Death Penalty

[Albareth]

Your opinions? This topic has a very deep moral/religious meaning for all of us (I assume), so let's just say there is no "wrong" answer, just opinions.

 

Personally, I support it. I'll post more later but for now I gotta go chainpost two more debate topics or theta will do something mean to me. ;)

 

(Hello to those of you I don't know from MWC forums)

[Mojlnir]

The death penalty, as it stands in the US today, is an antiquated and essentially useless statute. I say this because it is completely ineffectual and often times we end up executing the wrong person. It is also biased towards minorities and the poor, with the majority of death row inmates being poor African American males. When examining death penalty cases you will find a surprising number of instances where individuals were sentenced on the accounts of one eyewitness or several less than credible witnesses. Poor individuals are not able to afford competent attorneys and those appointed by the state are usually of poor caliber or don't care enough to make a serious effort. DNA evidence, while offering the possibility of more just convictions, has not prevented innocent people from going to their deaths. Another point of contention is the fact that we execute individuals who are either mentally handicapped, sick or insane.

That said, the death penalty does not significantly reduce the rates of serious criminal offenses either. Given the protracted appeals process, which is sometimes beneficial though not always, can keep an individual on death row (at tax payer expense) for the rest of his/her natural life. I do not mean to claim that prison life, or life on death row, is particularly great but they are draining public coffers. The death penalty will also not lighten the overload currently felt by the federal prison system. The vast majority (approx. 2/3) of people currently in prison are there for minor drug offenses that are handled under the counter-productive "three strikes you're out" policy. A shift in the so-called "war on drugs" from interdiction to education, prevention, and treatment would significantly lower prison populations.

I'll stop here for now, having completly bored everyone reading this thread. :rolleyes:

[Switch]

i dont support it as i dont believe in taking an eye for an eye. wots the point in killing someone for killing someone else? its just sinking as low as the criminal who did the killing in the first place. just throw em in jail for the rest of their lives.

 

no matter what the circumstances, killing someone against their will is STILL murder. not justice.

[Eltiraaz]

It's no different from Euthanasia, mercy-killings, and abortions. When you claim the life of another because of their condition they are in, or whether they're wanted, or what they've done, you are playing God. To compare your power with His is a sin, and its completey disgusting that something like this ever even originated.

[ThetaOrionis01]

Eltiraaz, IMO there's a HUGE difference between the death penalty and euthanasia - free will, and the wishes of the person involved.

 

I am undecided about the death penalty. On the one hand, I think there are crimes so inhumane that the perpetrators should be removed from the planet. Crimes so horrendous that nobody should be forced to share a planet with the perpetrators. War crimes and genocide, for instance. Executing such people is a kind of catharsis - the rest of the human race distancing themselves from such criminals, making the point that such behaviour can't and won't be tolerated.

 

On the other hand, I am aware of the facts Mjolnir has posted - the number of innocents being executed, the inhumanity of keeping people on death row for so long. So I don't think the death penalty should be used as part of the normal criminal justice system.

[Mojlnir]

Even though I personally feel that the death penalty is a flawed form of justice I must agree with you Theta. There are crimes in which the offender is deserving of nothing less. Genocide, war crimes, and crimes of a truly hienous nature. These must be delt with, however the system for dealing with them must be revised.

[thanateros]

not only do i find the death penalty morally wrong and an abuse of power but after having read some rather depressing articles you'll find that in the US it costs just as much to execute someone (and in a minority of cases more) as it is to keep someone in jail.

 

the problem over here is that society is a breeding ground for conditional crimes. by this i mean certain crimes are expected to be carried out by certain socioeconomic classes (I personally do not believe this but it's what is a commonly held belief over here).

 

mostly, what i can't stand is the harsh penalties for simple drug possession, yes it IS illegal, but for someone who ends up spending 6 years of their life in jail for possessing an ounce of marrijuana. This kind of criminal justice system seems to me designed to keep the poor down and hand out 'get out of jail free' cards to those who have the funds capabable of buying their way off of death row.

 

before the death penalty can be resolved first american society and justice systems needs to reform. we are a country without morals or respect for our fellow man (or woman) and without dignity we go about our lives unwilling to change or at least understand what is wrong with our culture that we no longer give descent respect for human beings that are deserving of it.

[Beaten by an Ugly Stick]

It is hypocracy(sp?) Money is our true enemy. Greed . why? do you relize the source of a problem? 99% of most problems today start with money, but one must ask and plan what WOULD a better world be like...?

[Marxist ßastard]

As I've pointed out in another thread, it would have less religion and more talking robots...

[ASCLEPUS]

Very well, I shall add my opinion. I work in the criminal justice system and I have seen a great many changes in that system over the years. I support the death penalty and if I read arightly, no one else on this forum does. I will begin by posing a question: How would you do it differently?

 

It has been stated that an eye for an eye is wrong. Perhaps. For those of you with religious convictions on this subject, I would invite you to look at how the matter of a rebellious son is handled in the book of Deutoronomy Chap 21 vers 18-21. I would also invit to look at Proverbs Chap 13 vers 24 and apply it to society. For those of you without religious convictions, I shall pose this question you: How would YOU maintain order in society where it is no more a penalty to murder or rape than it is to steal or deal in drugs? Believe me, it is no great thing for someone to go to prison. Every need is met and every comfort given. Any medical problems are taken care of and generally, it is a happy, worry free life. If you don't believe that, then I personally will be more than happy to take you on a guided tour.

 

You have stated that it (the Death Penalty) is targeted against minorities, the poor and people of a certain social station. I don't think so. The Justice system is designed to be equal. It does not always work that way, but that would be because of a certain amount of innate corruption in said system (imagine that, corruption in government) or through the intervention of certain individuals or groups. Different lawyers have varying levels of ability. If you were a lawyer and knew you could make a lucrative practice at civil or criminal law, would you trade it all in just to work for the government as a public defender? I don't think so. Most governments are dredging the bottom of the barrel and are thankful to get what they can.

 

It has been said that mistakes are often made in executions in that an innocent individual is put to death. I strongly suggest that you chaeck your figures on that, because it is a rarity. I know of no individual who were cleared of charges posthumously in my state within the last twenty years. What you see is an overinflation of the figures because of supposed claims of innocence by the accused. The times when mistakes are made are the ones that are publicized nationally. Seldom is a case publicized in which someone is rightfully accused and executed. While I'm on this subject, let me mention this. I deal with convicted felons EVERY DAY who tell that they didn't do the crime they were accused of, but at least ninety percent tell me they had done something as bad or worse that they weren't charged with. Every prisoner has a sad story, but how can ALL of them be innocent?

 

Thanateros, you are quite correct when you say that there must be reform, and that at the heart of the matter is a lack of respect for our fellow man. Now as to the amount of money it takes to execute someone. It actually costs about one thousand dollars to perform an execution, including a last meal. Where the cost comes into to play is the excessive number of appeals granted to cthe condemned. However, if I were going to sentence someone to die, I do not believe I could rest well at night if I took away EVEN ONE of those appeals. That is why it is such a rarity to see mistakes in the conveyence of death penalties. Many courts overturn a death sentence and makes it into one of life imprisonment without the possibility of parole. The normal costs associated with the upkeep of prisoners ON AVERAGE is roughly 40,000 to 45,000 dollars a year. That's quite a drain on society wouldn't you agree?

 

Now to the meat of the matter. The basic flaw in our criminal justice system is that of a lack of accountability. No inmate is held truly accountable for his/her actions while in prison. Check the recitivism rate and see for yourself. The system lends itself to the creation of more dangerous criminals. And all too many times, the criminals themselves are protected by their so called 'rights'. For example, a man enterd his house (true story here, folks) only to find a burglar within. The burglar shot at the man with his own (House Owner's) weapon. The man returned fire and wounded the burglar. The burglar gave up and the owner called the police. The burglar was arrested and convicted of the crime. The burglar then sued the home owner for damages incurred when he was wounded in the fight. Where is the justice in that?

 

I will leave you with this. Before you pass a quick judgement on the death penalty, I would ask you to consider how it would be if it were your wife or sister or mother who was brutally raped and murdered. How would you feel if your Father, husband or brother was gunned down in the streets? For those of you who have gone through these things, I deeply apologize for bringing them back to your memory. For those of you who have not, consider how you would feel if these terrible things were touch upon the people you know and love. If you don't believe it would change your perceptions at all, think again.