Nexus permissions rules (Compilation Patch)

[Irx]

Sooooo, if I make a mod but am not willing to release it to others under the terms of the GPL (wonder which specific version you mean) I shouldn't, or shouldn't be allowed to, release it at all?

Imo, better not release anything at all and let it be made by people who actually wish to contribute to the community - not pollute it in the name of childish ego problems. Such "modders" usually produce junk mods like "your uber gun" or "original house in balmora" anyway, but somehow their interests are still enforced by default here over everyone else, it seems.

[gsmanners]

My take on this issue is that big patch mods are really intensive in the effort it takes to produce them. I have plenty enough skill myself to make one, but there's no way I'll take on the project. It's just way too much work. It isn't enough to merely merge a bunch of other mods together. You have to make sure the merge will work, so you have to deal with conflicts. You also have to deal with junk that modders leave in and sometimes make improvements of your own. Then you have to do all kinds of crazy testing. The act of building a compilation is a copyrightable work of art in itself. Add to this the fact that compilations draw a lot of attention, and it quickly becomes a matter of ego. Everyone involved really needs to take a step back and relax and think for a while about all this.

[PurplePigeon]

IMO, mods should be GPL.

GPL? Wow. All Nexus sites host mods for proprietary games made with proprietary programs, with some limitations attached to them (non-commercial usage only, for example). If they were released under GPL, it would be a very strange legal case. For example, one clause in the GPL states that every derivative work must be compilable with free/libre toolchain, which is clearly not the case.

 

Or did you mean just "free for everyone to redistribute and modify"?

 

 

On topic, well, the problem is that the patch was indeed called a "compilation patch", the author listed all authors whose work was used as original authors of those patches (as opposed to, say, "finders of these bugs" or "sources of inspiration") and then quite clearly stated that he didn't get a permission. This seems like asking for trouble.

 

instead Zenball releases the exact same file only he calls it Zenball's Unofficial Patch, and simply turns the "credits" section in the existing readme into a list of which mods not to use alongside his mod "because ZUP already includes those fixes".

Well, I think it would be a good solution, why not? If he had recreated every non-trivial script and asset himself, it would technically be his own mod. Although, of course, I cannot predict how moderators would react.

[durklives]

Well, I think it would be a good solution, why not? If he had recreated every non-trivial script and asset himself, it would technically be his own mod. Although, of course, I cannot predict how moderators would react.

 

So in another words Zenball screwed up by A) calling it a community compilation instead of "ZENBALL'S SUPER AMAZIN BUG FIXAN UBER PATCH" and B) even _trying_ to give the original "authors" their due credit.

 

What a funny system we have here where taking credit for other's people work and saying you did it all would be perfectly fine since it would be impossible for the moderators to prove otherwise through an investigation.

[Earthbound_X]

That's kinda depressing how that works.

[durklives]

That's kinda depressing how that works.

 

Well we don't want to deprive anyone of the glory of being a "finder of bugs".

[PurplePigeon]

What a funny system we have here where taking credit for other's people work and saying you did it all would be perfectly fine since it would be impossible for the moderators to prove otherwise through an investigation.

No, no, no. All work would be completely Zenball's. Credit would go to those original authors as finders of those bugs and ways to fix them. However, since all of these fixes would be reimplemented by Zenball and this implementation would be original, this mod would be completely his own work. It would not be simply a compilation of someone else's patches.

 

What any community would not benefit from is increased bureaucracy. And this is what will happen if these ideas about "non-protected" mods, fixes that cannot be copyrighted etc. is implemented. Because every such compilation will then cause a flame where people will discuss whether or not the fixes are trivial, whether or not modders' rights apply in this particular case et cetera.

[durklives]

What a funny system we have here where taking credit for other's people work and saying you did it all would be perfectly fine since it would be impossible for the moderators to prove otherwise through an investigation.

No, no, no. All work would be completely Zenball's. Credit would go to those original authors as finders of those bugs and ways to fix them. However, since all of these fixes would be reimplemented by Zenball and this implementation would be original, this mod would be completely his own work. It would not be simply a compilation of someone else's patches.

 

What any community would not benefit from is increased bureaucracy. And this is what will happen if these ideas about "non-protected" mods, fixes that cannot be copyrighted etc. is implemented. Because every such compilation will then cause a flame where people will discuss whether or not the fixes are trivial, whether or not modders' rights apply in this particular case et cetera.

 

Okay, but for bugs like Veronica's not leveling up bug, how would know that had been originally created and not just "copied" being that there is only one way of fixing it? Or the NCR Patrol Armor bug. Or the dozens of other bugs fixed in that patch.

 

How would anyone know it had been created originally since even in the earlier uploaded fix mods there is no mark of authenticity?

[PurplePigeon]

Okay, but for bugs like Veronica's not leveling up bug, how would know that had been originally created and not just "copied" being that there is only one way of fixing it? Or the NCR Patrol Armor bug. Or the dozens of other bugs fixed in that patch.

 

How would anyone know it had been created originally since even in the earlier uploaded fix mods there is no mark of authenticity?

Firstly, authors of these particular fixes allow reusing and redistributing them without permission if credit is given to them. So here one could just give them proper credit and use their work.

 

Secondly, trivial fixes can hardly be anyone's property. If a fix consists of only several changed numbers and its author does not allow anyone to use it, then one could simply recreate this change, maybe even without credit. Because if someone tries to enforce their rights on something so trivial, they hardly deserve any respect, since their actions harm the community, not help it.

 

Of course, not every mod that only changes some values is trivial. Some balance overhaul may work the same way but require extensive calculations and effort. Such mods bear a significant mark of originality, since the combination of changes is quite original. But this is not the case.

[Zenball]

Ok - I don't know if anyone has actually read any of my ideas, since not a single person has fed back on them, it seems not. I thought the ideas were quite sensible as well, but it seems impossible to have a sensible discussion about anything on this topic.

 

A lot of what is being said here strikes me as totally ridiculous.

 

Good luck in getting sorted out on this issue.