White Wall Transparency

[ChinchillaFlats]

So I am having this issue. The two places it usually affects my game are in Fallon's at the kitchen/cafeteria on one of the upper levels and the Yangtze. Both those places are fine at the moment. And I have none of the usual scrapping or placement mods that possibly cause the issue. I am pretty sure the issue is unrelated to any mods.

 

Lately I have been experiencing it at the bottom of the ramp in the Fort Hagen Satellite Array. It's mostly hidden behind a massive stack of shipping crates right before you go into the main part of the interior. And I have noticed it on two different play throughs posted on YouTube.

 

Is anyone else familiar with it being where I am seeing it, and is it fixable? I am torn between trying to fix it and just ignoring it because I have Jezebel and in theory would never have to go back and see the bug. You know, out of sight, out of mind as they say. On the other hand, I know it's there and feel like if it is fixable I got to do something so my game isn't bugged. However it is a Bethesda game, fixing every last bug so my game is perfect is a tall order if it is even possible.

 

I am curious, if a bug makes the game ugly visually, but still entirely playable then do most of you just ignore it an move on? I really want to fix it, but I am also thinking is it worth it and how likely am I to break something else looking for a fix?

Edited May 16, 2021 by ChinchillaFlats

[aurreth]

By "white wall transparency" do you mean the white, texture smearing "void" that you sometimes see if precombines are broken?

 

Ok, in vanilla, with zero mods, there are indeed places where the void is visible. For the most part Bethesda has hidden these places by putting boxes or crates or trash piles over them, but in a very few places they missed because they thought no one would ever be able to see that spot. Behind/beneath stairs or ramps is a typical spot, because in most cases you have to be at the perfect angle to see the mistake.

 

For other areas, yeah, I've had it happen too even when it shouldn't. I have one big wall of Vault 95 that sometimes goes all white void on me, but it might do it on one playthrough, then not do it on another with exactly the same set of mods. No idea what causes it. From other discussions it might be a conflict between room bounds/portals and precombine/previsibility.

 

Can you fix it? Maybe, if you used the CK to regenerate precombines and prevsisibility for the affected cells. Probably more trouble than it's worth for a location you only encounter once, such as Fort Hagen.

[ChinchillaFlats]

By "white wall transparency" do you mean the white, texture smearing "void" that you sometimes see if precombines are broken?

 

Ok, in vanilla, with zero mods, there are indeed places where the void is visible. For the most part Bethesda has hidden these places by putting boxes or crates or trash piles over them, but in a very few places they missed because they thought no one would ever be able to see that spot. Behind/beneath stairs or ramps is a typical spot, because in most cases you have to be at the perfect angle to see the mistake.

 

For other areas, yeah, I've had it happen too even when it shouldn't. I have one big wall of Vault 95 that sometimes goes all white void on me, but it might do it on one playthrough, then not do it on another with exactly the same set of mods. No idea what causes it. From other discussions it might be a conflict between room bounds/portals and precombine/previsibility.

 

Can you fix it? Maybe, if you used the CK to regenerate precombines and prevsisibility for the affected cells. Probably more trouble than it's worth for a location you only encounter once, such as Fort Hagen.

I think it's what I mean. LOL. I say think because I was never really sure what the cause is. But I do know it happens a lot in the Yangtze sub and if it is caused by broken precombines I'll believe you. But yes in the instance I was talking of it does look like Bethesda just piled up the crates to hide it, rather than fix. It's barely visible between the cracks of the crates. I didn't link the video because I wasn't sure of policy, but one of the play through videos I saw it on was Oxhorn's Hagen Array video. I figured if it is on his then that must be at the least a fairly common spot, if it's not on everyone's game.

 

The more trouble than it is worth is what I ultimately decided just because I would rather spend time playing the game and if I don't stop and stare at it, in 2 seconds I am out of the area. And since posting this, I have finished the Mechanist content, so unless I ever find another quest to go in there (don't know if one even exists) I can't see me going back in.

 

OK, of the the top of my head 95 is where you take Cait, if I am remembering my locations correctly? If it is, I have done that one every play through and I have never had the issue (though I have seen others mention it as well). So then I guess it is reasonable to think there are times and locations where it can happen as a one off or temporary glitch because something didn't load right? That seems like that would make it hard to nail down exactly what is happening. I do recall that on my very first play through, one of my walls in the RR HQ was doing that, so that may have been a one off.

 

Thanks for explaining some things to me, I'll sleep better knowing that what is broken in my game isn't necessarily something I did.

[aurreth]

Yeah, 95 is where you take Cait. I'm sure my troubles there are due to my mod list, not a common occurrence.

 

I've never done the Yangtze quest, so no idea if the problem there is universal or caused by something else. The sub is an internal cell, so it's a fairly simple fix if it annoys you and you are willing to open up the CK.

[HeyYou]

Hhhmmm. Interesting.

 

I get the white wall in vault 95 as well, and so far as I know, I don't have any mods that even touch that area...... and it most certainly is NOT a 'hidden' area..... I also see disappearing structures in various interior cells. Fallons department store, Medford hospital on the second floor, etc. I don't think I have any mods affecting those areas either...... Real curious what that is all about.

[aurreth]

The wall next to the steps just past the commissary?

 

Only thing I can figure is that some asset was reused in multiple areas in a way that causes changes to it in, say, Sanctuary to break stuff in other places. That shouldn't be possible, but a lot of FO4 is kind of slapped together where they were rushing to finish it. I use mods for Vaults 111, 75 and 88, so maybe something is bleeding over.

[HeyYou]

Looked at the locations in FO4Edit.... and nothing touches those locations.... They are in Fallout4.esm, and that's it..... How bizarre.

[aurreth]

Looked at the locations in FO4Edit.... and nothing touches those locations.... They are in Fallout4.esm, and that's it..... How bizarre.

 

It might not touch the specific cell, but a location can contain more than one cell. Like the Vault95Location covers the vault and two external cells where the gear door is located (the front of the gear door room is in a different cell from the back of it). While you'd think that wouldn't make a difference, that cells would be isolated from each other to prevent these kinds of issues, it just doesn't work that way.

 

Also, the strangest things can break precombines. Example, there is a blue shipping crate in Parkway Station, in the gear door room for 114, that completely breaks precombines if deleted. Not anything else, just that one box. Now, imagine a mod that removes all blue shipping crates (which I've considered because the damn things are vanilla unscrappable). I remove those, Vault 114 breaks. So you could very well have a mod that alters a vanilla asset that for some stupid reason is included in the precom/previs for a cell, and suddenly you get white void. It isn't supposed to, but the whole system is that fragile, especially in cells that have a mix of precombines and room boundary/portal.

 

What it works out to is that precombine/previs is an interesting optimization solution, but it is so poorly and unevenly implemented that mods can have unintended consequences even if they aren't in the same area.

[HeyYou]

 

Looked at the locations in FO4Edit.... and nothing touches those locations.... They are in Fallout4.esm, and that's it..... How bizarre.

 

It might not touch the specific cell, but a location can contain more than one cell. Like the Vault95Location covers the vault and two external cells where the gear door is located (the front of the gear door room is in a different cell from the back of it). While you'd think that wouldn't make a difference, that cells would be isolated from each other to prevent these kinds of issues, it just doesn't work that way.

 

Also, the strangest things can break precombines. Example, there is a blue shipping crate in Parkway Station, in the gear door room for 114, that completely breaks precombines if deleted. Not anything else, just that one box. Now, imagine a mod that removes all blue shipping crates (which I've considered because the damn things are vanilla unscrappable). I remove those, Vault 114 breaks. So you could very well have a mod that alters a vanilla asset that for some stupid reason is included in the precom/previs for a cell, and suddenly you get white void. It isn't supposed to, but the whole system is that fragile, especially in cells that have a mix of precombines and room boundary/portal.

 

What it works out to is that precombine/previs is an interesting optimization solution, but it is so poorly and unevenly implemented that mods can have unintended consequences even if they aren't in the same area.

 

Now that makes a twisted sort of sense...... Are you aware of any way to solve this particular issue? I have been dealing with it for quite some time. :) I just try and avoid looking in that direction. :D

[aurreth]

 

 

Looked at the locations in FO4Edit.... and nothing touches those locations.... They are in Fallout4.esm, and that's it..... How bizarre.

 

It might not touch the specific cell, but a location can contain more than one cell. Like the Vault95Location covers the vault and two external cells where the gear door is located (the front of the gear door room is in a different cell from the back of it). While you'd think that wouldn't make a difference, that cells would be isolated from each other to prevent these kinds of issues, it just doesn't work that way.

 

Also, the strangest things can break precombines. Example, there is a blue shipping crate in Parkway Station, in the gear door room for 114, that completely breaks precombines if deleted. Not anything else, just that one box. Now, imagine a mod that removes all blue shipping crates (which I've considered because the damn things are vanilla unscrappable). I remove those, Vault 114 breaks. So you could very well have a mod that alters a vanilla asset that for some stupid reason is included in the precom/previs for a cell, and suddenly you get white void. It isn't supposed to, but the whole system is that fragile, especially in cells that have a mix of precombines and room boundary/portal.

 

What it works out to is that precombine/previs is an interesting optimization solution, but it is so poorly and unevenly implemented that mods can have unintended consequences even if they aren't in the same area.

 

Now that makes a twisted sort of sense...... Are you aware of any way to solve this particular issue? I have been dealing with it for quite some time. :smile: I just try and avoid looking in that direction. :D

 

 

lol What I do is try to avoid looking in that direction :)