freebie, and which is much easier to use and understand than Blender. (I seriously do not recommend Blender for a beginner (or really for anyone else) because it teaches bad habits that you may try to carry over into real modelling programs, and aside from that, the bulk of the "Blender community" isn't as helpful as it could be sometimes -- if you have Blender questions you're better off asking them here, and not on the program's own website, I notice. But that's just MY opinion as a professional CGI artist, and like most opinions, it's worth what it cost you. *wink) Nifskope which you can get here, for bringing my own models and textures together for use in Skyrim (or even in Fallout). Nifskope is sort of a "decoder ring", and it's a little weird to figure out, but you can learn it in an afternoon. However, keep in mind -- you can mod completely without anything other than the Creation Kit, if you're willing to use only what's already available in Skyrim. Oh, and PS, before anyone flames me over my hatred of Blender -- Don't bother. Some folks like chocolate, and some folks like peanut butter. Same with this!

What do you mean by baking in this context? I also have the usual nVidia plug in for PS, and I'm able to generate normal maps, but not the "rainbowy" MSN maps.

A few things I wonder about. 1) Is there a setting in any of the INI files that can be tweaked to prevent Steam updates (to the CK at least); 2) If something "isn't recommended for modders", then how the heck are *we* supposed to be sure that we have the same quality of gameplay as everyone else, AND THAT our mods are compatible with everything; and 3) How many of us would have to scream at Bethesda, and how loudly would we have to scream, and in what venue would we have to scream, to convince them to sever connections with Steam/Valve, or at least to never, ever make one of the Elder Scrolls series be associated with Steam again, ever, till the world ends?

I wonder if there's a line in the SkyrimEditorPrefs.ini or the SkyrimEditor.ini that you could change, to STOP Steam updates. There probably is and I'm not familiar enough with those two INI files to mess with them. Right, but CK is still looking for that Update.esm, whether you used it or not. You can go into your Steam > ... etc ... Data folder and look for Update.BSA and Update.ESM. When you find them, right-click to bring up a popper, and on that, select Restore Previous Version. You have to do that for both BSA and ESM, and I personally would save a copy of each one first. (You can do that in the same popper.) That's only a temporary fix, though, and as soon as you go online with SteamyPileofHorribleness, it will force an update anyway. That's why I'm wondering if there's something that can be changed in the INI files I mentioned.

First, the above fix will not work. Steam will still update anything you have, as soon as you try to use/play Skyrim or the CK. It thinks "Don't update automatically" just means "Wait till I'm online." But you can check here, for SkyrimUnplugged, which generally does stop updates. Second, there is one very good reason for making a mod dependant on Update.esm -- It generally ensures that the person using your mod doesn't have a pirated copy of Skyrim.

To all those suggesting to reverting to a pre-patch version of the Update.esm, my question is this: If you use an older version, how will that affect the mod you're making? How will you ensure the mod is compatible with the patched and updated game? Won't you just have to go back in and re-do a lot of things, if you go that far? I know it's frustrating to be stopped in your tracks, as someone above me said. Heck, I was on final round of testing, tweaking, and cleaning, and almost ready to release after a summer of learning the changes between Skyrim and Ob, and of learning *gag* papyrus. I'm frustrated too! But I just have this nagging feeling that going backward on the Update master will add problems and not solve them. I do have to agree with another person above me too, though... Bethesda says it lubs us, then they do... this, and steam, and... yeah. If you really loved us, you wouldn't make us jump thru so many hoops! Or... you'd at least not make them flaming hoops of death. Meanies!

Mod Cleaning and "Dirty" Mods Nobody likes a "dirty" mod! We're not talking about nudes or racy language. We're talking about mods with errors in them. There are third-party programs aplenty to “clean” a dirty mod, but I’m not a fan of using any more programs than I absolutely must. Therefore, I prefer to clean a dirty mod with the Creation Kit itself. It's also the easiest way to clean a mod, because the CK is already in place, and has all the information for your game, and your mod. A lot of people think that’s hard, or ineffective, but it’s not. After all, Bethesda itself uses what’s basically the CK to give us our games. First, what’s a dirty mod? It’s a mod that contains changes that the modder didn’t really want. For instance, some tutorials will tell you to “Click on something you like in this cell, and duplicate it, then move it to your cell.” The trouble with that is, it puts a Change Flag on the item even though you did nothing but click “Duplicate”. If you accidentally move something in another cell -- an item, a marker, a navmesh triangle -- then again, you have changed it, and it’s flagged. This is true even if you edit the item and restore it to its exact original value. Basically, any change a modder doesn’t really want, is considered “dirt”. And, of course, people don’t like dirty mods. They don’t want strange little changes, or even big major changes which may make something unusable, or may alter how it looks or acts. Therefore, it’s a good idea to clean your mod not only as you make it, but before you release it. Click the Spoiler button to learn how. The Short Version: Select the “dirty” mod. Check-mark it and set it as Active. Click Details. Sort by Form to find the unwanted change. Highlight the unwanted change, hit Delete on the keyboard, click Yes. Load the cleaned mod, then save the cleaned mod. This is the safest, most accurate way to clean a mod, but remember, you MUST have the plugin itself check-marked and set as Active. Remember also, don’t clean a “cell”, just clean the items IN the cell that were changed.

Ash -- I did exactly what you typed, and, it's not working. OldLady stands there, walks her "patrol" and still says "Yessss?" and "Need something?" and all that -- AND what's worse, hehe, you can re-do the quest!

Earlier today I got a PM from someone who was frustrated with modding in general. The person asked good questions and raised good points, both in his PM to me and in another thread that he'd linked in his message, so I thought I'd address them here. One -- NO, you cannot mod using only the Creation Kit, in spite of what some tutorials imply (or some videos seem to show). You must have, as a bare minimum, the following things: Some way of extracting BSA files, such as BSABrowser You need this to open up the files of Skyrim, because Bethesda Compressed Archive Files are a lot like "zipped" files. They're compressed, and have to be opened up so you can use them. Some sort of modelling program, if you plan to make items yourself, such as Poser, Blender, GMax, or the like. It doesn't matter what format the program uses, so long as it can be converted to a NIF file at some point. All items in Skyrim are NIF, which stands for NetImmerse File. You can create OBJ or 3DS files, but you must, at some point, convert them to NIF format. Some sort of art program, if you plan to texture or retexture items, such as Photoshop or Gimp, AND the DDS plug-in that goes with your program. DDS files are Direct Draw Surface files, and they provide the "look" of your item. Normal maps, which are the "bumps and depth" of your item, are n_.DDS files. These give a visible "texture" to cloth, or wood, or a rock, and so on. Nifskope, which is a program that will allow you to make your unique items usable by the Creation Kit, and obviously, usable by Skyrim. You may also want a program such as NexusModManager, which will make it a bit easier to load and test your mod, and to load all the mods you use. Two -- YES, some modders, from beginner level on up to veteran level, will appear to be "secretive" about their processes. That's just the way it is. Sometimes, they don't remember the workflow for a given process. Sometimes they're worried someone may steal their work. (It does happen.) Sometimes they just feel that they've done a lot of work to make something special, and they don't want someone else to do anything similar, because then their work isn't as special. Sometimes, the things they do as they work are so automatic that they don't realise someone else may not be able to follow the process, or figure out what to do. This doesn't mean you can't ask a given modder to explain what s/he did, and it doesn't mean all modders are big fat meanies. You can also always ask in a forum somehwere, or you can use this site's search feature to look for topics related to your question. Modders aren't superhuman gods or something. They're just ordinary human beings, having fun doing something they enjoy. Not all modders like to write tutorials; some people find it impossible to put down on paper what they've done, and some people just don't find it any fun to write a tutorial, particularly if they have to do so in a language that isn't their native birth language. Three -- A lot of people think they can just jump right into modding, because after all, they jumped right into the game, didn't they? But this isn't the case with modding, and it actually wasn't the case with the game. You had to learn where your computer's Power On switch was, didn't you? You had to learn how to download or install a game, didn't you? You had to learn what keyboard, mouse, or controller buttons did things in the game, didn't you? You did. But the thing is, you've been turning on your computer, installing programs, and typing or playing games for so long, that you don't think about doing any of those things. You just do them. Well, modding is the same way. You have to learn the steps. You have to learn how to use the programs involved in modding. You even have to learn a little bit about scripting, with Skyrim, and while I'll be the first to admit that scripting was a *very* hard thing for me to figure out, I do understand that knowing the basics did make things much easier, and using well-written tutorials (such as Sjogga's, which you will find in this thread) goes a long way to understanding the basics. You don't have to have a degree in computer science to understand and be able to use a very few basic things. But you *must* learn the basic processes of mod-making, before you can make a mod. A given tute or vid may make it appear simple, and in fact, it is fairly simple -- IF you have learned to use the tools you need. Four -- YES, some people don't mind one bit if you mod their mod, so to speak, provided you ask them, and provided you credit them if you release the mod to the community. They're pleased and proud that you liked their stuff enough to want to build on it. But by the same token, some people don't want you to release a mod built on theirs, because they feel possessive of their work. There is absolutely nothing wrong with either viewpoint. But you DO have to respect the wishes of the person who wrote the mod you are changing. If they don't want you to release something based on their work, then don't do it. It won't be worth the hassle, the forum flames, and in some cases, the legal action. Five -- Sometimes a given modder will be more than happy to do something for you, such as provide a mesh, a texture, a code snippet, or even a script. If someone does take the time to help you in this way, be sure you thank them; after all, they did do some work for you. And, there's no harm in asking the person how they did whatever it was. Maybe their answer will help you learn to do something similar. Six -- If you choose to write a tutorial yourself, remember, not everyone will know what you know. Assume your reader knows *nothing* other than the basic facts that Skyrim exists and can be modded. Explain things, with screenshots if needed, in a way that someone who just downloaded the above programs can understand. There's no such thing as too much "hand holding" in a tutorial. You can always add a note to the effect of "If you already know how to do this, skip to the next step." but don't ever assume your reader knows everything, or even anything. Along with this, don't get too upset when you read a tutorial that seems to state the obvious, or that teaches a different method than the one you use. Read through it anyway, and take away from it what you can use; discard the bits you can't use or don't need. If you're using a tutorial and run across something in it that doesn't work, or that you don't understand, re-read it, and try it again. If you're still not getting anywhere, ask the author, politely, to explain. If you can't reach the author, then again -- you can use this site's forums to ask questions. Chances are at some point, someone will flame you for asking "such a dumb question", but the fact is, no question is dumb. If you didn't want to know, you wouldn't ask, right? To sum up, yes, modding is a lot of fun. But it's also a lot of work sometimes, and it takes preparation, patience, and a willingness to learn, which in turn means it takes time to read available tutorials, and look for tutorials you can understand and use. Enjoy!

Hey don't just PM them, post them here! As for your specific request, NKato, I will put on my Miss Marple hat today and see what I can find for you. I won't post a link to anything I haven't tried out and vetted to be sure it's suitable for "Modding for Dummies".... After all, a tute we can't understand won't help any of us! Note -- and before anyone tells NKato to "go read the bethesda tutorial" ... Don't. It does not tell you how to do what he asked. All it tells you how to do is turn a Redguard into a different coloured Redguard, it doesn't actually tell you how to create a TRULY new race.

I suppose you have a function above that one that you simply missed to add EndFunction for it...or more exactly you pasted the new code above that EndFunction thous inside the said function (judging the second error) Alas, that would be the simple answer wouldn't it? But it's not. Even if that is the ONLY thing in a "script"... no other lines, no spaces, nothing -- that's the result I unfailingly get. Ash, I'm going to try your method. I don't actually care if Eldah Cronne pops out from in front of the player's very eyes. I mean after all, we all pop out from in front of people all the time when we hit Fast Travel, or "The Poor Man's Teleport"... amirite?

Okay, every time I run anything like this, with an Event or a Function, the compile fails -- mismatched input 'Event' expecting ENDFUNCTION and missing EOF at 'EndFunction' No matter WHAT, any time I use blocks like this, that's the fail I get. Always, no matter what the function or event is, in every case. I've done things like copy a block of code exactly, both by the copy/paste method, and by typing exactly what I see in one window, into another. Those two fails are what I get, no matter what. What on earth is up with that?

oh gawd. I think I need coffee... or... or something. Thanks, Ishara, no clue how I managed to miss it -- TWICE -- as you say!

I've made a very short quest where an NPC asks the player to bring her a few items. In exchange for the help, she gives the player a key to a cottage, and is supposed to "retire" at this point. However, I can't quite figure out how to make her go away (that is, remove her from her cell in Whiterun, or just remove her from the game, either way.) Where can I look to find this info? I've been through the official CK tutes and I didn't see it (though that doesn't mean it's not there.) I'm not really good with writing Papyrus scripts, so specifics would be welcome. I should note, I've been sorting thru the forums here since noon... without being able to find this -- UNLESS -- it's some form of "disable" script? Thanks in advance!

And there we go with a pin -- Thank you, DrGrimm, you are awesome!!

Blender is something I really loathe, and every professional CGI artist I know, does too. Have you tried GMax? It's a freebie of 3ds from what I can tell. I've no idea how to get a mod to sticky this, and frankly, I'm not sure they would anyway. I can see them saying it's not needed since there are so many out there, etc. But I can try to ask, and I know the moderators here are usually pretty helpful people. Which tutorial? Because in all honesty I think *that* may be what a lot of folks are looking for -- Not "how to script" but "how to use existing scripts to do your stuff with". I'm still working on Sjogga's real "How To", though, because I actually want to learn this. But I can't help thinking the "how to use existing" type thing might be a good one to link in here. Is that one you wrote, or found, or just an idea?