high level npcs and their bullet spongy nature

[TheBlob2]

why are high level npcs harder to kill? do they have really good AI? like they are good at avoiding getting hit? or do they induce fear and mess up the AI of the enemy npcs? do they make the player and opposing npcs panic? are enemy npcs less likely to shoot accurately out of fear? are they so good at combat that they can kill most enemies nearby easily and quickly before they can get hit? do they take advantage of their surroundings better?

 

no, they just have higher hp, and in the end thats why they're harder to kill. which is not true to reality. I'm tired of these bullet spongy npcs, is there a way to make high level npcs harder to kill without giving them more hp or dt/dr? like when an npc is harder to kill, I want a genuine reason besides muh gamplay balnce.

[M48A5]

 

which is not true to reality.

 

You are looking for realism in a game that has oversized geckos, mutated humans, overgrown lizards and various other mutated fauna? It is a game.

[TheBlob2]

but even inside the rules and the logic of the fallout canon, it still doesnt make sense.

[bioshards]

You are looking for realism in a game that has oversized geckos, mutated humans, overgrown lizards and various other mutated fauna? It is a game.

 

what about all those realism mods?

Edited January 28, 2015 by bioshards

[Deleted4363562User]

 

You are looking for realism in a game that has oversized geckos, mutated humans, overgrown lizards and various other mutated fauna? It is a game.

 

what about all those realism mods?

 

 

M48a5 has a point in that we shouldn't be overly critical of a game whose basic premises are utterly ridiculous when analyzed with even the most passing scrutiny...however...that being said... I tend to align myself with the OP's perspective. I hate bullet sponges and always jump on any chance to make fights quick and deadly. It's really unsatisfying to shoot things in the head and have them keep on trucking. Sure, it is just a game, but dissatisfaction with vanilla parameters is what makes the Nexus go round.

[TheBlob2]

I hate bullet sponges and always jump on any chance to make fights quick and deadly. It's really unsatisfying to shoot things in the head and have them keep on trucking. Sure, it is just a game, but dissatisfaction with vanilla parameters is what makes the Nexus go round.

 

thats why i was thinking about giving all npcs the amount of health they SHOULD have, as a opposed to what the game balance demands they need. and to compensate for their decreased health, they now need realistic ways of avoiding death that isnt bullet spongy or unrealistic

 

1-good defensive and tactical AI that takes cover and runs when necessary. perseus enemies when their health is low or when they're reloading or generally when they're vulnerable. are harder to hit because they're constantly moving,

2-enemy npcs/player have their stats reduced while in combat with them, making them more vulnerable

3-extremely accurate or proficient with their weapon of choice

4-can run fast enough to avoid death when in a sticky situation

5-have fellow faction members nearby to defend them

6-can get critical hits more often

7-have generally better equipment than most other npcs at that stage of the game (like having an end game weapon while their adversaries/lower level allies are using mid game weapons)

8-have special combat abilities that allow them to disarm/stun their targets, call in reinforcements from far away or other cells, can regenerate their health much faster than other npcs outside of combat, and get powerful stat buffs at random

 

 

obviously not ALL of these can apply to the same character. we cant apply any of these to an npc where it wouldnt make sense for that npc. like adding smart defensive combat ai to an npc that has an agressive cocky personality for example

Edited January 28, 2015 by TheBlob2

[2much4l1]

You can mod your game to address almost all of your concerns. Search difficulty in the mods section and you'll find mods that will adjust yours and enemy health and damage. I don't know what mod it is, but most of my enemies runaway when they start losing the fight. Some mods insert elite enemies that can get crits. For example I recently kept getting one shotted when entering this area. After several deaths I stayed in good cover while my companions did most of the work. Upon searching the bodies I found a (I think she was called) "Legendary Jackal sniper" with a sniper rifle.

[bioshards]

3-extremely accurate or proficient with their weapon of choice

5-have fellow faction members nearby to defend them

7-have generally better equipment than most other npcs at that stage of the game (like having an end game weapon while their adversaries/lower level allies are using mid game weapons)

8-have special combat abilities that allow them to disarm/stun their targets.

 

about half the things you've mentioned are already in the game, but i guess you mean adding them to npcs that these dont already apply to or enhancing them if they're already there to compensate for decreased health, which would make sense.

 

but some of these would be require quite a bit of work to get working correctly

 

 

2-enemy npcs/player have their stats reduced while in combat with them, making them more vulnerable

8-have special combat abilities that allow them to disarm/stun their targets, call in reinforcements from far away or other cells, can regenerate their health much faster than other npcs outside of combat, and get powerful stat buffs at random

 

i think npcs decreasing their opponent's stats in combat would be really great to see but i dont know of any way for a spell script to check if an npc is hostile, as for the combat abilities.... those may be out of our area of expertise.

[griever7x]

As it's been said, mods can fix most of your concerns.

http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/35335/?

This mod affects damage in a rather unconventional way. Rather than bumping up every weapon's damage, or the overall damage multiplier for everything, it edits the damage dealt to each bodypart to be more realistic: shots to the head and chest to a human will do much more damage, but arms and legs have been left untouched. Every npc in the official game bar dlc-added ones will be affected ( you can get a separate file that addresses the few ones added by dlcs as well ), each one with different weaknesses, and it's a fairly compatible mod: the only incompatibility I encountered is with EVE, as they both edit explosions in some way or another; in this case, a quick and easy edit with FNVedit will fix it.

Project Nevada also has an option to lower or even remove the endurance and level health bonuses, for player and/or npc, removing the bullet sponge issue entirely.

As for the AI, I highly recommend these mods:

http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/51777/? Makes stealth based gameplay more realistic by reducing the vision range of npcs, but making you much more detectable even farther away when inside their range of vision. I think it also modifies 'reaction' times of npcs to your presence.

http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/40593/? It doesn't really do much for the npcs, but it does add a few mechanics for the player that play well with the mod above: by pointing your gun at an enemy that has not detected you, you can make them surrender and then tie them up and loot them. It also adds a whistle mechanic to create a diversion, and narcotics you can inject to render them unconscious.

Oddly, it makes you able to play as a ghoul, but I think if there are any conflicts or you don't want that particular feature you can just remove it using FNVedit.

The mod is old though, so if you are concerned about that there is an alternative: http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/57446/? however it edits duct tape, stimpak, super stimpak and med-x, so it may conflict with other mods.

http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/39058/? This one improves the combat AI tenfold, in my opinion.

Edited January 28, 2015 by griever7x

[TheBlob2]

I've been talking to different people trying to come up with abilities that can make npcs harder to kill without giving them more hp:

second wind: after you kill an npc and they drop to the ground, 5-10 seconds later if their head is still intact. they will get back up again with little hp left. the amount of hp they get back is determined by their level, but it can never go higher than 20% of their max health

calling in reinforcements: during combat with a moderately high ranking member of a faction, more members of their faction may arrive within a few seconds after they have started fleeing. and with increasing rank, the bigger the reinforments will be, and the higher their level. however the reinforcements themselves cannot call for reinforcements because that would be gamebreaking

junkie: have the ability to use chems in their inventory, and all of them will have the same affect as they do on the player (regen health for stims, increased health and strength for buffout, etc) . but some chems can alter that npcs AI like psycho which will make them suicidal and attack you when otherwise they would have fled, or jet which will make their behavior unpredictable, steady which will make them less agressive but more careful, etc

higher level npcs will have a higher quantity and quality of chems at their disposal.

can't touch dis 1: the first time they are hit in combat, if it is not critical, it will register as having missed

can't touch dis 2: during combat for short bursts of time, all hits that are not critical will register as having missed

can't touch dis 3: always, in and out of combat, all non-crits will always register as having missed

leadership: members of enemy factions that are lower level than they are will have their stats and confidence decreased, making them more likely to miss their shots, aswell as flee. the opposite for members of the same faction. so having 2 people of equivalent rank on either side of a conflict will cancel out the effect until the first one dies, then all their allies' confidence and stats will go back down to their original value or maybe even lower, making them more likely to flee once their leader is snuffed. as their rank in whichever faction they belong to increases, so will their leadership radius and the confidence and stat bonuses they will give, so the higher the rank the more like it is for their allies to flee once they die.

escape plan: when they flee and as soon as they leave the cell or are far away enough from the any actors, they will disappear forever

if any of you have suggestions about any more abilities or about the existing ones, please feel free to tell me

Edited January 30, 2015 by TheBlob2