Allannaa

Okay I've just brought this object into NifSkope, corrected the texture paths manually, exported it as a NIF, and opened it in GMax (which will only open 3ds or NIF files) In GMax, it once again scrambled every single texture into unreadable garbage. GMax is supposed to work exactly like 3DS (which I no longer have; my child owned it and when she moved out, so did her computer). I'm starting to think this entire issue has to do with GMax. When I bring the OBJ into Daz and give it "fake" jpg textures (Daz won't read DDS), then load the proper textures in NifSkope, I seem to get farthest toward actually having what I want to happen. And, I did download and try Blender this morning -- I will admit, I can't even figure out the commands in the UI, the program completely frustrated me. But, from what you say, it IS safe to remove everything from that Render>Settings, except C:\Oblivion\Data -- If I understood you? And on another note..... I haven't changed one single thing in the ESP I'm using to work on this right now -- but every now and then, stuff I retextured is showing up either as pink or black -- even though I've done NOTHING to the item, and certainly haven't moved the NIF or the DDS and n_dds files. Have I got gremlins on my computer or something?

woops, didn't read your other post as closely as I should have, about how to correct the paths, thank you both for the added info. My problem may actually be with GMax, because apparently even though I've read the tutorial a bazillion times, I'm texturing incorrectly there -- to the point where last time I pulled in my little dresser tray, the file names of the textures were programming gobbledygook symbols, and it wouldn't let me correct them. Needless to say I didn't export that file for use elsewhere. Here is my EXACT path -- from a file that works (I took the upperclassroundrug, retextured it, made the texture into a DDS and n_.DDS using photoshop, brought it into NifScope, and clicked the flower) c:\oblivion\data\textures\sma\textiles\mybluerug.dds That one works, and works perfectly. In the Render > Settings window, I did make sure that the top file is C:\Oblivion\Data\Textures. It won't Auto-detect, so I just didn't worry about that. However, upon first open of NifSkope, it had -- ./textures ./skins/standard ./ I did know from trying something once before, that Oblivion switches MUST be the \ and not the / Is it possible I need to change or delete or move down or something, the folder locations with the / to them? I swear if it wasn't such a fascinating thing to work out, I'd go bats over the mystery here, you know?

Okay, that makes sense from both of you and I appreciate it. But the problem I'm having is, How to correct the path in NifScope? It seems no matter what I do within NifSkope, when I select a texture, it DOES NOT show the file path. At most it will show \sma\texture.dds -- It won't go anywhere near \textures first. What am I doing wrong in NifSkope? I went to NifSkope's site and re-read every tutorial posted, and I still don't understand what I'm goofing up. I'm either going to go crazy soon, or start eating mort flesh again.....

I think the problem is with file paths, so I took a screenie of my NifSkope window to see if this suggests anything to anyone. http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/NSSetting-1.jpg I don't get it.... stock Ob NIFs will load with the correct file paths showing, as the little inset shows. But my NIFs don't. What the heck, you know?

Thanks, Drake, that may indeed be the trouble (and I know you helped with another similar question I had, so double thanks). Tomorrow I'll start fresh and see what happens, thanks both of you!

Angilla -- I'm starting to think the trouble isn't with the texture or the _n.DDS file. Everything is set as your instructions show. Opening and saving a stock Ob texture worked fine, and went into the TESCS just fine. The things I'd made still did not. So I opened NifSkope and loaded the original Oblivion NIF It loaded fine, but the file path names were full path --- that is to say, textures\clutter\upperclass\UpperClassRug02.dds (and so on for the fringe and the fringe_n.dds) Imported into TESCS, it also worked fine, just like it should have. Now, obviously, I didn't want to change every round rug in Oblivion to look like mine, thereby crashing the game and opening Oblivion gates in the real world, so here is what I did: Went into Oblivion > Data > Meshes > Clutter > UpperClass Selected UpperClassRugCircle01.nif Right-click copied UpperClassRugCircle01.nif Pasted UpperClassRugCircle01.nif into "SMA" (It stands for SuperMansionAlla) Right-click Renamed the file in the new locastion as MyRoundRug Next, I went into Photoshop and opened Oblivion\Data\Textures\Clutter\UpperClass\UpperClassRug02.DDS (which was the texture that NifSkope showed associated with the original mesh) Used Photoshop Image > Adjust > Color Balance to change the original rug from shades of red to shades of blue (this is a texturing operation I have performed literally thousands of times for texturing in Poser; I am fairly well known for object textures in that "community", since I use photos, scanned images of my own skin or cloth or other household stuff, and produce so-called photorealistic textures -- in short, I know how to make textures) Clicked File > SaveAs > Oblivion\Data\Textures\SMA\MyRug.dds, selected the defaults just as you had instructed above Clicked Filter > nVidia > NormalMapFilter DE-selected Add Height, DE-selected Using multiple layers, DE-selected Swap RGB Selected Filter Type 4 Sample, minZ0, Scale 5 Selected Animate Light under 3DViewOptions DE-selected Average RGB in the HeightSource (AlphaChannel is greyed out there and unselectable) Selected Max (R,G,B) in the AlternateConversions block Selected Height in the AlphaField ... and clicked OK to save as MyRug_n.DDS to the same filepath above Both the DDS and the _n.DDS appear to have saved correctly, in that, they're both in the same folder. So, this experiment worked fine. But, I have modelled an object, "DressingTableClutter" -- a tray holding a couple of perfume bottles and a hairbrush, but it's modelled as one item with separate textures (You can see it in the screenie above) because this way it is, in fact, ONE thing, and not 10 little things that the collision/havoc would have a blast knocking on the floor every time I walk into that particular room in the game. I won't go into the headaches I endured getting this Tray.OBJ file turned into a NIF .... Suffice to say, I finally DID manage it. But when I load it into NifSkope, the file paths look different. For instance, the original, untouched Ob rug as well as my re-made, re-textured rug, show texture paths as c:\oblivion\data\textures\sma\myrug.dds and myrug_n.dds But -- the dresser set just shows \sma\dressertray.dds It's not showing the total file path as the other files do -- is THIS what's gone wrong, and if so, how on earth am I to fix it? In NifSkpe under View > Render, I do have the correct folders entered; I can post a screen capture of that menu if that would help. The rug works -- even when I exported it as an OBJ, and re-imported it to NifSkope to re-save from OBJ to NIF. I did nothing different from the time I created the finished dresser tray in Poser onward -- but yet all I'm getting is either hot pink, or flat black, as in the screen capture.

I did notice sometimes PS refuses the export so maybe that is part of the problem. As far as the format, where do I find that setting and I can check? On MIPs, I could swear I had it checked in, but will double check. And Alphas is a new one on me, didn't know I needed to check that. I had -- briefly, before a kitten got on the keyboard -- a web page from *somewhere*, a tutorial in which the guy had screen captured the PS screen with the nVidia filters loaded -- and I can't find it now to make sure my settings are his. Thanks for the quick answer, I'll await your next with great anticipation!

I probably need professional help -- and not in a good way. I've either forgotten, or never known, how to distinguish my head from a hole in the ground, but that's secondary. Here's my problem. While Ob has all kinds of fun things one can use in the TESCS to create mods either for personal use or to share, I'd like to make my own stuff. Because of vision problems that I won't go into, it's almost impossible for me to use programs such as GMax or 3DS, Blender, or any other wire-frame based modeller. Therefore, I use and have always used Poser. I don't want to be "talked into" trying these programs; I have them and basically can't use them. I've done a lot of little mods for personal use, but never made my own models or my own textures because frankly, I didn't know it was possible until another modder told me that it was. They've always worked in the past, so, obviously, I do know how to play Ob, and use the TESCS. The tools I have to mod with are as follows: Oblivion itself, with Shivering Isles TESCS Poser 6.0 with plugin to export as 3DS as well as OBJ DazStudio GMax with plugin to import 3DS (but it won't even after I re-installed it, and re-installed the plugin) and plugin for NIF Photoshop 6 (I have 7 but don't like it) with nVidia plugin for creating DDS and n_.DDS NifSkope Now, here's the scenario, if you will.... I can model in Poser and export the file as a 3DS, try to open it in Gmax to make sure it can in fact export as a NIF with proper textures and normals, and -- GMax invariably claims "Improper file format" and refuses to import; I can model in Poser and export the file as OBJ, which GMax will not import I can model in Poser and export the file as OBJ, import it into NifSkope, and export it as a NIF, but none of the textures or normals will load. What I tried most recently is: Model the item in Poser. Export it as an OBJ. Import the OBJ into NifSkope. Export the file as NIF. Import the NIF into GMax, and try to apply textures (and according to GMax instructions, applying the texture also fetches the n_.DDS file, provided that is properly placed in the Oblivion > Data > Textures > MyCrap folder along with the DDS itself). Re-import to NifSkope to check textures and normals... And at that point, the cave collapses. NifSkope shows the textures, and I have the file path set to Oblivion > Data > Textures. It finds them just fine, but there are no n_.DDS files associated with them, even though the n_.DDS files are RIGHT THERE! which makes them appear as either flat black or "invisible" in TESCS, and presumably in Ob, though I haven't actually tested that yet. As an example, I took the "UpperClassRoundRug" and opened the DDS file in Photoshop. I changed the colour of the rug from reds to blues. I saved it as BlueRug.DDS, then clicked the nVidia tools and created a Normals image, which I saved as BlueRug_n.DDS, in the same folder and so on. In the TESCS it's either flat black or hot pink, with no texture at all. This wasn't even a model I made, this was a simple texture change to something existing, and even that didn't work. I tried going into NifSkope and selecting individual textures and that worked just fine, except that once again, within the TESCS, they didn't appear to have the existing n_.DDS files associated with them, so they were either flat black, or hot pink, once I got them into the TESCS. So... What am I doing wrong? Again, I *have* to use Poser or Daz to create the model, but that shouldn't prevent textures and normals from being applied, and I just don't understand how to go about this. If there's yet another program I need to make this work, that's fine, but what? From the tutorials I see on NifSkope, the imported file format should not matter, since NifSkope is quite happy to import an OBJ file and turn it into a NIF for me. Am I doing something wrong in NifSkope, or leaving out a step? What the heck is happening? I'm perfectly willing to get some sort of texture replacer tool, if there's a download for such things. I'm perfectly willing to follow links to tutorials or other threads that deal with this issue. Below is a screen capture; obviously the textures load but the normals do not. The "black" stuff in the top image is with the Brighten Lights command in TESCS turned off; the bottom image shows it with Brighten turned on, in case anyone wondered. http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/lightoff_on.jpg

Okay that last is kind of what I was afraid of, and of course neither Daz nor Poser allows the application of a DDS file as what they refer to as a "bump" map. What I've done thus far is use a placeholder.JPG, then in NifSkope, I did the right-click to choose and used the "flower picker" to add the correct texture. This worked well enough in that with the "Brighten Lights" turned on, you could see the textures in TESCS, but if I understand what you are telling me, EACH tecture needs its OWN *_n.DDS -- am I understanding you? That is to say, "bottle1.DDS" must also have a specific "bottle1_n.DDS", and in the same folder as the texture file...?

I'll start by saying I can't use most of the neato fancy modeling programs because I can't see wireframe due to vision issues, and most of these can't have the UI altered to something I *can* see. So I use Poser and DazStudio for the most part, to create "stuff". Once I've got an OBJ file in either of those programs, I then import that into NifSkope, check to see that textures are correctly assigned, and that the scale of the item "works" in the TESCS. But I'm having trouble with texturing. In the TESCS, as everyone knows, there's a "Brighten Lights" command, which I personally keep turned on until I've finished playing with a cell. Now, with that Brighten Lights on -- Ob's own default NIF items look just fine, if a bit washed out. With it off, they look similar to what they'll look like in game. But here's my problem -- with that Brighten Lights off -- every one of my *own* NIF items appears as flat black. With it on, they show their proper colours and textures. Is this normal, or have I (yet again!) screwed something up? I should mention, when I import the OBJ to NifSkope, I usually touch NOTHING other than the NifSourceTexture line. Usually I load "placeholder.JPG" in Poser or Daz, because those programs are not "DDS friendly". It hasn't been any big deal to go down the line and replace that JPG with the real DDS images -- it's just that, as I say, once in the TESCS, things seem strange with the "all black" for the item, instead of the visible, correct textures. Is it possible that the problem has something to do with "*_n.DDS" files? What I would call the "bump" or "lighting" maps, that is -- do I need to create, and then add these, as well? Does anyone have any ideas? (Top is with Brighten Lights UNSELECTED. Bottom is with Brighten Lights clicked.) http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/lightoff_on.jpg

Oh boy... Okay, now that you point it out, I do see it, so I did it. And, that wasn't the problem, apparently. When I did that and exported it, I still got the blank black planes, they were just reversed. Apparently the issue is the texures somehow. GMax isn't loading certain textures, but the funny thing is, it was doing so last night, perfectly. Changing the normals worked exactly the way you said it would. But I guess that's not the trouble after all.

The untouched Oblivion file opens in the construction set perfectly. It's the import to GMax, then export from GMax where I get this black surface thing. I haven't done a single thing IN GMax -- just imported then immediately exported, no changes were made at all, except of course for giving it a name of its own. I didn't even click the mouse in a viewport window. I'll try the XForm trick also. And here's a shot of my dropdown menu -- I am not seeing what you told me, or am not understanding. http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/dropdown.jpg

Amycus, you are really sweet to go to so much trouble to help, and I appreciate it no end. Here are the screen captures. (Alt Print Screen didn't work, I had to find some stupid snipping tool in Windows itself... what a headache) This is GMax, starting out with the Import screen http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/GM1.jpg This is the imported NIF (Directly from Oblivion>Data>Meshes>Architecture>CastleInterior) http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/GM2.jpg This is the Export screen http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/GM3.jpg This is the TESCS (The Elder Scrolls Construction Set) user interface, specifically the "Render Window", showing the UNTOUCHED file above. http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/TS1.jpg And finally, this is the TESCS Render Window showing the file that was imported/exported with NO changes of any kind, from GMax http://i1091.photobucket.com/albums/i384/AllannaaLassevanta/TS2.jpg You see what I mean? For some reason, GMax refused to recognise the texture for those two specific surfaces. I will try your trick for the Normals. Your explanation certainly looks easy to follow.

Yes, I think we're talking the same thing. The model looks fine except for those black polygons. Okay, how do I do that? And... do you have any idea why it was NOT doing this yesterday, but is doing it suddenly? Did I change some global setting somewhere? I mis-spelled "pretty". It's a bad habit I have. Coming up, if I can do that correctly....

All right, again, I've spent quite a few hours reading to see if this was covered, and if it was, I can't find it. I got tired of having to correct fifty pieces of a room or cave or whatever, every time I wanted to make something, so I downladed GMax, which is a freebie of 3dsmax, and supposedly works exactly the same way (not that I would know, I HATE programs which force a wireframe UI because I can't see them right or something, but anyway). So I thought, I'll import the front and back corners of my room into this neat little program, and export them as one thing. The cool little grid background will enable me to position the two corners perfectly with no oopsie-space or overlap. But first I wanted to be sure GMax would in fact work as advertised. To test this out, I opened GMax, and selected Import, NIF files. I picked at random, Oblivion > Data > Meshes > Architecture > CastleINterior > Castleint1way.nif The file loaded and was all purty on the GMax window stage. I did NOTHING to the file, AT ALL, other than select the pan camera and look at it from multiple angles. I exported it as TestCastle Then I went into TESCS, loaded my AllaHouse plug in as the active file, went to the Object Window, clicked a blank space and selected NEW, called it Testout, loaded "TestCastle.nif" as the mesh, and hit Okay. I should mention, this is exactly the same procedure I use to make any new toy with TESCS and it works every time. However.... Not this time. I pull the object into the working render window and it loads all right.... but without half the textures. The floor textures are gone, one wall texture is gone. It's a flat black plane. I have one of those WTF?? moments, assume I exported wrong, and go back to GMax. I told it to reset the UI, just in case I'd clicked something funny. I closed and re opened it. I re-imported the same file from the Oblivion directory -- NOT the place I saved it to for testing. I re-exported it, allowing the export window to choose defaults... Back into TESCS, I have the same trouble. Well, fine, I thought, screw this... I exported the file as a 3ds, imported it into Poser, looked at it, checked the textures, saw that everything was just fine, exported it as a 3ds, then re-imported it to GMax, changed it to a NIF -- and that was the ONLY CHANGE MADE -- and exported it as a NIF.... Rinse, repeat. In TESCS, and in the test-run game of Ob, those flat black surfaces? Yeah, still flat and black. No texture. Nothing. What in the name of DiBella's art classes have I done wrong here? I'm really really lazy, I don't want to build a castle piece by piece every time I want to make myself a new place to hang out in. I thought it would be so easy to do this, you know? And I should mention -- Last night, I imported Stack3wayBottomRightHall01, Stack4wayBottomHall01, and Stack3wayBottomLeftHall01 -- Lined them up in GMax, exported them, made a model in TESCS, and they worked FINE! No blank black stuff, nothing wrong whatsoever, except I had one piece a bit off. So I deleted that "model" and started over to line them up better -- I should never have done that, I know... but I did... So why was it working last night, but not now? I swear, I'm gonna dive into an Ob Gate and just die from frustration!

RGMage2 -- Oh for goodness sake, that was it! I forgot to put the meshes themselves in THAT folder. Thank you so much, problem solved, I can go back to eating random watermelon now, which tastes much better than mort flesh. You have saved the princess!

If this isn't the right forum for this question, I apologise in advance, and mods, please definitely move it! I've done several little personal mods for Oblivion in the past and they've all worked right, run right, not crashed Ob, and so on. However, now I'm interested in doing a bigger mod. I want to build a house. (I know. Everyone does that, don't they?) I noticed, looking at my Oblivion > Data >Meshes folder from Windows, that one of the mods I use has its own personal little folder, containing all the NIFs for the stuff he made or changed. I opened the TESCS and selected that mod as active, and loaded it up, and hey neato, in the "World Objects, Static, Architecture" tree is this same folder, containing all the stuff, just like in Windows view of the actual contents of my hard drive. I thought that was an absolutely fabulous idea, getting everything in one spot, thereby making sure I don't poop on an existing NIF or DDS texture, change a ref code, or anything else equally fatal/silly. So, I went to Oblivion > Data > Meshes and made a folder called "AllaHouse". So far so good, shows up just fine... I opened the TESCS and loaded AllaHouse.esp. Again, so far, so good, the little house is there, even has the rug on the floor.... I start looking in the Object Window tree for the "AllaHouse" thing.... Tain't there. I had the obvious wtf? moment, and then popped windows explorer, looked at my file system, and yep, Oblivion > Data > Meshes > AllaHouse I closed TESCS, restarted the computer, and.... So, what is it I'm doing wrong, or not doing? After all, Mr_Siika's little folder for Castle Seaview shows up, and when I set Castle Seaview as the active, the little "mr_siika" subcategory is right there.... And the same with every other mod I use and loaded into TESCS to check. If there was a folder on my computer, in the same Oblivion > Data > Meshes path, then it showed in TESCS when I loaded that person's mod as my active file. The only mod with its own little folder, which does NOT show up in the TESCS is mine! Why? Any ideas? I even went to the TESCS Wiki and typed in "Folder" as a search parameter, and hey, it told me to do iggzackly what I had done -- but -- tain't working. Help. Please. Before I start eating mort flesh and going crazy. (edited for spelling because apparently I can't)